War - what does it really mean ?

[Tillysmummy]

Im feeling very worried and sad about this today. Is anyone else feeling like this - silly question im sure most people are. I am very nervous about the implications. Its amazing how since having my daughter all these emotions and fears are heightened I guess out of an instinct to protect her.
I'd be very interested in other's opinions and feelings.

Yes I am too Tillysmummy.I've been convinced all along that if it starts it will quickly escalate into something huge - hope that I am really wrong though.We are obviously a bit closer than the UK to Iraq and theres a lot of talk here about the chemical aspect and wether or not they will "reach" here.
I was dissappointed to see that Caire Short has not stuck to her thraet to resign and can't understand now why she said it.Could someone also explain to me what will happen if the govt. vote against British involement in the vote tonight?( not that it will make much difference I'm sure Bush will go in on his own)
I was told today that Bush (USA) are offering to pay Bulgarian soldiers who will go to fight.I have no idea if this is true but it was told to me by a Bulgarian woman I know who is beside herself with worry because her son is doing his national service in the Bulgarian army at the moment.

GRMUM

It's a nightmare isn't it. Where are you based ?
I agree about Claire Short.
The whole thing is such a fiasco. It's so sad and worrying for so many people with loved ones fighting - I am lucky not to have anyone directly involved. I can't work out whether I think it's the right thing or not. I despise Tony Blair's jumping on the bandwaggon, puppy dog behaviour but at the same time can't see the alternative to end this situation.

I agree with you Tillysmummy and can't decide if it's the right thing or not. I'm not for a war, but at the same time I'm not sure that we should just sit back and wait for a catastrophe to happen. I can sympathis with America wanting to take steps after Sept 11th and wonder would we feel the same if we had experienced the something similar on our own doorstep? My dh works in the city and I worry every day about his safety. We both already avoid taking the tube, but we are fortunate to have that choice. It's such a nice sunny day out there and everyone is going about their business in a normal fashion that it's hard to imagine what might be on the horizon. I feel really sad for all the troops who look so fresh faced and if it does happen I just hope it's over quick.

I really don't want a war, but I have to disagree about TB's 'jumping on the bandwagon' - whilst in the past he has sometimes seemed to be doing the 'popular' thing, I think he really is doing what he believes is right. He has been the only one really pushing for a democratic solution - the US would have gone to war months ago without TB, and the French would rather do nothing, to preserve their economic interests in the Iraqi oil.

So whilst I hope and pray that we get through this without a war, or if we must have one, it is short and with as little suffering as possible, I want to congratulate TB on his integrity and courage.

I sometimes wonder if the reason that I am so scared is because of who is in charge over the ponod... I think that I would have felt better if this was Clinton-led and not Bush (GW)-led.

Sometimes I think I'm the only person in the country who believes Tony Blair when he says that there is a strong moral case for ousting Saddo. And Ann Clwyd's (spelling?) arguments for war.

I guess we can all agree in fervently hoping the war will be over quickly.

What it really means is that a lot of people will die. I feel disgusted with Blair and have emailed my MP to say so today.

Totally agree re claire Short- how can she be such a hypocrite !!! Whether you are pro or anti war her behaviour is appalling. I hope her constituents remember that at the next election. My children were asking this morning if they would be evacuated to the country, as someone at school had told them the war was going to start today. Luckily I could reassure them that as we live in the country we wouldnt be going anywhere but showed me how even little ones pick things up and stew about them.

For me it means that I will have endless sleepless nights about the safelt of my dh who is a pilot in the RAF. I can honestly say that neither he, nor any of our friends want a war, but sometimes a small evil is better than a big one. A dreadful thing to have to write. I can honestly say that I do not think that the war will escalete. With luck it will be swift, and with the absolute minimum of civiliam casualties, hopefully none, a small hope I grant you. So I will live with this, and the upset to my children daily. Please, so comments about how we have got what we should because dh is some evil baby killer, I am too tired and upset to cope with it. I am under so much pressure sometimes I think I will go under. I can understan why you worry, but my worries are more immediate.

hmb - my thoughts are with you at this time - dh has family in the RAF too, and though they are not involved this time, they have been involved in previous conflicts, so I have a little bit of an idea of what you are going through.

Agree with Musica about Tony Blair not jumping on a bandwagon this time and actually believing in his cause. But do not agree with going to war. I think the Sept 11 link is manufactured because the Americans (well Bush) want a war. I am very unhappy to live in a world so dominated by one country.

Also I'm afraid I may make myself unpopular here. But I have more sympathy/concern/anguish for the innocent Iraqi children than for the US/UK volunteered forces.

Sorry - I posted that before reading your post hmb. It was inappropriate since you are so obviously upset.

If it makes you feel better Bozza, so does Dh, and so do all of his friends. It isn't black and white. His is a good man, who loves his family. We have been here before. I concentrate on the end game, when the people of Iraq will be free of a murderous dictator. The children of Halabja were just as innocent

hmb, I can't begin to imagine how frightening this all must be for you and your family. Whatever the rights and wrongs of it, all the best to your DH and his colleagues.

zebra you are not alone in your support for Blair; I am behind him and I want the allies to get rid of Saddam by any means necessary. However many people may die,( which is obviously awful) it won't be as many as the people he has already murdered,and that is the fact people need to consider. Weapons inspections are a total waste of time, as well as a bit of a travesty = guess who used to be a huge international arms dealer ??? HANS BLIX !!!!!! I say let's get on with it.Sorry if I sound heartless but there it is.

and by the way Zoe ( and anyone else) if you are interested Bill Clinton has an article in today's online Guardian which explains clearly exactly why he supports Blair and Bush, although one does wonder if, were he still in power, things would be different.

Hmb, my thoughts are very much with you and your husband and all the brave people working with him. Can't beging to imagine how frightening and worrying it must be for you and anyone else in your situation.

I also agree how terrible for the poor innocent people in Iraq who will suffer but also do agree it is probably the only course of action.

Bush though, my goodness, what an idiot - sorry if I will upset anyone with this comment. Perhaps it is the right strategy to go to war but I think he is the most uninspiring, unintelligent President to walk the earth and how frightening that he is the most powerful man...

I have no answers. I want to get rid of Saddam but I beleive declaring war to be totally wrong - can we never learn from history? I have a friend from Iraq and she told me today she has 2 sisters in Bagdhad. It really brought it home to me that these are real people. Are their lives really worth so much less than those people who died on Sept 11th that it is OK to take revenge. I beleive the US have just wanted war from day 1 and Sept 11th is an excuse really, adfterall it wasn't actually Saddam who committed the act although of course no-one would doubt his links.

I just read these messages from people with family out there or in the armed forces etc and it makes me want to cry that they are just waiting for what is pretty much inevitable. Quick of not people will die and people will be scarred both physically and emotionally. I agree we shouldn't just do nothing but what gives us the right to play God and to ignore the rest of the world just because they don't agree with us and I am terrified about were this is going to lead.

I still cannot understand what the threat is to the UK from Iraq. I feel nervous about us going it alone with the US, I think as a nation it increases our isolation and exposes us as a target for Iraqi terrorists. I also have grave concerns about the phenomenal monetry expense of a war and the potential for loss of life on all sides.
HMB and all others Mumsnetters with forces partners huge cyber hugs to you.

Zebra I too believe Tony Blair is doing the right thing and am behind him all the way.

Hmb, hope your dh gets home safe and well.

Thank you all for your kind comments. I know that Seahorse's Dh/p is out there too. It isn't easy to cope, and I have no family nearby to help. I have some good friends who help to keep me sane, and I count all the Mumsnetter in with them. It has been a real lift to my spirits, thank you.

hmb

Much love and support to you - even if we've been here before it doesn't stop the worrying.

As with you dh was in the last gulf war which was mercifully short and the Iraqi army surrended at the first opportunity (poor men. Hope it is the same again. Since then followed 2 tours of Kosovo, Bosnia and NI special forces etc. But I think RAF pilots have one of the most difficult jobs around.

I posted a thread a day or so ago asking for any other army/raf wives/partners to join in a support thread but I think I posted at the wrong time (midnight on a sunday isn't that brilliant!) so I'm glad you've appeared in this thread.

by the way did you or anyone else see Tonight with Trevor McDonald last night - really insensitive for military families - all about the anthrax injections - apparantly if you have the 2 sets close together (dh did) then you are at risk of MS, Lupus and other horrible things - do you know anything else about this?

Also please can someone start a thread on Jude Law gossip to take my mind off it all!

I did folow up you posting, with some details of info on the naps? I hope the info is helpful. I found it that Dh could pass it on to his crew.

We did the last one, and Bosnia and Afghanistan. He has spent 7 months of the last year away. That said I think tha Army guys have it hardest. At least we always have reguar phone calls/e-mails and that makes things a lot easier to cope with. Hve you used the e-bluey system. It is quite good, and only taks about 3 days to get to them

I hope that you and your family are coping as well as can be expected. It isn't easy. Have a cyber hug from me. Hope it is all over asap.

Oh, regarding the jabs, dh had them last time, and he was fine. no problems after this round of them either.

hmb & seahorse - my thoughts are very much with you and your families, hoping your DHs will come home very soon; whatever our personal views on the war situation are we should do everything we can to support our servicemen and women who have no choice in the matter at all.

hmb & seahorse - hope your loved ones return home safely soon. I agree with Tillysmummy - as I put dd to bed tonight I couldn't help but try to imagine what it must be like to do that with so much immediate uncertainty around you.

I thought the comments from Claire Short and John Denhman were interesting - they both seemed to say that TB was given no option or room to manouevre by the US.
On a radio interview I heard the other week the statement was made that this would be short, and that it would become apparent quickly how much Saddam was hiding. If he does have the means/raw materials to kills many people then that needs to be dealt with (which does not necessarily mean going to war). The other person in the discussion countered with the comment that this would provide Al Queda with their biggest recruitment drive. I can't even begin to imagine where it will all end.
Very worried and very sad