Help! I have a gender non-conforming DS, and feel like the rubber is hitting the road.

[WankmasterBastardDeLaShithead]

DS (10) has been "gender non-conforming" since he was a toddler, and able to choose clothes and toys. We've generally just let him get on with it, not making a big deal about it, and letting him know that it's fine to be a boy and wear a dress/play with dolls etc. He's navigated his own way through all sorts of situations with ingenuity, and grim determination .

Anyway as he's getting older we're encountering more and more tricky situations. Toilets have been a sticking point, although we've mostly got round that by encouraging him to use "neutral" loos where possible. The school organised a meeting for us to discuss this, after an incident where he wet himself (after feeling uncomfortable/unwelcome in the boys' loos, but discouraged by me to use the girls' loos). He now uses the neutral loos at school.

Today though, I've come up against two dilemmas to do with sex /gender identity, and I'm just not sure what position to take. Firstly he goes to gymnastics in a mixed class. His teacher spoke up me after the class, referring to him as 'she' and taking about putting him forward to a (sex segregated) competition at some point in the future. I had registered him for the classes as a boy (obviously), but haven't had an explicit conversation about his gender. He does look "girly" (longish hair) so I completely understand why they're mistaken. I didn't correct the teacher in the moment, as it was in public and this is one thing (correcting people on his gender) that DS finds embarrassing. He doesn't mind being called he or she, but he does mind any "fuss" about it.

I then got home to find an email from his school about an initiative aimed at encouraging girls' confidence, and his teacher feels that he would like to do it. Argh. It's well-meaning, and I know comes from an understanding that his friends are nearly all girls, he looks like a girl, and he will feel left out if he isn't included. Obviously I'm very uncomfortable about this, but my heart is also aching for DS, because this will probably be difficult for him.

Basically if there wasn't such weird gender stereotyping in our society, I'm pretty sure DS would be happily rocking out as a girly boy, but because there is, he's being made to feel that to do the things he likes doing, he has to "be" a girl. It's so shit.

Anyway, I just feel so stuck as to how to do the right thing by DS. Any advice?

I think you should have a conversation with him as to where he would like to be.. does he want be socially a boy or a girl..
Or, encourage him to be an independent boy who dresses how he likes. Not push fantasies onto him that he hasn't even asked about.
Problems in the toilets at school is simply bullying and the school needs to sort that out. A toilet pass to go during class when he's desperate is one idea.

I think you're doing an excellent job and both you and the school are sensitive to their needs. Non-binary seems to be the status most struggle with (also a parent here).

Personally, I'd talk to the gym club privately and explain the position re their birth gender and gender preferences and that they are non-binary. . Ask what their policy is on inclusivity. They should have a response. Ditto the school, if they are including your child because it will benefit them then fine. If it is because it allows them to put them in the box marked 'girl' then not.

Speak to those people, privately.

Does he not tell them he’s not a she, he’s a boy? If he looks like a girl they’re likely confused, rather than insisting that he’s actually the opposite sex. Nobody in their right minds would do that??
Tell him to speak up for himself.

OP. You could be describing a relative of mine 20 years ago. Long blonde feminine clothing, disliked sport. Mixed almost exclusively with girls. He is now a happy, gay man in a long term relationship. I shudder to think what might have happened to him had he been pushed down the trans route.

OP’s DS isn’t “non binary”: he’s a boy who doesn’t conform to stereotypes.

You'll have to tell the gym they made a mistake then.

Many schools have had training which tells them to affirm any gender incongruence. Means well, but not necessarily the best approach for every child.
Be clear with the school/coach the way that you and your DS want this to be approached.
It sounds like you have his best interests at heart. I'd imagine it's not easy for feminine boys sometimes.

FrancisCrawford - as far as I know they haven't started doing different activities yet.

OP does he not have a name that makes the "she" seem odd? I wonder if someone has asked him for his pronouns, it would be odd to to point of unbelieveableness that multiple adults would misgender your ds.

I’m unsure why there can’t be feminine boys or tomboy girls....

And yet there was a thread deleted just this afternoon from a mum whose 6 year old boy wants to wear a dress and had plenty of posters telling her that no way should she allow it and she needed to insist that he wore boys clothes. The argument was that society just doesn't accept boys in dresses and so boys need to accept this!

If he looks like a girl (and people don't seem to look further than hair length and colour of clothes these days) then people will read him as a girl. Just correct them, consistently and without fuss.

Mother's of girls with short hair get this all the time, it's better not to just let it go to avoid this sort of confusion.

And there is no shame in it so no need to do it private.

Agree with pp; ask for this to be moved to parenting boards if that was your intention, and you’re bracing yourself for ‘vitriolic attacks’. I’m guessing that posting in parenting wasn’t your intention at all though. Are you looking for the weekly transgender bunfight.

So far two posters on this thread have suggested the solution is to push unwanted and unasked for changes for this boy. Dangerous and stupid talk.

He's 10?!
Why are you having to talk for him? He sees these teachers more often than you do yet he can't have a conversation about his wants and choices?
Maybe than might be where your main focus could be - communication and confidence. Regardless of not wanting a fuss, the teachers aren't mind readers and they seem to be trying their best already.

Sleepyhead - the school have actually been really supportive about it all so far. It's not a big deal for him to use the "neutral" toilets, and that seems to be working fine for him. They're also aware of the fact that he might get "aggro" from the boys about looking like a girl, and they have had assemblies etc about being kind to people who are different.

I can see why they are confused, presumably they have had some training about transgender children and have made assumptions.

With your ds approaching his teens personally I'd want to be clear that he is a boy, with some typically feminine interests. I'd worry about repeated assumptions that he is transgender from others making him more likely to think about that path. I would correct people calling him "she" - not make a big deal, but just reply with a few male pronouns "yes, he will come next week, it's fun for him" - otherwise they will assume "she" is preferred and carry on using it, and it will become a bigger deal. If repeated you can follow up with an email.

The gender neutral toilet is possibly confusing them. Why does he not want to use the boys toilet?

On the plus side it sounds like you are a really supportive and brilliant parent. Big hugs to you!

.The argument was that society just doesn't accept boys in dresses and so boys need to accept this

The argument was that children were at risk in schools through gender ideology, particularly if boys go to school in dresses. Generally people thought it was fine for children to wear what they want in their own time

They should absolutely not be socially transitioning him off their own bat. Even if he was ultimately going to transition (far from certain), early social transition isn't even recommended by GIDS.

From www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-49020371:

They also said social transitioning, which means telling family and friends of a gender change without any treatment, had become more popular - but was not something they recommended.

It is not something that teachers, coaches and so on should be deciding to do - it can seem like a straightforward kindness but it's actually a huge step. I would recommend diving into a lot more research before going further.

Is the school going to tackle the boys that are making him feel uncomfortable in the toilet? They really should be acting on what amounts to homophobic behaviour.

I think it's pretty disgraceful that he's having to self-exclude from the boys toilets. Doesn't sound supportive at all. Pretty much the definition of "othering".

They all know he's a boy but they won't let him into boy's spaces?

This has always happened hasn't it? But it didn't have a label or associated politics and fear of offence. My daughter was a very short-haired 'tomboy' for years and often mistaken for a boy. It doesnt need to be a big deal surely? You can hopefully understand why people get this wrong and correct them ( and asap get him to find ways of correcting them). Presumably now everyone is falling over themselves to correctly 'gender' him, they are overdoing it. I'd tone it right down. He's a boy, straightforward. Or am I missing something?

Livelovebehappy - I posted with the weirdly temperamental app, and had no intention of bracing AIBU. Right now my heart is racing and I'm feeling genuinely upset about DS. Feel free to search my username to see that I'm far from a "bunfight" poster. I am going to ask for this to be moved.

Please be kind in the meantime.

What dies he say. Does he say he’s a boy?

Stick to it. Correct people.