DD told she wasn’t a big girl at pre school

[Thereluctantstepmother]

My DD (nearly 4) is very well behaved.

Today she came home from pre-school a bit sad telling me that she had put her hairband around the tap and her pre school manager had told her that this wasn’t a big girl thing to do.

DD has spent a long time avoiding being told off (she tells me that she never wants to get told off) and today was one of the first times. DD pulled a confused face and her pre-school manager said “that isn’t a big girl face”.

I am feeling really triggered by this which is why I’m running past you all before I act because I’m a bit blurred by my own emotional response.

I’m completely happy for DD to be picked up on unwanted behaviours but I really detest the way it was framed as her ‘not being a big girl’ because... she’s not a big girl!

I told DD that at least she now knows that’s she’s not allowed to do that and she won’t do it again. I told her that all different people and places have different rules so I understand why she said she felt confused. We had lots of cuddles and she seems to have moved on.

But I still don’t feel happy with her being told she’s not a big girl, it’s as though she’s being shamed for not knowing a very nuanced rule.

When I first dropped DD off today (before this happened) the manager said that DD had been in a “funny mood” with her lately which I thought was an odd thing to say. DD is aware that this manager tells children off and I think she’s quite cautious of her.

Do you think I should just leave it or say something to her?

Thanks for reading.

I only wish my mother had been half as protective as you.

I think you’re over reacting. I don’t know why it would have triggered you, and you certainly don’t have to say why. I’m sorry it’s upset you, but it’s not a big deal.

DD has spent a long time avoiding being told off (she tells me that she never wants to get told off)

This is not healthy.

   Do you seriously want her to be a little girl aged 44?   A needy insecure woman who needs constant approval,  is crushed by the smallest criticism, can't stand up for herself?  

There is no fairyland for perfect little princesses.

@Wishforanishwishdiash

A different perspective:

I am a behavioural psychologist and always positive with my kids. They went to nurseries schools where the behaviour culture was positive.

My 15 year old recently suggested that I reprimand my 4-year-old more often. He says he had no experience with being reprimanded and it caused a lot of anxiety. From his point of view, being told off from time to time and building resilience is a good thing.

Not sure I agree, but another perspective.

I actually think he’s got it right. It’s important to have a balance in everything. Nothing but positivity is not realistic and does a bad job of preparing children for the reality of adult life. People, even children, need to experience some adversity, some difficulty (at appropriate levels) and importantly, clear, strict guidelines with clear consequences if breached. You cannot do that without ever being strict/firm/telling off/putting appropriate consequences in place. Lack of resilience is a huge problem in a large cohort of young people today (by no means all, of course, but many) and has wide reaching effects on society.

Doesn’t mean you have to be harsh, but I do agree with him.

I think, after reading your updates, your reaction is the opposite in the extreme to your upbringing. You are overprotective because of your history, but resilience is an important life skill. Abuse and neglect is harmful, but trying to protect your DD from learning from normal lessons is not ideal either.

@Findahouse21

I think it's a way of avoiding using the phrase 'a bit silly' which other parents might complain about. Personally I think it's a non issue and wouldn't even cross my mind to raise it with them.

I agree.

If that's the only 'negative' thing your little girl is told, you and she have nothing to worry about!

Can someone please explain to me what the issue is with putting one's hairband round a tap because I don't get that at all?!

@Sussexroadleyst I came to ask that exact question. I really don't understand what the problem is with putting a hair band on a tap??

I get it op, there's just no need for it, it's designed to make her feel ashamed and it did. A simple 'Take your hairband off the tape X, thanks.' Explain why if needed, done. I am like you in terms of thinking about the effects of these things and it would drive you a bit mad if you think about it! I'm a teacher myself before anyone says anything about it being necessary in large group scenario etc. It's not. It can shame, it's not necessary. I would build her up at home op and absolutely normalise mistakes etc, that's so important. I often laugh relaying my mistakes when they happen.

Can someone please explain to me what the issue is with putting one's hairband round a tap because I don't get that at all?!

It's probably not Covid-secure

Also strongly disagree with traffic light system mentioned above Are the children put to stand out on the coloured spots? This is really wrong imo tbh. Behaviourism is seen as old fashioned and limited for a reason.

Also strongly disagree with traffic light system mentioned above hmm Are the children put to stand out on the coloured spots? This is really wrong imo tbh

I didn't like that either.

I'm assuming it was more of a general issue of playing with taps?
Still don't see the the issue with the barely telling off though Id have said, "oh you'll know not to do that again, let's have lunch/play a game/go for a walk"
Its just such a non issue.

clearly I like the word issue!

I very much doubt she needs to recover from this. She did something wrong, and got very mildly rebuked. This is all a massive overreaction.

Also need to pick up on this:

She wasn’t actually told she wasn’t a big girl. She was told it wasn’t a big girl thing to do - that’s actually the right way to frame it, as it describes the behaviour or action and not her.

Children of 3 or 4 (and beyond) want to be big, that’s their primary drive at that age - learning, gaining skills and understanding, building on what they know now, to know and be able to do more tomorrow. They generally respond well to things being framed in the way that ‘this is for big boys and girls’ - think about eating by yourself, becoming potty trained, learning to get dressed by themselves etc etc. It sounds like maybe the words used upset you, and I do see what you’re saying, but actually it’s likely that it’s an (understandable) overreaction on your part.

So my instinct is it’s not necessarily the words that upset her, it’s the fact that she was told off. But that has to happen sometimes. She really doesn’t need to be frightened of it, anxious about it, or devastated by it, and the more you do to help her cope well with criticism, instruction and appropriate consequences, the more you will help her to be resilient, secure, and confident in herself.

I hate stupid arbitrary rules

But that's just me.

I disagree that it’s a comment designed to shame her. I think it’s the opposite. Most children that age want to be seen as grown up. So the nursery manager is appealing to that side of the child. Rather than “follow the rules because I say so” it’s giving the child an incentive. “Follow the rules and you will seem more grown up”. It’s really no different than offering any other kind of incentive from that perspective. It doesn’t sound like it was said sharply or unkindly, which would change the context.

Agree with PPs who say that you need to help your DD learn resilience and that it’s OK to get things wrong sometimes, learn from it and move on.

She wasn’t actually told she wasn’t a big girl. She was told it wasn’t a big girl thing to do - that’s actually the right way to frame it, as it describes the behaviour or action and not her

I know adults say this, but my experience is that children don't pick up on this distinction, and understand it as a criticism of them. To be honest they are right. If your boss said, 'that wasn't a professional thing to do', you would understand that you were being reprimanded for being unprofessional.

If this triggers you, God help you when she starts Secondary school!

It's a completely appropriate way to communicate with a pre-school aged child.

'DD has spent a long time avoiding being told off?' - What is this all about? Is this in a conscious way? I'd hardly class this as being told off!

Does she never do anything wrong at home? My kids make mistakes all the time. It's totally okay. That is how they learn what is appropriate behaviour. They certainly aren't pre-occupied with trying to avoid being told off. If the teacher 'tells them off' that is totally fine too, and means they learn how to behave appropriately not just at home but school too?

Are you sure it's even a big deal to your DD. Or perhaps it's just a big deal to you OP? She hardly did anything naughty, and hardly got reprimanded; just corrected.

@Thereluctantstepmother

Thank you kind posters. Unkind ones you might want to work on your emotional intelligence. Logging out now. 👋

good grief, good luck to all the professionals who will have to deal with a child with that parent who is never wrong.

I agree that there's nothing wrong with using "big girl/boy" to teach children that certain behaviours are appropriate or positive.

It's natural that she doesn't like being scolded or told that she was wrong, but that's a part of life. Even "good girls" occasionally make mistakes or misbehave, and there will be teachers and other authority figures that she doesn't get on as well with. All part of growing up (and part of adulthood, too).

Everyone gets told off even as an adult when they are at work! Just tell her not to worry about it OP. It’s a part of life.

I hate stupid arbitrary rules

It’s not stupid or arbitrary. Children learning to be tidy and keep track of their belongings/keep things in a sensible place is an important skill. It’s definitely one that my DD struggles with at school. Preschool staff are trying to prepare these children for primary school and this is a part of it.

Plus, they understandably don’t want to spend an eternity at 6pm trying to find all the crap that kids have randomly left all over the room.

I really feel for those who work in childcare and teaching when I read posts like this.