Toddler and newborn...How??? Support thread?

[Suchanamateur]

I am in the very early days of having a newborn (9 days old) and an almost 2 yr old DS and am seriously struggling at the thought of DH going back to work in the next few days - for a number of reasons. I had a taste of it yesterday when DH had to go into the office, unexpectedly, for much of the day.

DS is an absolute joy and I totally loved the few weeks of maternity leave pre DD when we just hung out all week. But now he is in total Mummy rejection mode and terribly teary. Utterly understandable but quite upsetting.

DD is a sweet little froggy newborn, doing froggy newborn things - eating, sometimes sleeping - and mostly at inconvenient times. I had a really awful time in the early months of my DS and the scars run deep (plus PND) - so every time I can get her to nap, I can feel huge waves of anxiety washing over me. I know they are different children, but I can't help project into a future where she doesn't sleep, night or day, and wonder how I will manage - I used to walk DS in a sling for hours and hours outside but that isn't an option with two of them. It was only at around 6 months when we did some sleep training that thing started to even out a bit with DS, and then got wonderful and I understood how you might actually enjoy being a mother. Six months seems an age away!

DD is currently cluster feeding without stop from about 5/6 until 10 ish. I can just about handle the clustering later in the evening, but I've got no idea how I handle DS dinner, bath and bed with a baby clamped to me and DS saying 'Mummy no' at everything..

I know pretty much the answer to all this is grit teeth, ride it through and this too shall pass. But wondering if anyone in a similar situation wanted to join in to help it pass? Or provide wise words and comfort from somewhere out the other side?

It's ok potty refusers, it would appear to have been a blip.

Ds has kept his trousers and nappy firmly on pm. Went into meltdown when I tried to put some pants on him.

Dd is continuing to have a poo explosion every day, but I don't learn, and keep putting her in clothes I'd actually like her to wear for longer than an hour or so.

Hello everyone, can I join you? DD1 2.5, DD2 4 weeks. All was going well until 2 weeks ago when DD2 woke up from her newborn sleepy stage and started screaming. DD1 is absolutely petrified of the crying and starts screaming too. Nothing I've tried is helping (distraction, cuddles, ignoring her, getting her to help with the baby, getting angry with her etc etc). I just dont know how to cope any more. DH works till 9pm so it's scream-fest from wake up time to bed time and I'm doing it all alone. DD1 has also started protest shitting in the bath despite being fully potty trained.

Today I burst into tears on a woman I don't know very well when she asked how it was going. I'm sure things will improve; they have to. But when!?

Sorry for the self indulgent post.

hancat since there is absolutely no room for self indulgence in real life, be as self indulgent as you need to here. That's my excuse for earlier extremely self indulgent post, and my DH is around most evenings to help so really shouldn't complain.

Right everyone, we're all in need of some chilling out, so if you haven't already, check out the Dalek Relaxation tape on YouTUbe.

hancat that sounds tough, we all pretty much vent here and largely self-indulgent posts, but that's the point of the thread. Reading others in the same boat makes us feel better in a backwards way. When the rest of the world is busy putting on it's perfect front, here we are saying what is thought behind closed doors.

suchan i find the hardest days are for no reason, just wake up wrong IYSWIM.

DD is ill but at least DH is off both bank holidays. for DS not getting it.

Aw Such I hope tomorrow is a better day for you. And you, Hancat, don't be afraid of having a good old moan on here when you need to. Sometimes it is just helpful to know how many of us are in the same situation and that it is perfectly normal to struggle. There is so much pressure to put on a brave face all the time - so much guilt if you don't. If you read through the thread though there have been lots of helpful suggestions and encouragement from people further down the line with two. And for me it just helps me feel less alone! Those long hours of the night, just me and a griping baby - MN helps me feel a lot less bleak!

Right, I'm off for an insanely early night, leaving DH to cope for the first shift. Beginning to think my fifteen cups of tea a day may not exactly be helping, if I don't get a bit more sleep tonight I'm going to have to cut down. Seems ridiculous to be suffering on under 3 hours as a result of something preventable when last night DS2 actually went three and then two hours between feeds. Although DS1 did also have the night terrors in between... And DH was snoring... And then I needed a wee...

If I replace the tea with gin that should be fine, right?

hancat - moan away, it makes all of us feel more normal!

Suchan, sorry it's such a nightmare still. It's surprising how little people tend to understand the emotional impact of being tied to 2 children 24/7 with no proper sleep for months, and expect us to function normally. For DP, a break is a night out, for me, it's a few hours with just one child while catching up with housework. :( (or lazing on the internet, I'll be honest!) I've negotiated a few hours of shopping on my own tomorrow, I don't know what I'll do with myself, it'll be so bizarre. First time alone in 6 weeks.

That said, this is a relatively easy week as DP is on his hols and we're battling the rainy days together. DD1 loves the extra attention, but DS2 has been very restless and infacol not helping him anymore with what appears to be stomach cramps throughout the day. On the plus side, he is slowly moving from eating every 2-3 hours to every 3-4, and settling in his moses basket instead of our bed, so that's progress at least.

Welcome Hancat! Totally agree with everyone else, it's a welcome relief to be able to be completely honest about how things are going so go for it.

Hope you are okay Suchan, and you manage to get some rest tonight.

Thanks everyone for the BLW advice. Another question, do you have to be completely purist about it or can you do a combo of puree and finger food? DS2 is a hungry wee thing and I think he will benefit from getting a bit of food in his stomach (two hourly feeds all night last night, I was not happy!)

On a positive note both boys were asleep just after 7pm tonight; DS2 has got much better at self settling. So pleased with the progress he's made, no more feeding to sleep and when we were out today he actually slept in the buggy when he was supposed to! (I'll take the small victories, the days prior he basically didn't nap at all and he was SO grumpy). Fingers crossed for a better night tonight, Lord knows I need the sleep!

Just a thought Such but can you at least manage expectations a bit regarding the weekend? Eg negotiate in advance that GPs will take both children to park or take DS and DH take Dd (can your DH carry dd in sling?) for a few hours in the morning so you can get an uninterrupted nap in? Ensure everyone is clear on this because there's not much point going unless you will get a bit of a break whilst you're there.

I think you may be reaching the stage my friend did with her colicky baby last time round (he screamed A LOT) where because he was marginally better with her (although still v high maintenance) she found it really hard to be apart from him at all or "let" anyone else even attempt to deal with him when he was upset (most of the time, poor wee thing- although he DID grow out of it!!!) But you do need a tiny bit of non-contact time! Training GPs & DH not to automatically pass her back to you when she starts grizzling is important. She is big enough to survive a couple of hours without feeding even if she doesn't particularly want to. Dealing with a screaming baby is really hard work and just because you have the boobs doesn't mean it has to be you 100% of the time. I think it sounds as though your need for sleep may be becoming more important. It's not unreasonable to prioritise that for a day or two in order to feel more on top of things. I would say that is the main difference in my experience with DS2 - because I need to function for DS1 as well I have felt less guilty about leaving him and sleeping when I have really needed to. I know it's so much easier for me to do that now I'm not BFing but even if someone brought her up to you in bed to feed and then took her away out of earshot again in between you might be able to get enough rest to tip you back over the line IYSWIM.

Wow that was the worst night's sleep ever. DS2 woke every 45 mins from 12am. Managed to settle him without feeding until 5.30am but it took a while each time and I'm consequently knackered. No idea what happened or why he's suddenly having such terrible self settling issues mid-sleep when he's doing so much better with his naps. Any ideas - maybe time to start weaning?

I second Grumpla's advice Such, if you can get any time for yourself to spend however you wish (including asleep without any interruptions) then you must take the opportunity. It will help you feel less trapped and more able to deal with things - in my experience at least. I hope you got more rest than I did last night and you're feeling much better this morning.

Looby, your ds2 is the same age as my dd isn't he? Do you think it's the dreaded 4 month sleep regression? Dd's ben awful this week. Takes ages to settle - wants comfort-tit to the point where I was battling with her over my own boob last night; slide the little finger in to break the suction, only she sucks harder! She's also hitting that really special point where you've just got downstairs and poured a glass of wine, thinking she's out, then she starts again.

DD is also struggling to slip back into sleep easily after middle of the night feeds. Like you, I'm kind of wondering whether to offer food - especially as she keeps trying to grap it - but don't know if 5 months is too early for BLW. SHe hasn't got any teeth, and DS had a couple by now.

Perhaps we should hide this from people that are still waiting for the 3 month mark miracle!

Agree with having not just time but space away from dcs if you can. I always find that if I go for a nap and they're all in the house, i spend too much time listening to see what I can hear --then running downstairs tosigh painfully and say, "see, I told you it was pointless trying to sleep."

Ds is on top whining form this morning and we've only been downstairs an hour. Visit to Nain and Taid's is in order I think.

I think so Astro, 5 months one week or thereabouts. He already went through the four month sleep regression, surely it's not a second round?? (rhetorical question, I know anything is possible with these babies).

DS1 is also incredibly whiny this morning and have just had a fight with DH who apparently gets as little sleep as me and thinks we shouldn't let DS2 sleep at all during the day because he's obviously getting too much. When I said no he told me my problem is that I complain and then won't listen to instruction. Fuming is about right.

Jesus H, Looby if my DH said that to me after a sleepless night his problem would be having to drive himself to A&E one handed, holding his knackers on with the other! Why the fuck should you be "taking instruction" anyway?!? on your behalf.

Nursery day for me today thank god, DH away until midnight or thereabouts but feeling okayish as slept properly for an hour or so in the early evening, and then 6am-8am, this counteracting the THREE HOUR night feed / burpathon from DS2 followed immediately by DS1 wandering into our room at 5am with a leaking nappy demanding Telly and tooooaaaasssst... Maybe the way to survive this is to give up on sleep between the hours of 1am and 6 entirely and just nap - does only seem plausible if I tie one / both to a tree at the bottom of the garden on non-nursery days though...and never spend an evening with my husband ever again...

Yeah I know Grumpla, I was ropable. Apparently he meant that I don't listen to any of his ideas when it comes to DS2. He is very tired also, he did apologise and we both have very short fuses at the moment. But I still told him not to come home until he can have a constructive conversation with me. I am too tired to deal with his oversensitivity.

Discovered DS1 was whiny because he was hungry - that's what you get when you refuse to eat your breakfast I guess. Cue a sausage, hot cross bun, grapes and a peanut butter sandwich and he's his usual delightful self again and has now happily gone down for his nap. He definitely takes after his mother in the behaviour when needing food department!

DS2 also asleep...think I will postpone lunch in favour of my own nap.

Thanks for the warm welcome. Been trying to spare a hand to post again but both hands occupied pretty much constantly since I last posted. I definitely agree with Grumpla about not feeling you're the only one who can look after an unsettled DD, such. I made that mistake with my first and didn't get time away from her until she was 18 months old. Regret it now!

Totally with you about whiny = hungry looby. My dd gets like that mud afternoon and juice or a snack always sorts her out. DH still hasn't cottoned on to this, despite me telling him, and if they're alone all afternoon, I invariably return to find starving and VERY whiny DD, and DH complaint she's being difficult.

(Sorry for typos)

Oh yes I'm just the same. I often find that if I start being whiny and difficult DH will disappear and return with tea and snacks!

He used to say "you're being whiny and difficult, are you hungry?" before realising that was not the solution

I'm glad it's not just my DH who trots out the 'I think he's hungry' line whenever DS2 starts fussing while he's holding him. God I wish men had boobs sometimes

To be fair, so do a lot of men

It's all the more funny apt as my DH had gynecomastia in his early twenties and had to have a mastectomy......he should have kept it.... (I doubt it 'worked' though)

Sorry been absent. Having a bugger of a time. Dd has her 5th cold in 10w's... So sleep is shit. Ds found an Easter egg and has been on a chocolate high all morning and I've got bloody mastitis... Also having been reassured about dd's dimple, gp this morning made me panic again. Apparently it's not the problem with the depth of dimple/ seeing base thing. It's that there is a kink in her spine next to the dimple. She said she'd been thinking about it and hoped it wasn't as bad as she'd thought.. Wtf! And when I told her the apt is not til end of June, she asked if we had thought about going privately.. So now off to see how much a private pead costs as not knowing for 3 months is going to do my head in...

Oh bollocks mrsrvc you poor thing. Hope the mastitis clears up soon I hear it is vile.

Is there someone else you could talk to re your daughter's dimple? It sounds like your GP isn't being very clear (or reassuring!) which is probably just about the last thing you need right now. Try not to worry too much.

Looby I am resisting the urge to google that, I have twenty minutes to clear the decks before nursery pickup and can't afford to get sucked into obscure medical trivia!

Aargh I meant Mistress there obviously.

Although if Looby 's DH also has some obscure medical conditions for me to google, that will keep me occupied at the 2am-5am feed tonight

Without wishing to ruin your medical googling Grumpla - gynecomastia just means man-boobs, but proper medical ones as opposed to flab-related ones . Basically he had one normal 'pec' and one proper sticky-outy boob (before I met him - must have looked v odd). It's something to do with hormones I think...