Why are gender roles viewed negatively?

[reddragon7]

I read and see so many threads and real life examples, where men and women feel the need to be “equal.” The man about to become a father, refuses to become the main earner, even when he has the means, and insists that his wife also work and contribute financially. Doesn’t this seem imbalanced to anyone, and that society is being brainwashed to accept this as the norm.

I have nothing against a woman wishing to work post-children, however, I don’t understand why society and some men put pressure on their wives to work, if she would rather stay home with the children. This has now become and expectation. If a woman is contributing financially, it is never really 50/50, as she is also doing most of the domestic work.

People condemn gender roles as though they are ancient, but seem to forget that, biologically and psychologically, women are naturally better caregivers to children. They are the ones pregnant, produce all these hormones, and better equipped to raise a child than a man. Of course, there are exceptions, but as a general fact, people seem to ignore this.

In view of all this, I believe more men should offer to be financial providers, giving women the option to not work after children, as childcare costs aren’t exactly saving them much anyway. Otherwise, it feels we are moving away from our gender roles, which may actually be more helpful in a marriage, than people make out.

I think this post is a perfect example of how all of us surround ourselves with people who share our values and viewpoints. Even online you can find yourself in an echo chamber, so open forums like this are invaluable tools for encouraging diversity.

OP's friendship group hold similar values therefore they're surprised when their values are challenged here. Their observations of what "works best" come from the same narrow group and so they're never prompted to consider the pitfalls.

We all have biases/preferences, every one of us. Widening our circles and listening with empathy to people who hold different values and then challenging our own when we realise they are unfair is a good start.

I dread to think how this would be played out in reality 'oh there's no point in investing in daughters education as she's only going to get married and have children and stay at home. A levels are more than enough'
I'm thankful for all our women doctors, nurses, teachers, solicitors, dentists and so on.

Because you want hetrosexual people to have rights that wouldn't be extended to homosexual people. A culture where hetrosexual people have rights homosexual people don't is always homophobic

Life choice 🙄

If its not enforced and only by agreement, its not a right.

Life choices that apparently mean it's okay for you to have different options after children as well 🙄

In the OPs ideal world all mothers will be married and not working. Whilst lesbian mothers will still have to work. But apparently that's not homophobic.

She thinks women who have been through pregnancy and childbirth deserve to stay at home and its best for their children, except for those pesky lesbians and their children, they just deserve to not have what's 'best' for them. But it's not homophobic...

I'm pretty sure in the OPs ideal world same sex couples don't actually exist though 🙄

Well actually, not everyone in my group hold the same views. We have has open and honest discussions about this

Wow, you’ve only chosen to cherry pick and devise your own assumptions. I said I am pro education in both genders. I’m educated myself and work, why would I be against this? I simply think traditional roles are favourable, doesn’t mean women stop working altogether. But that after having children, women be supported, should they wish to stop working.

If people have different views from your own, and you express your views in similar ways to how you have expressed them on this thread, then it's highly likely that you have offended some of them. They may not necessarily choose to tell you that they're offended. You might want to think about how you can express your thoughts more tactfully in the future.

And no, that is not what I said - people are clearly ignoring to choose parts of what I said, and assuming the worst. I don’t comment on homosexual couples because it’s difficult when I don’t support same-sex marriage in the first place.

Just realised your stance means you don't support gay people having children either. Goodness.

You have no idea how I communicate in real life, to continuously dictate this. With my close friends, we understand each other’s intentions and tones, so it’s a lot different to how things may sound online. And, I’ve never been so brazen to speak this way with people outside of my friends circle -because we don’t know each other well enough e.g. at work - so this has never been an issue for me. Just because people don’t agree with me, I don’t see why I’m suddenly being seen as some monster who has no idea how to speak, despite having to clarify myself multiple times.

If you take about married women having the right to be financially supported because they went through pregnancy and childbirth and are better carers for the children (aka its better for the children)

But then that same sex couples don't need these traditional gender roles/rights then you are ascribing rights to one group you don't allow the other group to have.

So hetrosexual women get to stop work and lesbian women dont even though they might have been through pregnancy and childbirth

And given you also don't believe in same sex marriage you don't believe in sexual orientation equality aka you are homophobic

So what’s the point of women getting an education, with associated student debt etc, if they’re only going to give up work and never need that education?

if you have a boy and a girl, why would you invest in the girls education? Surely logically you would throw everything you have into the boy- private school, tutors etc as he is going to need to support a family while she is going to pop out kids.

education for girls will be the preserve of the very rich or forward thinking. No low or average income family is going to bother with girls getting an education they’ll never need.

They don’t have to give up work forever, but at least they’ll have the option, should they wish to say home after children - they can work from home even, or go part-time. And they can then plan return to work, once the children are of school age. I’m not saying they never go back to work. I simply favour traditional roles, that is all.

For goodness sake, since when did this thread become about homophobia. If I don’t support same sex marriage in the first place, why would I talk about them, I just don’t get involved. They can do what they want.

Because you are talking about giving legal rights to women in heterosexual marriages that do not apply to those in honosexual marriages. What's hard to understand about that?

But that after having children, women be supported, should they wish to stop working
Why should they be supported to stop work based on their wishes?

It's a decision for a COUPLE to decide, not an expectation/right that a woman should be supported to give up work if she fancies it.

If a couple are on the same page, they can structure their families how they like. Plenty of people on this page support couples arranging their families how they want to, something they can ALREADY do.

If a couple isn't on the same page, no man should be expected to solely financially support his wife because she's popped a child out and wants to use sexist gender stereotypes to justify that she doesn't feel like working anymore.

Pesky gay people mucking up our traditional gender roles, how dare they 🙄

Although a study in the netherlands showed that the children of homosexual couples were more likely to do better at school and go to university

And

a 2014 study from Australia that found children of same-sex couples are generally happier and healthier than their peers, possibly because gay and lesbian couples share parenting and home work more equally.

So yeah, I can see why someone like the OP wouldnt want same sex couples and families because they actually disprove that traditional gender roles have the best outcomes for children

What’s so hard to understand when I say I don’t agree with same-sex marriages? So I don’t want to speak on their behalf.

Because you proposed homophobic changes to the way society would run

If you didn't want it to be about homophobia don't be homophobic?

Yes, exactly. And the OP does seem generally as if she struggles with abstract thought. She keeps saying she ‘doesn’t support’ gay marriage, as though that magically means it doesn’t need to factor into her funny little world of SAHMs and Manly Providers.

I didn’t even think about homosexuality, I simply said I don’t comment on their stance, since I don’t support them. It is what it is. All I said was I believe in traditional gender roles in marriage.

OP, do you have some form of neurodiversity that potentially affects your communication style?

And you also said that whilst married women should be supported by their husbands same sex couples would continue 50/50

Now given that you have stated repeatedly you think that one partner being supported by the other is the best way to do it by saying same sex couples would continue 50/50 you are putting them in a situation that you feel is detrimental