Quotes from Narcissistic Mothers (& support for their victims) Thread 2

[01Name]

Following on from this thread: www.mumsnet.com/talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/4610023-to-ask-for-your-quotes-from-narcissistic-mothers?page=39&reply=120137262, started by @itsgoodtobehome as a tongue-in-cheek repository for anecdotes of appalling remarks/deeds from parents/siblings with rampant NPD. It morphed into a place where those of us suffering the effects of such behaviour could share experiences, solidarity, advice and support. I hope this thread can continue the good work of the original. Your voice will be heard; your opinion and thoughts matter. You are welcome and valued here.

My hobbies are hill walking, swimming, and dressmaking.
The hill walking is a 'little stroll' swimming is splashing about plus additional comments about what I would look like in a costume and how she could never do it because she would feel embarrassed (ie how are you not embarrassed).
The dressmaking comments are usually about how much cheaper you could buy stuff for. Yes, you probably can, but I enjoy making them and using good-quality fabrics.
She literally undermines anything I do unless she can crow about it on Facebook.

I was musically talented and was put forward for the regional youth orchestra at 11 (I had no support from my mother. Had taught myself to read music and play my instrument, plus hours of practice) She saw absolutely no value and refused to let me go to any recitals if it was somewhere I couldn't get to by myself on a bus because I had to take myself to rehearsals. So eventually I lost my place. I loved playing. Her only comment was well thank god we won't have to listen to you practice anymore.

I,m not girly and have had years of comments about wearing something more feminine, making an effort with makeup, and growing my hair longer.

Mine likes to refer to anything related to me as ‘little’. Your ‘little house’ , your ‘little garden’.
Meals however are always ‘too big’ ‘we don’t need this’.
I of course, I am too big. When I’m slim she never comments favourably. Basically I’m always wrong.
I did Ballet and played the piano as a child. I gave them up as a teenager and she has never forgiven me. She has never ever
stopped bleating on about it . She accuses me of giving these things up in a hostile way as if I did it to insult her personally. It’s just crazy. They think everything is about them.

SilverLiningPlaybook I can relate. I am glad you have posted- it is a shit storm. I want to tell you that you are good enough. What you do is wonderful. You don't deserve this denigration and bad conduct

I have a small but successful small business that I run from home. My income from it puts me in the higher tax bracket and I earn twice what my husband does ( no issues with that).
My mother takes every opportunity to denigrate and pull me down. " You still doing that silly stuff?"

Your patience is extraordinary @speakout. Considering your earnings are keeping your mother and you put a roof over her head , she is incredibly ungrateful.
Thank you for your kind words. You are a remarkable woman. Strong, resilient and with such a brave and good heart. The trials you have been through have made you what you are. I suspect your mother feels her own inadequacy by comparison and that’s why she feels such a need to put your down. It’s really very sad.

SilverLiningPlaybook thank you for your kind words. It takes a powerful woman like you to empower others- we need your way of thinking to make this world a better place.

I think these narc mothers are a symptom of societal problems. The Motherwound is a useful generational device to make sure women have little self belief, afraid to speak up. Perfect for propping up male power.
Narc mothers are examples of patriarchial handmaidens taken to the exttreme. Any hint of another woman being happy with her life, having success is a threat, and to be extinguished.
Women supporting each other is a powerhouse, we connect in ways and see in ways that threaten male dominance. So men burn powerful women at the stake, and create a welcome for women who are happy to tear down their sisters.
My sister has also become a narc, we never talk, but I am in constant communication with her daughter, my niece, who despite having a PhD in psychology and a career as a university lecturer is torn down regularly by her mother. She is scarred by self doubt and poor self esteem, imposter syndrome and depression. We talk often about narc behaviour in our family and let no opportunity pass to praise and compliment each other..
She sent me a fridge magnet which says "Powerful Women Empower Women"

This is where it is at.
To everyone on this thread who has been brave enough to post- you are all amazing to have come through the fire and still want to share and fight.
This thread is full of incredible women.

Thank you.

@speakout You are absolutely amazing too. Your summarisation of this ‘syndrome’ and your defiance in refusing to be overwhelmed have given me so much comfort, is inspirational and incredibly empowering.

The only way I can describe it is having spent most of my life floundering around in the treacle of her manipulations. My metaphorical wings weighed down with my own sense of obligation, guilt and suppressed anger. Even though she died three years ago, the damage is very deep rooted but I’m very lucky in that my DH and my adult children saw the ‘real’ side of her so I’ve not had to deal with her alone for many years. I’m still unpicking issues but it’s slowly easing and having a forum like this and relating to so many others is so cathartic. I used to think her behaviour was quite unique but reading these posts shows how shockingly similar to other NMs the pattern is.

What I probably need to to do is stop analysing why she was like she was and just accept that’s who she was. My logical brain almost wants to justify why she treated me and my DF like she did although I strongly suspect there was huge emotional abuse in her childhood too. As I child I assumed her behaviour was normal because I had no yardstick of what ‘normal’ was. As I became older, it slowly dawned on me that my friends weren’t petrified of a parent like I was, didn’t need to always gauge moods and were able to relax in their company. I look back and I realise I spent my childhood in a state of high anxiety and anticipation as the attack, physical and/or mental, could come at any time. All of which explains my hypersensitivity and overthinking.

The balance of power shifted as I became an adult and left home into more emotional manipulation with tears, invented illness and learned helplessness despite the fact she had remarried. She used to ring me every day and would get almost aggressive if I didn’t/couldn’t take her call. It took me years to shake off that guilt too!

Thank you for your kind words JohnPrescottsPyjamas, I am sorry you did not have the mothering you deserved. X
I know it is interesting to explore the reasons why our mothers have such maladaptive approaches to life. Like you I think my mother didn't receive good mothering herself- I know her mother ( my grandmother ) was brought up in a children's home.
We don't really need have to have a deep understanding of why our mothers ended up as narcissists- unless that contributes to our own healing.
Our mothers have had their shot, their opportunity and they failed to deal with the generational wound, handing the whole hot potato to us instead.
I suspect they lack the fortitude or insight to make a change, it takes courage to confront and deal with the way we operate- they were unwilling or unable to deal with their own internal shit storm
But our mothers get no medals from me.
We- the women on this thread have decided to break the cycle. It isn't easy, and we have wounds- but I am sure as hell I am not passing the potato to my kids.
It ends here.
JohnPrescottsPyjamas it's sometimes only in retrospect that we can view scenarios.
You suffered anxiety as a child, but probably felt that was " normal". You thought all mothers behaved like yours- you had no reason to think otherwise.
Such treatment as children can leave scars that are hardwired.
I know mine has, and led to a lot of sadness, trauma and internal conflict, but yes I am defiant.
How dare she. How dare my father be so weak that he failed to question her abuse.
No parent has the right to psycho- manipulate their children for their own twisted needs.
My mother has impacted my life- but I don't allow her to do any more damage, and I am healing from my childhood wounds.
I see her as weak, feeble and misguided, I almost feel sorry for her. Nothing she could do or say can hurt me now because I see her in full light.
She can bleat, bray, strop or cry- my drawbridge is up.

I do think with narcissists that's part of the problem as @speakout says seeing them at full light. I had a narcissist for a DM and an ex boss. Both would get enraged if they were ever questioned or if I had any recognition.

I don't blame my DF. He protected me as much as he could. I think if it were now he would have left and taken me with him. I do blame some of my extended family. This shit was just accepted. It wasn't until I was an older adult that I met anyone with a DM like mine and now I've got all of you. It was very isolating and of course narcissists love that.

I was just thinking the other day that I can't remember even the year she died. Some legacy.

@speakout 'It ends here.'

Yes. Yes, it does. In my case quite literally, as I have not had children and it is now too late. I applaud all those who had enough insight early enough to be able to break the cycle and have healthy relationships with their children. There was a time when I desperately wanted children, but didn't quite dare. At the time I was clueless as to what was wrong - I just knew something felt off. I am only thankful my subconscious warned me I was at high risk of handing on some sort of hot potato. It's painful enough doing the work now and if I realised in the process I had damaged my own children (which I think I would have done to some extent) it would be unbearable.

Cranarc I undertand your decision not to have children.
I was sure in my 20s that I never wanted kids, but then had my first, then second in my late 30s.
I am glad I waited, because I had time to untangle some of the mess that had been dumped on me, and I was much more aware of my situation.
It is an ongoing process though, my kids are now adults, and recent times have led me to deep healing.
I know I have more healing work to do, but I now feel calm and content with my life. It is a comfortable place to be.

@Cranarc i totally understand - I wanted children but I was also terrified of the ‘passing down’ of the trauma. In our family in my lifetime it’s been four generations (great grandma, grandma, mother, down to me). I married an abusive man. Then had to leave. Then met my now husband, got pregnant, was always just mainly focussed on a healthy baby, but part of me thought it would be much better if I had a boy as I couldn’t ‘pass this down’. As it happened, I had two girls. Just like my mother had two girls. And life is teaching me so many lessons through them. I can’t quite explain it but everything that’s been hard with them has been a crossroads moment of ‘I could just be my own mother here and lose the plot like a manic’ (which I have to be honest the feelings come up) or ‘I can take myself away, take ten minutes, understand what’s happening then come back’.
its so hard being a mother when you haven’t had a good mother yourself, so please don’t beat yourself up. Parent yourself instead and heal your child inside xx

Nicola101177 I agree-having our own children can be deeply heealing. I have stopped the generational cycle. My kids are young adults now and I see the way they approach life- vastly different to my early 20s, full of sorrow and anxiety, being abused by my husband.
And life is teaching me so many lessons through them.
I echo that. Being a mother has opened up the gates to my own healing, through mothering my children I have also re- mothered myself.
It is hard to be a mother when you have had only a poor example, for me it has meant having a daily or concious awareness of every decision I make, examining actions and thoughts, making sure I am not acting from a place of dysfunction.
Applying those criteria to my children means I have learned to also apply them to myself and extending them to my inner child.

I think you are all absolutely fantastic. Wise and strong, every one. I'm sorry I haven't posted much; but draw inspiration, comfort and courage from you all.

I saw someone talking on TV the other day about narcissists. It was along the lines on a narcissist being unshakeably convinced that they, and only they, are in the right and are completely persuaded that everyone else is wrong and foolish - even in the face of hard evidence. The emotional toll damage they cause is awful and long-lasting.

Strength and love to you. x

Completely agree with PPs, @speakout your posts are so brave and wise, as are all the posters here. 💐

RenewableNewt thank you.

I think everyone on this thread is very courageous and wise.

@cranarc I completely understand your reasoning for not having children. I think there is definitely a deep seated fear within many of us offspring of NMs that we might repeat the cycle. Whenever I lost patience with my own children or perhaps didn’t handle a situation well - which I know realise now is a normal part of parenting, I would then have terrible moments of self doubt about my own mothering abilities or even suitability. I was genuinely terrified that I might be turning into my mother just because I wasn’t always calm and immediately forgiving, which is an unrealistic expectation of anyone but I just wanted to be the opposite of her.

@Cranarc @JohnPrescottsPyjamas &@speakout i fully understand, I was absolutely terrified of having children, especially a girl and repeating the cycle. When I finally got pregnant I made my DH promise me if he ever saw me behave in a way that would hurt my baby that he would put a stop to it. Now I have 3 girls and couldn’t imagine ever hurting them, they are my world, they go before anything else, I tell them how much I love them, encourage them to do what they enjoy, support them and would never dream of stomping on their hopes and dreams.

I’m glad I waited though, I don’t think I’d be as capable as I am now if I’d had them when I was younger. It’s taken me a long time to understand I’m not the problem and more importantly I’m not worthless, I’m not sure if I’d have been able to protect them from the damage done to me if I’d had been younger and hadn’t learnt what a narcissist was,

My DDs have definitely helped me heal and also put boundaries in place, it’s not just about me now but about protecting them and making sure they aren’t exposed to the nastiness that is my mother.

Amazing to hear how many have put in so much effort with their own children. It is inspirational.
I sometimes thinnk I had the best coach from my mother in how not to deal with parenting challenges.
It's hard work because it takes constant questioning of our own parenting to make sure we are not going down any learned dysfunction.
But that work is so worthwhile- the cycle of abuse is stopped.
Not just for our own children but for their children-if they choose-and generations after that.
Your work is important because you have stopped the generational cycle.

I am guessing that mother's day can be a challenging time for many of us- I know it is for me.
A day we are supposed to honour our mothers and tell them how amazing they are.
I do buy my mother some chocolates and flowers, but usually a blank card- I write " Happy Mother's day" A few years ago I grabbed a mother's day card from a shelf and didn't even read the verse inside.
My mother stood up and read the words printed in the card with tears in her eyes at least three times during the day.
Some words about how wise and kind, thanks for being an amazing mum, how we all look up to her for guidance- all the Hallmark schmalz.
It was painful to listen to it being read..
Plus she will want to hug- totally gives me the ick, and I try to make sureI position a bunch of flowers between us and when she goes in for the hug lunge I push the flowers into her outstretched hands.
And of course there is the guilt- not a loud voice inside my head, but present.

My daughter has asked me out for lunch on Sunday- often she would also ask my mother- her grandmother to come, and I am unwilling to extend an invitation to my mother nor is it my place.
I am guessing my mother is not invited as my DD has suggested a good Thai restaurant - she knows I love Thai foor, my mother is strictly meat and two veg, really hates Thai. Then on to see a Dr Who exhibition- daughter and I love Dr Who ( my mother no interest)
It will be a cold day, and we have a bit to walk,but DD and I are fit, and we put on a fast power walk around the city.
I know my mother will be put out at not getting an invitation, but I don't care.
Daughter and I always have really fun times together, and it will be a special day for both of us.

My mother had her chance with her own two daughters and fucked up.

@speakout I love your posts.
They are truly inspirational.
Enjoy mother's day, you really deserve it. Your mother is very lucky she is staying with you every single day, I really don't know how you do it.

I feel the same with the hugs or close proximity to my NM. I hate it.

I am lucky in my home country mother's day is later in the year so I can enjoy my own mother's day. My kids are younger than yours and I truly love anything the do for me like breakfast in bed, card, any small gift. Its always a lovely day.

I hope the rest of you have a not too bad mother's day if you are meeting your mother even if only for a short while.

xx

Agree @speakout mothers day use to be hard until I was able to cut all ties, now it’s definitely just about me and my DDs, who I love to say also bond over Dr Who 😁 My DDs are still young but I’ve introduced them to The Dr and more recently The Sarah Jane Adventures, they are loving them. The are excited for the 10th/14th Dr’s return. Love to know where the exhibition is.

The hugs are horrible, I feel so fake, I remember sitting in the back of the funeral car on the way to my Dads funeral and her grabbing my hand saying she will need me now more than ever to lean on, at that moment I felt sick. I told my SIL later at the funeral it wasn’t going to happen, her precious boys can be the ones she can lean on. At the time I had a new baby, preschooler and one in KS1 while my brothers had adult or older kids, but I was the one expected to drop everything for her, the woman who treat me like shit my entire life.

What I’ve always struggled with is watching or reading about mother daughter bonds. I love the movie The Divine Secrets of the Ya Ya Sisterhood, but I really struggled reading the book as it focused so much on the mother daughter relationship, it was so close to home. At the time I was an avid reader and would normally have read the book in a couple of days but it took me weeks as I had to keep stopping.

Many years ago I was recommended a book by a counsellor, Why You and Your Mother can’t be friends, I bought it the next day but it sat in my book shelf for about 10 years before I gave it away. I could just never face it head on.

Ive find myself dwelling on things less and less. I use to have bad dreams, again they are becoming less. Actually talking about dreams, a revaluation I had when coming into the light was remembering a reoccurring nightmare I use to have as a child, a witch use to chase me through the woods clawing at my legs, the witch lived under my bed, I was terrified of her. It was many years later I had another dream when I realised the witch was my mother, she always had long nails that would stick in my arm every time she grabbed it, or scratch my legs when slapped, you get the drift… Anyway, I thought to myself, this is totally fucked up, no child should be that scared of their mother, even if I couldn’t remember facts or had them skewed over the years by her, I knew that if I was that scared of her as a young child something was very wrong and that could not be my fault.

Its sad reading how other women have gone through this, but at the same time I’m so happy so many others are posting their stories, we may be strangers on the internet, but I feel less alone reading these posts x

AliceMcK I am so glad you managed to find the strength to step back after your father passed, for you, but also for your children. You are courageous and your children will not have to face the struggles that you did.
I thinks dreams send us powerful stories, giving us clarity and signposts for the way ahead.
For self preservation it is totally understandable that we pack away the unpleasant memories, push down our feelings, but sometimes those energies resurface in a different way.
Our bodies may rebel, we may suffer poor self esteem, depression, anger, anxiety, nightmares, as a way of subconciously exorcising the demons.
I know my anxiety has impacted me for decades, and I can follow that trail back to my childhood.
Becoming aware of our situation and our maladaptations is an enormous step in healing.
This thread is incredible because it has shone the light on the truth.
In sharing our stories on this thread we can re-frame our situation and confusion and become aware of our realities.

AliceMcK on a personal level I can relate to the micro-abuse patterns.
As a child I was fascinated by nature, and spend hours in the garden observing insects, looking inside flowers to examine their deeper structures, digging in the earth to find rocks and roots.
My mother took exception to my absorbtion and showed that by screaming at me to come in to wash my dirty knees. Always my knees it seems, she would attack them roughly with a pot scourer, and rub until they were red raw.
It felt like punishment for my natures studies.
Similar with my hair. I noticed that when my mother was in a bad mood she would forcibly comb my hair by way of taking our her anger.
It would hurt, and my hair would be torn out in clumps, all the while my mother telling me my hair was like "rats tails" and how no boy would look at me because my hair was "ugly"- and I was only 7 or 8 years old, attracting male attention was not on my radar. Even now I struggle going to the hairdresser, or having any one touching my hair, I feel very anxious and a slight feeling of panic.

I have made a very conscious effort with my own daughter to treat her body with respect.
Washing can be gentle and pleasurable.
I treated my daughters hair very gently, taking time to tease through any knots, I talked to her about how shiny and strong her hair was, how good it smells, how soft it felt. We would sometimes sing, and would ask me to try different styles.
A few weeks ago my daughter ( now 22) came to visit and asked me to braid her hair. Same routine she pulled up a cushion to sit on- as she did when she was 5 years old. My DD said she wanted me to do her hair because she finds it soothing and relaxing.
I know it can be hard to see other people who have good relationships with their mothers, and how triggering it can be to watch movie scenes or read books where that is highlighted.

But I would urge those of you with daughters or indeed sons to see that scene through the lens of your own relationships with your own children.
We can still have that mother daughter relationship, we just swap roles.
There are many different ways to heal and many tools within reach already- even a hairbrush.

I really wanted a boy as I really didn't know how I'd relate to a daughter.

But I like you all, became a mother based on knowing how to not be one. And as much as my DS teases me I think he likes the certainty of knowing I do worry, I do care, I'm always there for him and he is so important.

He finds comfort being around me. That's what mothers are for.

I gave up on mother's Day after so many gifts and cards being thrown away without any thanks. She didn't see the point of any of it because I assume she couldn't show them off because most mothers had gifts. Her twisted face declaring how she hated flowers, cards were a waste of money. On and on.

She kept a few photos with my pleading with her for a relationship. So I threw them out. Every single photo of me was in a cupboard. I'm glad to have them but it would have been nice if she'd hung one up.

Like I've said before it was just about her and money. I don't understand her reasoning for any of it. I just know she took delight in being cruel. The only one to blame is her. She was adored by her family. They often adored her to my detriment.

The mention of photos just reminded me - my mam has no photographs of me in her house. And one day she randomly gave me an envelope of all of my baby photos and just said “I thought you might like them” I was on my own or with my sister in them all. It’s only recently I had a moment and thought hang on, why didn’t she want them? Why would a mother do that? I have no answers but it felt odd

My mother gave me an album of photos of herself when she was young "to remind" me of "how beautiful she was"

And added " it's a pity you didn't inherit my fine features"

Oh my god