"We shouldn't tell new parents what life is like after the birth, it'll only scare them"...

[fillyjonk]

said a high-ranking NCT co-volunteer to me today

I think this is crappy on so many levels

If we can prepare women for the birth, an intense and highly subjective experience, then SURELY we can prepare them for life with a newborn. Breastfeeding classes (and I mean a proper in depth course, NOT a half hour slotted into the NCT classes, tricks for soothing a screaming baby, a proper discussion of depression/isolation etc etc after birth...NONE of these are really covered properly in NCT classes, let alone NHS classes.

Oh I dunno, what do you all think?

What do you mean by this:

"Certainly a good percentage put up and shut up. That is NOT the same thing."

I haven't read whole thread - so apologies if this is not the deal. I had v tough time with new babe. Wouldn't sleep at all (still hasn't 2 years later - aarrggghhh) found whole thing ghastly. think birth is dead easy compared to having babe at home with you. Let's face it, during birth you are surrounded by professionals and that baby is coming out one way or another. Being at home with no family or advice around you is sooooo scary

that is my experience

a lot of people feel unable to share things with their nct group

i am not saying that was the case for YOUR group. Certainly some groups do bond really well, and this is not an issue

but for many groups, definately there is a conspiracy of silence around the early days, no one wants to admit they are not coping.

I think that women need personalised support. From midwives who aren't under pressure, doulas etc. Friends, mothers, positive people around them who can encourage and support without undermining. They need not to feel alone and to be supported to grow confidently into their new role. But a generalised "this is what it can be like" when half those things may not happen to you and may just panic you - that approach I'm not so sure about.

Oh Ok i get what you mean. These were people who were close friends. We were pretty honest and we met frequently and have kept in contact over the years. I do think it was 50:50. Of course you'll hear more about the extremes; that's natural.

Having been through difficult times as a parent & having had times of needing emotional support I think in a class you can only really say that how someone feels is valid. Anything else has to be individual. How would you propose to tell people about the first 6 weeks. The woman who visited us told us about her experience- which was bloody dreadful-and no help; much more helpful would have been - you may be on a rollercoaster, you may be happy you may feel dreadful, you may feel exhausted, so get a nap when you can. We did get some of that.

People's circumstance will partly dictate post birth. DS1's was blissful, ds2;s was bloody awful , he was ill for the first 8 weeks, when he was 2 weeks old we were told ds1 was almost certainly autistic, ds1 regressed dramatically- it was hell on earth, but other experiences would have been irrelevant there.

oh i agree.

but a good percentage don't HAVE that

thats why they turn to the nct for childbirth classes. IMO most of the information woudl be just as well delivered by a doula/midwife or whatever

Also, IMO if you have a girl, things are sooo much easier. They sleep better and are generally calmer than boys. The rot sets in at about 3 years for a girl when mummuies of boys can look on in smugness and think " well that's ok because I have had 3 years of no sleep, running off walls, bouncing off beds and hanging off curtains!"

Agree absolutely NFK.

I know a lot of NCT groups don't bond. Ours did. Perhaps that's why we found it easier?

see thats the other problem with the nct

the quality of speakers, shall we say, varies widely. There is pretty much no vetting, no training

i think a talk on pnd could be most helpful. but if you all went away thinking that pnd was a fairly likely outcome then that is not good either.

"Breastfeeding classes (and I mean a proper in depth course, NOT a half hour slotted into the NCT classes, tricks for soothing a screaming baby, a proper discussion of depression/isolation etc etc after birth...NONE of these are really covered properly in NCT classes..."
what evidence do you have for that statement Filly? speaking as an NCT teacher.
bf takes a full two hours, not half an hour.
for example.

ROFL at stressteddy

BIT of a generalisation there, don't you think?

i had a colicky girl, and an easyish boy

i meant round HERE, hcc.

I wasn't saying that the NCT only does a half hour class

I was saying that a half hour is inadequate if thats all thats being offered. As it was to us.

Now its variable, some classes have longer, some don't.

"the quality of speakers, shall we say, varies widely. There is pretty much no vetting, no training"
filly, sweetie.
the training is long and hard. it has taken me three years. it is effectively two years of a university degree
there are strict requirements for keeping up to date.
there are strict requirements for being observed every year.
I am not the NCT's biggest fan in fact I am royally pissed off with them right now but this just isn't true

Agree t'is generalisation - but i have yet to be proven wrong!!!
did you have boy or girl first? I believe it does make a difference!

well every single NCT antenatal teacher should be teaching a 2hours worth of bf.
or bringing in a bf counsellor to do it

Are NCT people medically trained?

oh and re the postnatal stuff - I speak to a lot of NCT antenatal teachers and there is (of course) a variety of views about how to teach.
BUT almost universally classes report that they were not taught enough postnatal stuff.
even if they were
because women/couples find it hard to focus beyond the birth

noooo I don't think a talk on PND is helpful. It's helpful to those who develop PND but not others- why scare the shit out of them?

I'ts like me presented with someone who's child has just been dxed with autism- what I never do is tell them my story because it would scare the living daylights out of them. I tell them about children I know who have done well and give them practical advice about where to get help and advice. I loathe being asked "and how is your son doing now?" because I have to try and wriggle out of the answer.

Same with PND- tell them "if you get PND blah blah blah" but why scare the bejeezus out of everyone at a vulnerable time?

stressteddy I had a boy- and my postbirth experience was heaven! Sorry!

the course in antenatal teaching is part medical/part educational theory.
there are compulsory study days on obstetric issues and an exam on medical/midwifery/obstetric issues.
but that isn't really the focus.
though some teachers are midwives or ex midwives

I still think it's the lack of looking after not the technical info that women don't get and which can make things seem so bad.

what also concerns me , is that everyone i know , who is involved in the NCT, is disillusioned and ticked off with it..and this is the biggest , national provider of ante natal classes, no? and has a terrible reputation....i agonised about training as an antenatal teacher with them, for months, and decided not to.....but it is disconcerting that they don;t seem to do a better job

i am sure that you can have a fantastic teacher like harpsi or girrafeski, and then get someone else who is just not up to scratch

and leaves you feeling unprepared

My impression was the NCT was either loved or hated by people who'd used it. I know people who rave and people who shudder when it's mentioned. It's a very specific type of organisation and won't suit everybody.

Why would you pay for classes with people who might not be medically trsined? Or out of date with medical practice/ I just don't understand it
Also, everyone I know (and I am not exagerrating here) who has attended NCT classes has has a c section)

As I said before - the birth always happens one way or another - you are surrounded by professionals
It's the first few weeks that are a nightmare. But that's just my opinion
If you have lots of family poppng in every day and people around you then I'm sure it's a different story
I wished mine had been - because I'm never having another and the whole thing has put me off

they were pretty good with the medical stuff stressteddy! Our NCT teacher had had a section - which was helpful. She was great actually and she initiated the early days of group bonding (arranging the first few get togethers, then a meetup etc).