What the fuck am I supposed to do now?

[Sleepfailires]

18 month DS, tried to implement gentle sleep training. The problem is he refuses to sleep in his cot. He goes down OK but then wakes 2 hours later and refuses to go back in it.

Tried ‘gentle’ sleep training, me in the room with him stroking him and reassuring him.

He went absolutely berserk when I put him back down, screaming, thrashing around, I mean really hysterical screaming. Then after twenty minutes (and I was right by the cot) he vomited.

I am an absolute wreck, I am fat, my skin is grey, I am exhausted, broken, depressed, my relationship is suffering as we get no time together, we can’t think of having another child, my work is suffering. I don’t know what to do.

Honestly just CIO it was my GPs advice too. With a baby monitor to watch (on silence). The kid is fine now!

You poor thing. Dd was the same. Puked if she cried for more than a few minutes, so cry it out was a no go. Co slept like thrashing monster.

We did get a sleep consultant as we were too sleep deprived to make any headway. None of what she said was new, but having her support and a plan really helped. In the end we co slept on the foor with every mattress we could squeeze in so I could slide away from her. And DH and I took co sleeping in turns so we both got a half decent night sleep.

I'm so sorry. My DS used to get wound up at bed time, more energetic, he'd be literally running round the room, bouncing off the walls. I couldn't not sleep either. I just stopped trying to put him to bed. I used to lie him on the sofa next to me watching telly with just a low lamp on, and my hand on his tummy both as comfort and to encourage him to stay still. When he eventually fell asleep I'd take him up to bed. If he woke up, I'd take him back downstairs and do the same. It went against all the advice, but it meant we got some sleep, even if it was just dozing next to him. As he got older and we physically couldn't carry him to bed any more, I did the same but in his bedroom, we moved a small tv in there for me. We got there, in the end.

We have been through all this,

Well if you are doing rotas with H & getting blocks of sleep, then while not great, it wouldn't be the description in your posts, if no sleep, constant thrashing from DS so you can't sleep even when he does, and DH not being able to manage him.

We can only go on what you post; and make suggestions.

If you say you've done it, I'm not sure exactly what the problem is.

You can get sleep. In a crap, not long-term sustainable way, I know. But it's possible & my posts were just trying to make that suggestion.

I hope you feel better soon.

The other tip someone said to me was 3 days to make a habit, 3 days to break a habit.

It made it clearer in my head that I wasn’t going to have nights like last night forever, 3 days and you’ll seen an improvement. It made it feel more manageable and it was true!

Yes @LizzieSiddal , we were trying gentle (my arse) sleep training, but even when you do bring him in bed with you, you get no sleep, it really is very unpleasant.

So is he starting off in the cot or is he in bed when you initially put him to sleep for the night? Lots of people are telling you to get rid of the cot, he associates the cot with being on his own (even if you’re stood over it, patting him!)
You need to start him off in your bed, he’ll then get used to waking up, seeing you right there, feeling you’re body heat and going back to sleep. Yes it will take a few nights but he will get there.

@EarringsandLipstick , it really is like you’re looking for an argument here but whatever, let’s go through it all. Because I’ve nothing better to do.

If you say someone is blind, it may not mean they cannot actually see anything, it means their vision is so poor they are registered as blind even though they may be able to see a few things.

If someone is starving, they may not be literally eating nothing at all but not enough to keep them going.

Same with my sleep situation. When I say I get no sleep I don’t literally mean I get mine whatsoever. I get about 1-2 hours between 9/930 and 11 and then about 3 between 3 and 6. And it’s not enough to function on. Are you happy now?

I do have some massive issues in my relationship but I have to say this isn’t one of them. If DH could do more at night, he would.

I think you posted before OP? And didn't want to take advice then either (Sorry don't mean to be snippy by saying that, just how it seems).

He can do more.

He stays with DS while you sleep. If he screams, roars etc, so be it 🤷🏻‍♀️ you sleep, DS is safe with parent. Then you swap over so DH can sleep.

He’s been in my bed for months @LizzieSiddal . He’s horrendous.

If you cleaned him up and put him back down what would happen? Trying to keep a neutral expression (really hard I know) but keeping going with it?

Have you tried just letting him scream? I know he’s vomited tonight but is that usual? My 19 month old has never slept well but he started full on night time tantrums/melt downs a few months ago. We find it really hard. He shares a room with DS3 as well. After trying absolutely everything I’ve found the only thing that works for us is.

1. first we remove DS3 from room. He sleeps in our bed 🙄


2. I lie DS1 down in his cot speak calmly ‘it’s time for sleep. Love you, sleep well, do this really quickly. No hanging around trying to get him calm, you’re saying goodbye - he is screaming and thrashing around like an absolute psycho as I do this.


3. I then leave him for 5-10 mins screaming. I’ve found this is the important. He needs some time to just scream, express his rage. Anything I do in that time that isn’t exactly what he wants (getting him out the cot) just enrages him more he needs to be left to it.


4. I repeat 2 and 3. Would try to leave him for longer than the first time if he wasn’t showing any signs of calming.


5. leave for 5-10 mins. I find on the third/fourth time of going back in he stays down when I lie him down. He starts shouting out but he doesn’t get back up. This doesn’t always work but it seems to be the only thing that does.

there may be reasons why this won’t work for you. I often think there must be something wrong with my DS, and there is, he’s ill all the time and has digestive issues. But he’s very strong willed and discerning when he’s feeling unwell and just being a sod is important. It creates a lot of inconsistency which doesn’t help.

my husband is not as firm as I am and my DS plays up worse for him. Can sense he’s more likely to get what he wants. A strong willed toddler needs really strong boundaries.

If you cannot have him co-sleeping with you I would recommend never allowing him to do it again. He knows he can get what he wants from you. You need to have that boundary.
don’t be in the room when he’s tantruming. It will feed his distress.
If he’s going to vomit regularly, have things in place (towels, spare bedsheets) that mean you can keep resettling him in the cot.
he’s really clever. He knows how to get what he wants, why wouldn’t he do it?

I’m so sorry, this is so hard. Sleep deprivation is torture.

I’d say persist, enlist DH to help and do half. Reassure the kid, change him if he is sick, but persist in putting him back into the cot. Mattress protectors are great, and you’ll need them anyway for after you do potty training. Get a couple. That way you can change the bed if there is an accident and put the kid back into a clean cot. After a few days he will get the message of “cot is for sleeping”. If he’s safe and clean and you’re nearby, he can’t stay awake forever. Get DH on board and agree a plan - eg, you do 12-1, he does 1-2, you do 2-3, or alternatively you agree to swap whenever one of you feels too overwhelmed to stay calm.

You might be in for a few awful nights but you’ll get there and the whole family will be in a much better place.

Good luck.

Hi OP, I know you've had lots of comments already so I probably can't add much. I just wanted to say, 100% this is NOT a result of anything you have or haven't done! Science has shown that sleep is highly genetic.

I would (and did, twice,) hire a sleep consultant. Yes, they are going to tell you things you already know. But they will coach you through that so it works for you. They will start work your day time routine to set you up for success in the night.

I used sleepymoonkeeper (lady called Boogie) - I think she's changed the company name now to sleep dreams baby child sleep consulting, according to Facebook. Best money I've ever spent, saved my daughter, my sanity, my marriage. She helped me with ds agreed 14m and then with Dd who was 4yrs old at the time and a very difficult case.

Here we go again, it’s the Mumsnetters who live in vast mansions who decide that the husbands can take the child to the west wing while Mum sleeps in the east, or something. For us mere mortals in a regular house, the rooms are quite close to one another.

No you obviously change him calm him and put him back down. Gentle sleep training will take a long time. Despite the extreme behaviour you have to carry on if you want to do this now. I am assuming he was previously in with you?

I did say I'd leave it as you're not interested in solutions & my suggestions aren't helping.

I'm not looking for an argument, at all

I've been sympathetic, hugely.

But you don't want to take my suggestions on board & then castigate me, for not understanding.

But I do! You can sleep early when DS does, and then some nights you deal with the night waking, and get a bit more sleep when he does. Other nights DH does the night part, leaving you to sleep.

It's still crap, but it's a solution to the current exhaustion.

Then you address matters via GP, sleep consultant, when you can.

Absolutely this ⬆️

this behaviour sounds normal for his age, especially with a broken mum at her wits end. You are not a shite parent and you have not done anything wrong, it is within your gift to change this, trying as suggested above will hopefully resolve it!

And yes, I’m being an arse and I’m doing it intentionally because I don’t want the thread to turn into a row about my DH. I have said repeatedly that I would far, far rather deal with DS overnight because then DH can take over in the day. It actually enrages me when he doesn’t because then we are both exhausted.

I’ve sent you a PM OP with sleep consultant details. I know I got to a stage where I couldn’t take on board any more “helpful” suggestions because no matter how well meant they were it was all too overwhelming and I didn’t need ideas, but a structured plan that someone else (not me) had fully thought through. I hope you get somewhere and good luck.

Oh for gods sake! Most of us live in normal houses. It's still doable.

I was a single parent at an early stage when my 3 were small, so it wasn't an option for me, as it happens, but that's not the case for you.

I think the problem is I have to do CIO but I don’t know if I can do CIO. Nightmare.

And, by the way, I think it was unrealistic to expect the gentle sleep training to work the first day. It took us around 3 days, though the baby was much younger and DH did the whole thing as DD had the “mummy = boobies” association.

Another bit of advice - the cot should be clean and empty except for one safe toy which can become his attachment object. We have a teddy and a small muslin with a satin edge, and DD, who is about to start school, is still using them to self soothe when she needs to calm down.

I would far, far rather deal with DS overnight because then DH can take over in the day.

But you are both in work, right? So he can't take over during the day.

You both have to work. You both need at least a copable amount of sleep.

Anyway, I need to stop hiding from my own DC - good luck OP

No idea if this might work, but when our daughter was born many years ago she was in NICU where all the babies slept on lamb fleeces. As she got older she would always go straight to sleep provided she had her fleece. Heaven help us if we forgot it! Would it be worth trying? Other than that agree with others you may just have to leave him to cry checking every 10 minutes that he’s not been I’ll and if he has clean him up but don’t otherwise engage by talking etc. haven’t read full thread but a nightlight and a ticking clock?

We get it @EarringsandLipstick but tbh I am now missing helpful posts because you won’t let up. Please leave it, and you don’t need to post to tell me you’ll leave it either.

@EatYourVegetables I was prepared for a horrendous night but not for puke after twenty minutes.