Son (12) is causing trouble as part of a gang and messing with knifes

[Alyson1991]

My son turns 12 tomorrow (18th of may). His behaviour for over a month or so has been horrendous! Lying, manipulating, sneaking out when grounded, searching for his device when it’s been taken off him etc. then last week he had friends at home, thought his dad and I were both at work and his dad caught him handling a knife (big kitchen knife) in front of his friends in our house. Every consequence is ignored or broken, we’ve taken away pocket money, limited his devices, grounded him, gave him extra chores, asked the school to discuss his behaviour with him, cancelled days out and outings but nothing seems to be getting through to him. Yesterday he snuck out whilst grounded and I found out him and 4 of his friends had knocked one of their other ‘friends’ to the ground and had punched and kicked him as a gang (5 against 1!). He also lied at first and said he wasn’t there until I caught him out. I have made him apologise to the boy and his family, today I have taken away his devices and grounded him. However we have a couple of nights in a cabin booked for tomorrow for his birthday and I don’t feel he should go. I think he should get 1 present, a small cupcake or something and a half decent dinner at home but I feel that sound be it because he needs a short sharp shock and needs to take it seriously. What are everyone’s thoughts? Do I keep him at home? If so how do I handle his bday without ignoring it but also without making it too special as I think he needs a real fright. All advice appreciated, an overwhelmed and out of her depth mother x

Sounds like he needs counseling/some sort of intervention from professionals. The attack of 5 against 1 is a police matter.

The best you can do tomorrow is go to the cabin to figure out what's going on with him.

Offering you a slightly different response here as I have done with work with young boys who are involved in gangs.

It is very tempting to punish and put in place punitive measures. However, behaviour is a form of communication. What is going on in his life, he might have self-esteem issues, he might be being manipulated into being in a gang. Is there any problems at home do you spend one-to-one time with him? Have you asked him how he feels about life in general?

What's going on at school? You might find that is an underlying problem and Hugh tackle that then you will solve a lot. Could you maybe try therapy?

I agree don't cancel. You need to pull him close not alienate him.
I think moving is a good plan as is volunteering. Ideally he could do with spending some time with some 'hard' men who've turned their lives around. Have a look at any churches or church charities near you, your son needs to hear from people who've hit rock bottom. He's gone a certain way but not too far, you can pull him back. But if you punish him and act like you hate him you will drive him further away. Hes 12, he won't get hate the sin, love the dinner. He just needs to know he matters to you because for certain you do matter to him.

Oh and don't be surprised op if it ends up all over social media and the police get hold of it. The little shits that attacked my son filmed it, kids that do this sort of thing aren't the brightest

Get a safe for your knives . If you haven't got a safe get a hasp and staple to put on a cupboard so you can lock away any would be weapons .

Maybe a good way to reconnect with your son .

I'd go to the police about the assault. It'll be a sharp shock for him and perhaps scare him into pulling his socks up. Better it be done now than when he's an adult and will end up in jail for that sort of nonsense.

Im really curious about why you think removing a birthday cake and replacing it with a cupcake because he gang beat a kid and started using a knife is appropriate. I'd start with family therapy for you because your expecations of whats normal are wayyyy off key.

There are no words.
x

Redthread are a good source of help

Totally agree. He needs to be scared shitless, not given a cupcake.

This made me feel sick. I'm so sorry, I honestly can't imagine what you're going through.

Nothing will scare him more than the thought of the gang being after him. That’s how they work. I think reconnecting would help but honestly I would move.

He could quite easily be the instigator from the sounds of him

Need to unpick this a bit
You're describing violence,inappropriate behaviour,breaking rules & boundaries

is this a sudden out of character behaviour or a pattern that’s increased over time?
any recent trauma or life changes? New school?.A family situation change?Is he being bullied?
Has his mood or mental state changed? Any substance misuse
Adolescents can display behavioural changes that may be indicative of deteriorating mental state, substance use, stress

It’s not necessarily gang related. You’ve described a group of boys physically acting together against another individual. As opposed to a gang affiliation

its a safeguarding issue talk to school Safeguarding lead and or make a self referral to local authority children & families team. Google your local authority, social work will be listed, contact children & families. Try get some support

I hope you feel able to reach out to get some support for this young boy

People are very keen to keep referring to a gang, presumably they mean in terms of a criminal gang/drugs gang etc

Unfortunately groups of children do also get together outside of those types of gangs and behave in this manner. They're frightened of nothing and one day will be picked up by a criminal gang, but dont necessarily need to be in that at this stage.

It may be comforting to consider that this boy is being manipulated and exploited, but many children are not and dont need to be to behave like this.

I took my son to the Old Bailey to watch a gang trial of 14/14/15/15/16 year olds who had murdered a man unprovoked it was pretty effective. Before that day I had put a suitcase in my wardrobe and told him no matter what he couldn’t open it or look in it. At first he was joking and laughing about but I kept on saying same thing don’t look in it etc for about 15 minutes then I changed my tune I said he had to look out the window until he saw a man coming down the road just keep looking keep looking. He started to get scared after about 10 minutes of me telling him not to look in the suitcase but to look out for the man he cracked started crying saying he was scared etc then I said that’s what it’s like being in a gang you don’t know what’s in that suitcase it cd be drugs a gun a body anything and that man coming down the road wants it you don’t know him he doesn’t know you but he will kill you for that suitcase. Those two things sorted my son out - I would be also looking into moving and I wouldn’t be letting him out anywhere

Why do people keep going on about moving? People can't just move!

And I very much doubt they are a gang gang. They are a group of shitty behaved 11 and 12 year olds. Move him and he'll find a new group of shitty behaving 11 and 12 year olds.

If negative consequences aren’t working, I’m not sure there’s much point in trying to make a point of the birthday.

If anything it sounds like a trip away is a good idea and you and DH need to “lean in” a bit and spend more quality time with him and keep him from these “friends”. Start doing more stuff with him so he a) gets time with the two of you in a positive way which will help him absorb and appreciate your values and b) gets much less time with the kids he’s behaving badly with. Find clubs or something for him to do after school. Take him out on weekends. Have game nights and involve him in whatever you’re doing weeknight evenings. I know it can be hard but it doesn’t sound like he should have much unsupervised time for a while, he doesn’t seem to have the maturity or social network to use it well.

I mean I'm not being funny inky 12 and a set of parents not in control. Sounds like they haven't been doing a good job for many years to end up in this state

The worry here is that within a gang if one of them seriously assaults someone then your son could be considered part of an organised crime group and be imprisoned even if he did not actually commit the actual assault or carry the knife. Just carrying a knife is easily made a criminal offence. Moreover what you described is a serious criminal offence of kicking someone etc. Carrying a knife is 4 years maximum. Maybe contact Family Lives 0808 800 2222 or your local authority asking for specialist gang workers. Or contact National your voluntary services or some other local youth groups.

If you have the moment maybe get an ed psych report done to see if it is SEN. What is his school work like?

Do not march him down to the police as he will shut down communication. You need to be engaged in his world and know everything about him. He needs to be kept busy with other hobbies eg sports, swimming or scouts. You need to explain that you are on his side and do not want to see him imprisoned or hurt. Take him down to the courts - maybe ask to tour a prison. Explain that if he goes down a gang path he will loose everything including his family. It’s not ‘cool’ it’s dangerous and life destroying.

But yes, I would consider moving completely away from the area.

Huge, very serious intervention needed here. Fucking huge. Can you bear to deal with what your child might be responsible for in future when he's bigger and stronger and you've lost all ability to have any impact on him? I could easily repeat what kids this age are doing around here to younger, same age and even adults on a daily basis - hiding behind balaclavas and getting away with everything because the police are useless. It's absolutely horrific. But I don’t need to. There's enough examples in the news daily. Your child is so young. That's your only advantage and it won't last. Do something hard and fast before he slips through your fingers entirely.

A cupcake.....
He needs grounding for a good long while.

Absolutely

Moving away is not a solution if the inappropriate behaviour is intrinsic to the child and the trigger unknown as yet
Move away and he potentially has same problems in a different postcode
Find out what’s the trigger and Address that. This is not a postcode issue

Also is it actually gang affiliated? or is he in a group and behaving inappropriately?