Toddler and newborn...How??? Support thread?

[Suchanamateur]

I am in the very early days of having a newborn (9 days old) and an almost 2 yr old DS and am seriously struggling at the thought of DH going back to work in the next few days - for a number of reasons. I had a taste of it yesterday when DH had to go into the office, unexpectedly, for much of the day.

DS is an absolute joy and I totally loved the few weeks of maternity leave pre DD when we just hung out all week. But now he is in total Mummy rejection mode and terribly teary. Utterly understandable but quite upsetting.

DD is a sweet little froggy newborn, doing froggy newborn things - eating, sometimes sleeping - and mostly at inconvenient times. I had a really awful time in the early months of my DS and the scars run deep (plus PND) - so every time I can get her to nap, I can feel huge waves of anxiety washing over me. I know they are different children, but I can't help project into a future where she doesn't sleep, night or day, and wonder how I will manage - I used to walk DS in a sling for hours and hours outside but that isn't an option with two of them. It was only at around 6 months when we did some sleep training that thing started to even out a bit with DS, and then got wonderful and I understood how you might actually enjoy being a mother. Six months seems an age away!

DD is currently cluster feeding without stop from about 5/6 until 10 ish. I can just about handle the clustering later in the evening, but I've got no idea how I handle DS dinner, bath and bed with a baby clamped to me and DS saying 'Mummy no' at everything..

I know pretty much the answer to all this is grit teeth, ride it through and this too shall pass. But wondering if anyone in a similar situation wanted to join in to help it pass? Or provide wise words and comfort from somewhere out the other side?

Poo explosion here! Poo explosion here! Poo explosion here!

She pooed on mon, so I wasn't expecting one for a wweek or so. Luckily ew were at home and it's bath night. Ds found it hilarious. Hope it comes off my coloured jeans. And the bouncy chair. And the carpet.

we are now back home. The week at my mum's was mixed but mostly because we all had a DnV bug which meant I rarely put DS down and DD was more clingy. Bedtimes were all over the place but my mum was able to do DD a few nights by herself. My mum had five children of various sleeper types and even she was shocked at DSs refusal to go to sleep, but largely I think because I hadn't mentioned it really. Funny how the second time you get on with it a lot more.

sending sleep well vibes to all and sorry for lack of speaking to other people, just a lot has happened since I last posted properly.

Marvellous night here.

Both babies in bed at 7. Are they asleep? Are they fuck. Doing a tag team of (ds) banging on the door until we put him back in bed and (dd) crying because I've had the temerity to remove my nipple from her precious little mouth and put her in her cot, like I do every night.

Patience is almost worn out. Am getting very cross; especially because there is no one I can have a big shout at.

Primal screams for all. The babyvine is doing a marvellous job of leaving a wake of virus and vomit destruction in its wake. We are at the mild end of the scale, with only streaming rivers of green snot- but still means I'm in DS' room patting him to sleep, waiting for DD to start yelling.

I'm afraid I took my frustration out on a random stranger today who I thought was looking at me askance as I fed DD in a cafe. Very unlike me, I asked her what the fuck she was looking at. She left very soon after. I'm hoping she went home to her husband and told him that a very tired and hormonal mother swore at her, rather than thinking I was just an aggressive syco. I kind of wanted to swear at the mother of a 10 week old at DS' nursery today who turned to me and said 'the second time round it's just so magic isn't it?' Er. No. It's just as bad as the first time, but with a huge amount more pressure. And of course now I feel guilt for not feeling the Phil Daniels and Debbie magic.

If you haven't already, worth checking out the parental guilt thread- I reckon most of us can empathise. My favourite post was something along the lines of 'cut me and I bleed guilt'.

I've resorted to CAlpol . In my defence, although her cheeks weren't actually red and hot, her cry was of pain and her fingers were in her mouth.

It's worked.

Suchan, I reckon the woman at nursery has probably been partaking of an early morning mummy juice. When my (childfree as yet) friend visited after dd was born and kept asking me how it was with two, I kept repeating:

'fucking tiring'.
'Happy tiring?' She pursued, doe eyed and hopeful.
'No; just fucking tiring.' I reiterated, whilst cramming yet more chocolate biscuits into my hollow-eyed, pasty face.
'But you are happy though, right?' She asked, with just a hint of desperation in her voice.

I thought for a minute, then closed the front door to get back to my (then) wailing 2 week old and foot-stamping 2 year old.

"It's just so magic" ?!?!?

What the ACTUAL FUCK!?!?

I hate her.

No more vomit, just total dinner refusal, about eight hundred smacks (I was the receiver, not the giver... And OH HOW I LONG TO SMACK HIM BACK SOMETIMES) and a nice row with DH to round things off. We'd just made up after that when bombshell dropped he's off to work at 2 and back about midnight tomorrow. YAY.

Today started so well. I got dressed and everything.

Grrr. I'm off to bed. Full of rage and snot.

Downstairs feeding DS2 and I can hear DS1 coughing from here

Crossing everything for no more puking tonight...

DH has succumbed and has been vomiting all morning. DS2 is still being sick everywhere although managing to keep the odd feed down. DS1 is no longer being sick but is very out of sorts, we have also resorted to calpol too but yet to see the effect.

I am very tired after a night of many small feeds, vomiting, clothing and bedding changes and washing. Also suspect it's only a matter of time for me, I mean after the number of times I've been vomited all over now it would surely be a miracle otherwise?!

Oh girls.
I'm sorry to hear the pesky virus is hitting you all. If its the same one we had it was really only 48hrs (each...) but it's pretty bloody hideous.
My parents came up for the day yesterday and dh decided to take the day off. It was lovely, but tbh I'd rather have the help spread out a bit.
Repayment today as I am writing this while having a pedicure. Bliss. Coffee, no wailing children and someone razor ing the dead skin off my feet. I reckon i'll loose a couple of pounds they are so manky.
Hilariously I asked dh what he was going to do whole I was out, his reply was well I can't do anything, I'll have both of them!!! But yet, I am supposed to do everything while looking after both of them. He doesn't even see why I need ds in childcare for two miserly mornings a week!
Plans for the weekend scuppers by other friends having dreaded vomiting bug, so actually might get some stuff done.
Hope you all have good weekends, and get rid of the dreaded viruses.
Rx

Oh mrs that would annoy me!

So the last two mornings I've put dd2 down in her cot whilst getting dd1 and I up. She seems to like it which is great for when we move her there for sleeping.

However the big issue is that dd1 can climb in it too! She's only two but very agile. I can't believe she can get up there though! She then obviously can't get down.

Umm, anyone else have this? I was thinking the cot would keep dd2 safe. Guess I'll just have to move cot down to bottom setting which is a lot less cute and a lot more annoying. Grr.

Feeling very sorry for those with the virus and desperately hoping we don't get it over here!

we have the cot on the lowest setting otherwise DD can climb in too. This seems to put her off so she just climbs on the side and looks in from there.

Your toddlers are all really agile! DS1 is a tallish 2.5yo and shows no signs of climbing either in or out of his cot. Bit of a pain actually as DS2 is going to outgrow his moses basket soon and then he'll be turfed out of it

Can I join please! DS1 was 2 years spot on when ds2 was born 5 months ago. really get your worry about nap times etc. ds1 was a nightmare for the first 6 months. really projected onto ds2. eventually it clicked they are TOTALLY different. Ds2 is an ace sleeper but really poor feeder. this was a nightmare for the first four months as I worriedly tried to get more calories in him so he wouldn't wake in the night. even quit bf as thought bottle would be easier. feed times lasted hours and poor ds1 would watch ALOT of mr tumble. finally it hit me, despite every one else telling me this from the start, he doesn't need that much. once I accepted this lifes been so much easier and I'm enjoying my children and they have a non stress head for a mum. I was so worried about him repeating brothers issues ( was hungry until on solids, didn't realise as gained good weight, but as soon as weaned weight gain jumped and he slept) I invented a problem that was never there. he doesnt each much but still sleeps well.

Know its a way of but the one time he does eat alot is in the evening. I've weaned him early but not fully. He has normal feeds for him at 7,11,3. I then give him tea at 5 and he takes a full 8 oz at 630. dont want him to cut back on his milk so leaving the other meals until 6 months but might help you if hes still clustering later on. might also be clustering in the evening as milk supply often low then. might be worth talking to mw about improving/checking milk supply as if it is that it might give you a little more freedom.

astronaut haven't started potty training yet either for exactly the same reasons. feel like I've just got into the groove and don't want to rock the boat. think ought to try this fortnight as all groups etc cancelled so round the house alot. any tips from people who've been there done that with 2 most welcome!

Hello tricksy, I have a DS1 2.8 and DS2 5w and we are a long way off being able to potty train too!

Had lots of comments whilst pg with DS2 about not having two in nappies which made me feel a bit narked too as a) DS1 showing precisely NO signs of being ready to train and b) had really shit SPD, could barely move, the idea of lifting chunky toddler on/off potty or toilet, bending over to scrub floors etc was just laughable.

Are you doing anything to try and prepare for training? We have a potty out in the bathroom, and talk / offer it to him regularly, he is adamant he doesn't want it.

I'm considering putting him back in terry nappies now we're having decent drying weather... Think part of the problem is he doesn't 'feel' wet!

Well, we're a month in with this thread. How far have we come?

My doom about DDs sleeping seems not to have been misplaced. So far she is possibly worse than DS, which is getting me down. OTOH, DS when not I'll of cold seems to be taking things in his stride and while I'm certainly not his favourite person, nor am I enemy no 1. I've survived a bed and bathtime alone with only minimal damage to anyone. And I've learned that getting out is the answer..

Hope all the bugs and viruses are on the wane.

Thinking of trying the double buggy again as its currently gathering dust. Anyone with buggy refusers, do you think it's worth persevering? DS is going to stay with his GPs tonight and tomorrow and I was wondering about trying with the buggy then so he doesn't have to suffer through the screamathon.

I have the opposite problem Such, DS1 will not walk reliably and the double buggy I bought in a fit of insomnia is too big to fit through my door or even the pavements here... I feel really trapped when I have the two of them, just hoping my back improves once I've got back to see my physio so I can start slinging properly!

I like my double buggy (iCandy pear off eBay) I persuade dd1 (she'd like to walk but is a bolter and very fast) to like the pushchair with snacks/comics with stickers/fir comes/sparkly head bands etc! I do high street for chores and me and then park for her. We live right on high street though.

I am 5 weeks in. Dd1 too energetic and waking too early. Dd2 feeds every hour and a half and doesnt like to be put down. Sling inside helps sometimes. Nights are okay except for growth spurt days. Dd2 feeds often but tends to go down easily.

I am tired and miss my nice body and clothes.

Oh yes, I am tired too and DD doesn't like to be put down either. It's her who is buggy refuser- DS can be persuaded to do by thing with bribes...

It's been month already!? For us things have definitely improved. DS1 is now 2.3 and DS2 is five months. It has taken a while - til the last few weeks really - for me to feel totally unphased by looking after them both by myself. I have learned that DS1 needs as much exercise as possible and that DS2 will happily be entertained by him. Also that I continue to have little tolerance for tantrums but does anybody really?

I've also learned that I was doing the same as Tricksy mentioned in her post with feeding and it got me into an awful pattern of not feeding or sleeping well and feeling shattered for months. I feel now that putting DS2 into more of a routine has helped immensely and his sleeping has improved massively.

And I am turning a corner with post-traumatic stress/depression which has made the biggest difference I think. I do feel like I can enjoy having two now whereas before I felt like it was the hardest thing ever. Still not masses of time for myself but knowing how much things have improved over the last couple of months I feel like it might actually be possible one day soon (if only DS2 would take ANYTHING from a bottle!!!)

As far as double buggies go the P&T has been great for us, we need to get into shops and use public transport (no car) so it's ideal. We did have to put DS2 into the second seat at four months which isn't ideal but he had grown so much he was being squashed lying flat. He seems to really like it though, both of them will happily sleep in it and I almost never get any complaints when they go in it and we go out.

Potty training and putting DS1 into a bed will be the next challenges but tbh we're not in a hurry for either so will take it as it comesGivens he is showing signs of being ready to come out of his nappy soon we will give it a go sooner rather than later, will definitely be nice to cut the expense of one lot of nappies out!

Looby so pleased things are looking up for you. It helped lots last time when we got DS into a but of a routine (and I'd have said I wasn't a routiney person). So waiting until I think DD is old enough to start.

DS not well enough to be left at the GPs so I now have both all week- and no nursery because of Easter- wail. But posts like Looby's give me some hope that I might begin to enjoy this a bit at some point - and not feel sick at the prospect of the next week.

A month? Blimey!

Thanks Such for starting this thread. It has been enormously helpful to realise I am not alone.

It does also help me realise that yes, I have made progress! I haven't cried for three days now, my boobs don't hurt, I'm in non-maternity clothes (albeit two sizes bigger than usual!) and DS1 and I are beginning to have good moments as well as bad. We are all still poorly with this horrible cold but nevertheless I survived TEN HOURS on my own with both yesterday, including a bedtime for DS1 which DS2 was awake throughout. (Thanks for the suggestion of the bouncy chair in the bathroom, whichever genius thought that one up!)

Plus I have just gone crazy and bought an old, grubby Phil and Teds for £50 on ebay. Even if we only use it for a couple of months I reckon it will be worth it! If any of you ladies have a wide front door, drive a bus and want my massive EasyLife side-by-side all terrain tank for wine money + postage do please let me know otherwise it will just rot in the garage forever I suspect!

Now to go and have a celebratory cup of tea before DS1 wakes up from his nap.

Be strong, sisters! We can do it!

It's nice to be reminded of how old our dcs are, I think especially for those whose dc2s are so very, very little and see soem of us appearing to cope fairly well.

DD is 5 months next FRiday. 5 bloody months! And I'm already forgetting the hell of the early weeks, you'll be glad to know. In fact, I'd even forgotten that she spent the first 8 weeks of her life refusing to sleep lying and down and seeming to choke to death every time we put her down; I'd turn up to Toddlers and grab random mums, pleading: "Do you know what's wrong with her? Will it end soon?"

It did. By 10 weeks (2 weeks later than ds) she was in her cot, in her bed and I started to get stretches of at least 3 hours. After surviving the first bit, I feel like I can do the rest now. Even if it's taken an extra hour every night this week to get them both to stay in bed. At least we've had tea early tonight. WE usually have it afetr dcs are in bed, so I've had lukewarm tea all fucking week.

Ah well, babysitter tomorrow as DH does his sponsored stand up comedy set in a comedy club. I should worry about how a babysitter is going to deal with tehm both; especially if dd doesn't take a bottle. But do you know what? I won't be here, so it won't be my problem!

Oh, and last week walking back from Pilates (don't get excited, it's less than a 5 minute walk and quicker than driving!), I realised that I don't hurt all over anymore; I feel like I'm starting to 'own' my body again.

You can all assume that bedtime willbe hellish, so I won't come on after and complain.

Finally, suchan I'm glad I found this; it's nice to be able to have a whinge and know you're not alone.

Thanks should be to all you guys for joining me here and letting me vent my neurosis worries.

I had a minor epiphany just now. As i was walking DD aimlessly around in the sling trying to persuade her to sleep after a hellish, again, car journey, mildly contemplating whether I should ask GP to go back on ADs, a woman with screaming newborn approached me and proceeded to pour out her feeding and sleeping worries to me as only a new mother can, punctuated by pleading 'is this normal' questions. And it reminded me that though this is tough and in no way like the adverts, at least it's not the first time round.

Hope quiet bedtimes for all (ha ha- I can already hear snotty DS wailing at DH).

Ohh, what a night. (538am here in Oz.)
My DD, who is four weeks old, has been pretty good up to now. I have been breastfeeding but expressing mostly, til a few days ago I found for some reason I couldnt express, so she has been on the breast, which I dont like to be honest - I just dont enjoy it, find it hard and fioddly and so does she. Anyway, usually I feed her at 430, have a little play with her and two yr old DS, then she is ready to sit in her bouncy chair while I make his dinner and usually asleep by the time he has his bath at 630. Not tonight. She fed and fed and fed and fed, and when she wasnt being fed, or rocked, she screamed. I had to let her scream a bit while I got poor DS his dinner, then when I ran his bath and got him into his pjs. Then she cried and fed some more, then eventually I gave her a bottle of expressed milk that was in the fridge and she scoffed the whole thing. the milk coming directly out of me must have been horrible :(. So I put DS to bed when she finished her bottle, then she cries some more and 45 minutes later she is asleep.
DH works mostly nights, so I so the bed routine by myself a lot, but this is the first time it went so bad. It didnt help that I had been up since 430am - sometimes when DD has a 4am feed, DS hears us and wakes up, refusing to go back to sleep. As he was in bed later than usual last night - only by about 45 mins, but he is a creature of habit - I expected him to sleep a bit longer, but no, here we are.
So DD's midnight and early morning feeds were formula :(. I will probably use breast milk in the morning now and formjula for when she gets fussy. It seemed to work as she slept from midnight to 5am.
DH was no help. He has a cold - which we have ALL had, except DD. My DS got it, then I had it, now DH. I still have no voice although feel fine. But DH has it bigger and worse than any of us, and is either sleeping or at work at the moment. I am too tired to bother objecting. Also if I am upset about something (as I was last night when he got home) he goes into :Its just one of those things, why are you getiting all worked up". He said last night to me, "Maybe your body just doesnt work that way" re breastfeeding :( as DS was mix fed from this age too.
Sigh. And the washing machine is broken so I have to take a weeks worth of laundry to the laundrette later on!

Sorry for the essay...

Frizzy sorry that sounds rough. There is nothing wrong with your milk though. I think a lot of babies get fussy in the evenings about 3/4 weeks for a while (DD certainly does) and then they get overtired and don't feed properly. They get milk so much quicker and more easily from the bottle that they will often take it more easily at this time. Not sure if that's any consolation at all.

Can't believe the lurgy and virus-ness is all the way over with you too! Hope you get a repeat of midnight to 5 tonight