4 yo keeps really hurting baby brother

[Verrie69]

My 4 yo has witnessed some violence from his father and has always been shy and more of an introvert from this he started school this year and he seems to have got much better he saw someone for 12 weeks when his father was arrested and that was the longest they could give him especially as he had improved. My baby boy is 3 months and is really hard work he cries and cries and there's nothing wrong with him I can't always cuddle him and I don't enjoy sitting cuddling him when he's screaming and doesn't stop. I let him calm in his crib and I take myself away for a bit as I find it very hard im unsure if my eldest has sort of seen how i am finding it hard when he cries but he tends to hurt baby his dad was never around for the baby so he can't have seen from his dad. But my 3 mo has had scratches and little pinch bruises on him when questioned he always admits he did it but since I've been telling him off for it he lies. It's also so simple to say oh never leave them alone they are along when I go to the toilet or have a bath if baby is crying I cannot have him in the same room after i have tried everything so he is alone then too although that is easier as I keep eldest distracted also yesterday they stayed at neighbours house after a bit of an emergency and he had come home with more marks the neighbour looked at me really oddly and said that "your baby needs to see a doctor" really rudely i think she completely judged me and I don't know what she was implying I just don't know how to solve this

Sorry lightsong very awful day and didnt completely mean all what i said

Your 4 year old is biting, scratching and pinching your 12 week old baby (and who knows what else that you don't see). You seem rather like an outsider looking in on the situation and at a loss about how you can improve things which is strange and probably linked to the abuse you too have suffered.

Get help from your GP/HV today before you walk into the room and find your 4 year old about to drop an iron on the baby's head.

I think your neighbour is judging you because she had your children for a few hours and it became very apparent to her that there is something seriously amiss.

Bath when your eldest is out the house and never leave the room without one of them until this is sorted. It's an awful situation for all of you

OP speak to someone. They won't take your kids away, they will offer help. You really don't sound in a good place.

My dd1 was 5 when I had my dd2 so similar age gap to you.

Dd1 got very jealous. She never tried to harm dd2 or anything but the jealousy was definitely there.

I never left mine alone together as a just in case.

When I showered I used to put dd2 in Moses basket on the bathroom floor. Dd1 used to go in and put but I could see exactly what she was doing where the baby was concerned. I only ever had 5 min showers.

Dh worked away Monday to Friday so I had no support in evenings for most of the week and I didn't actually lounge in the bath until dd2 was in a proper night routine and going to bed at certain time etc and dd1 was in bed.

Going to the loo, get a sling for the baby you can literally do anything and everything you would normally do with the baby in a sling. Bit more awkward but doable and the baby is safe then. Or take baby to the bathroom with you and lay them on a mat on the floor.

It's unrealistic to think you will get much time to yourself with a 3 month old baby and a 4 year old.

Also I would take baby yo be checked over in case like a pp said, your 4 year old has Injured baby more seriously - you don't always know with little ones because it's not that obvious. Also could be something else like reflux. It's not normal for a baby to cry constantly

If your baby is crying inconsolably and has been left alone for periods with your 4 year old who is violent towards him then your neighbour is right about getting him seen by a doctor.

Your baby needs checking thoroughly by a doctor. Inconsolable crying at 3 months plus a violent 4 yr old brother could mean there is a serious injury.

Even if there isn't, you urgently need help to manage both of them. Ask your HV for more help and tell her/him what's happening,just like you have on here. You won't be judged.

Phone your GP, take both of the kids with you and explain everything. They can help find out why your baby is crying so much, and getting that solved will ease alot of things. You sound like you're trying your best but we all need to ask for help sometimes.

@Verrie69

You need to ask your neighbour why she thinks you should take your baby to the GP? Did she notice something that you haven't seen?

You're supposed to take the baby into the bathroom with you if there's no safe place to put them.

Tbh with you, given what your neighbour has said and the fact the baby screams all the time. Have you considered the baby has been seriously hurt by your 4 year old which might be the cause of the screaming and it hasn't been attended too yet?

Get the baby to a doctor for a check up and ask for help. You quite obviously need help.

Op take your baby to a doctor please. Are you taking in all of the advice people are giving you? Your baby could be seriously hurt.

Op it is so hard with 2. You need to get baby seen by a gp today and get in touch with your hv. Nobody is going to judge you for asking for help but your situation isn't going to improve without some support. Hv can provide you with help for your 4 year olds behaviour. In the meantime you can't leave your baby alone with your 4 year old, they rely on you to keep them safe.

OP, you're having a really tough time. Look on this as a catalyst for change. Your four year old is telling you, through his behaviour, that something is wrong. So you've got the opportunity to do something about this now, rather than further down the line when he's harder to help. If he witnessed DV, that will have affected him. So now's the time to go to your GP and HV to get help. And Homestart, as a PP mentioned above, is a great idea.
Best of luck

As everyone else has said you can’t leave them alone together. I appreciate how tough this is but you cannot leave a baby with a 4 year old who is hurting him. Not even for a moment.

I also agree you should speak to your HV and/or GP to get the baby checked over and for support. You might as well do it before your neighbour goes one step further and calls the police or SS. As well they might.

I know you say you need alone time but that baby didn’t ask to be born and he needs you to protect him.

Did you ask why your friend thinks the baby needs to see a dr? It seems like you haven’t actually witnessed your DS hurting him because you’re leaving them alone together — I think you might want to consider that the baby could be seriously hurt. Broken bone, etc. And please stop leaving them unsupervised. I appreciate you’re struggling to cope but the baby’s wellbeing must be paramount.

Op he’d want that reaction because he’s 4 and 3 months ago his whole world as he knew it came crashing down about his ears and he doesn’t like it! He blames his baby brother for that and you! Therefore he’s going to do everything in his power to get the attention he is craving and show you exactly who he blames for spoiling his safe and comfortable life...In amongst this he’s also been witness to bad parental behaviour and started school. It’s no wonder he’s acting out!
Firstly he MUST not be left alone at any time with the baby. The baby is defenceless and must be protected as a first priority. Forget getting a bath unless you the baby is sleeping and your 4 ye old at school. Or even get a friend/parent round to sit with baby whilst you get a shower. I had 3 under 3 when my 3rd was born...I only got a shower if my husband was there to watch the children or before they got up...even if that meant 5am.
Secondly, speak to your 4yr olds teacher - they can help him with changes and behaviour and discuss caring and loving behaviours etc. They will want to help.
Thirdly, speak to your HV about home start - they could come and help you and give you some practical tips.
Fourthly you MUST get out with baby - get to a toddler group and get some support from other Mums.
Fifthly get the baby back to the GP and see if there is any reason for the crying. Good luck!!

You need to have a bath when your oldest is at school

A bath does not take 2 minutes.

When the children are asleep in the evenings, can you get a lock high up on the babies room door so your oldest cant get in there?

How is your child at school?
He needs help, i think you all do.

You need to talk to someone today

I’m glad to see you posting again Verrie. There is lots of help and support on here. And your health visitor and GP can also help.

I would start by seeing your GP. Maybe when your 4 year old is at school tomorrow. Get the baby checked out.

Talk to your neighbour. Ask her what she meant. Tell her you are struggling a bit.

Talk to your health visitor.

You need to stop leaving your baby alone to cry when he's distressed because you've ran out of things to try to comfort him. A one off is fine but you can't do this regularly.

i will go mad if i cannot just have those 2 minutes
But you won’t go mad if your 4yo kills or severely disables your 3mo? You having a breakdown is better than your baby ending up with a life changing or potentially fatal injury. If you can’t cope with your children safely then you can’t cope. Coping by doing unsafe things is not an option. You need to contact your HV and get help before your baby ends up injured or worse.

Then don't bath then if that's your attitude because you cannot leave a 4 year old child with a baby who is being hurt it takes a second for him to seriously injure the child. My daughter once put a Cushion on the baby's head and sat on it she was 17 months. If it wasn't for the fact I had only left the room for a minute to get a bottle and come back he probably would of suffocated. If you can't cope talk to your health visitor or even social services and ask them for some help, you cannot carry on like this.

I know it’s hard but I would be a lot less worried about missing out on me time than a) my four year old might have actually seriously hurt the baby if they won’t stop crying and b) that my neighbour might take matters into their own hands.

There are ways and means to get through these days. They aren’t easy but you can develop techniques and routines. You will not be able to have a bath and leave them together. Dream on. You will have to suck it up. Even if the four year old hurting the baby wasn’t occurring that would be foolish as anything could happen.

I would also urge you to take matters into your hands as any responsible mother would, and see your HV and GP and outline all of this clearly. You won’t be blamed if you seek out help and are transparent but if you are not then you will be. And if something happens you could have prevented you won’t be able to live with yourself.

Please act today.

And also I agree baby needs to be seen by doctor if the baby is crying all the time he could have colic or something you just need to accept some help because your older son will become worse, what are you doing to punish him atm when he's hurting the baby?

Can't you put the baby in the cot and shut the door so the child can't get in? Otherwise, you need to be watching them at all times, there isn't any other way around it. Poor baby.

Where is the baby's dad? Can't he take him when you need a break?

You need help and you need it fast, I'd be calling your HV pronto and seeing what they suggest.

You could also get a sling for the baby, will help to stop him from crying as he's on you and you can still do other things and tend your older son.

If your older one is at school then you've got all that time during the day for a bath so shouldn't need to have so don't have to do it when he's there and can access the baby.

I'm confused.. do they have the same dad? Despite your older one experiencing violence from him and needing a course of therapy?

OP, you poor thing.

The bath is not the issue. Don’t leave them on their own at all. Have a bath when your eldest is at school. You can get time to yourself then too. Take baby to the loo with you - get a cheap bouncer for bathroom.

Make an appointment with the GP. Get them to check baby over and tell them you need help. With a baby under 1 you are top priority and will get help.

You can get through this and it will get better but please, please ask for help. It is ok and understandable that you aren’t coping.