Was he, is he having an affair?

[Bugsy]

For some inexplicable reason, still not sure why I did this, I looked at dh's text messages on his 'phone. I have never, ever snooped on him before (been together for 11 years) and I cannot explain why I suddenly decided to do it now.
Anyhow, I found lots of texts on his 'phone from another woman. Not explicit or obviously suggesting that he has had an affair but most definitely intimating a close friendship. The texts span four months and the last one was mid-December.
I am slightly at a loss for what to do now. One of dh's close friends was caught just before Christmas with his trousers down and has subsequently left his wife and 2 children. He has been widely condemned by our circle of friends and will be taken to the cleaners by his wife's solicitors. I am wondering whether DH was up to no good and was frightened by our friend's situation.
It would be very easy for DH to have an affair as he works abroad a great deal.
Does anyone have any advice or experience of such a situation?

Bugsy good luck for tonight.I'm sure its not going to be easy but talking with a third person will be a help and I really hope that you can resolve these issues.Be strong,remember that you have done nothing wrong.Best wishes.

Thank you all again for your kind words. Particular thanks to Skara and Sis for relating your own experiences.
I am dreading tonight and I'm dreading the weekend. Hopefully, neither will be as bad as I am imagining. I'll let you all know how it goes next week.

Bugsy we went to relate a few times- again for different reasons - but it did help. The problem has not manifested itself again - and part of the reason for that I think is the better communication channels that relate helped us to set up. It is so hard to talk ''reasonably'' and not get carried away and really too angry to communicate properly when you are alone together - having a third person there certainly helped us - and helped me get 'sense' out of dh - he's not great at talking about emotions!
Hope it goes well for you - I know the initial session is often with one counsellor and then when you start your counselling proper it's with a different one - I would definitely ask for a change if you get bad vibes about yours as Skara did - I have a friend who has just stopped going because the bloke made such inappropriate comments - it's hard enough with a counsellor that you can 'relate' to - practically impossible if he/she is not good.

Bugsy, hope it goes well tonight. Feeling you might explode (with grief in my case) is apparently very common when you start counselling - a good counsellor will help you both very carefully through the initial sessions. Dare I say that after the betrayal you have experienced, it might take a few sessions to get round to how you might rediscover your love for him? Don't be too discouraged if this is not addressed immediately. It can take some weeks for everything to be told. Very best of luck to you.

Bugsy - hope all went well tonight. I agree with Bayleaf about getting the "right" counsellor for both of you. Otherwise it's an easy cop-out for your dh to say "it's not working." We persevered with someone neither of us really rated which, in hindsight was rather stupid, although it did give us some common ground in laughing at what the counsellor said after the sessions.
Anyway, IMO the most important thing was having someone reasonably objective listen to me and have dh listen too - at home, it's too easy to interrupt, walk out on an argument etc, but with a 3rd party, you are kind of "forced" to sit it out and listen - and to feel that you can talk about whatever is on your mind without fear of embarrassment or recrimination since you don't know the counsellor and won't have to see them again after your sessions are over. From memory, we got "homework" to do, which I'd recommend you stick to. We actually found that once the sessions dwindled, we tried to keep the same time each week and do something together/ talk about any problems and that worked as well if not better than the counselling. But the counselling was vital for getting the communication going as others have said. Best of luck

Let us know how it went. Good luck x

Munchbunch, your experience sounds like ours. I think joking about the counsellor bonded us in a way we hadn't for a long time. So I guess counselling worked in a back-to-front kind of way. And you are right about the communication; once you get that going again it makes things much clearer. Anyway I'm thinking of you tonight Bugsy.

Well, I was dreading it and beside myself with anxiety and he didn't seem nervous at all. Breezed in to see our counsellor all positive and chirpy..... made a silly mistake, wanted to put it all behind him and get things back the way they were!
I'm afraid I cried. I was so annoyed and frustrated and pissed off that I was sitting in some small neutrally toned room telling a sad, puppy dog eyed woman about the sad state of our marriage that I just blubbed.
Anyhow, we didn't get very far. By the time the counsellor explained what it was all about and I recovered from blubbing we only had about 30 mins and we were only really getting stuck in when it was time to go.
The weekend was crap and even more crap when I found out he had gone out with her among others (apparently) on Friday night and had phoned her on Saturday and Sunday. We had a big chat last night and I said I was so hacked off and thought that he was not 100% committed that maybe he should move out. He naturally lied about phoning her until I forced him into a corner. Apparently, she is really worried about the state of David's marriage and needs to know that he is OK and things are going OK. God, I expect you can all smell the bull*t from every corner of the country.
Anyway, the chat didn't really come to much. He kept saying that he loved me and that he doesn't want to move out and he is going to tell herthat he won't be in touch anymore! Believe that if you will. I am so, so pissed off and fed up. Just don't know what to do.

Bugsy, I am so sad to hear how it went.

Any chance that you can throw him out and maybe jolt him in to realising what he has lost. I mean if he thinks all he has to do is say sorry and all will be forgiven, then he probably will not change.

I do wish you all the best. I know it is hard because you have kids. All the best.

Oh Bugsy, I'm so sorry to hear this. I really feel for you. It does sound as though he needs a short sharp shock which chucking him out might achieve. Have you spoken to any of your friends about the situation?

Sorry it didn't go well bugsy. It really sounds as if he isn't facing up to the seriousness of the situation. And seeing her and talking to her was completely out of order. I don't know what else to say except that going to counselling and then behaving as he is (i.e talking to her, seeing her) doesn't seem to be demonstrating a willingness to put it behind him. He's saying one thing and doing another. Sorry, I don't suppose it's constructive but yes, we can all smell the bullshit. I feel angry for you. Much sympathy.

bugsy you don't need me to tall you that he is behaving like a class a idiot. He appears to have no idea how you feel- maybe he thinks he's got away with it? If he is still in contact with her and seeing her he is simply taking the p. You need to do something to make him realise how close he is to losing it all. Maybe ask him to move out even for a "trial" period. If he carries on like this you'll end up hating him. Sorry I wish I could offer easier advice but he is behaving like a fool, and I have no idea how you can make him see sense. When's your next counselling session??? As for the stupid cow- I don't know- I'd be tempted to ring her and tell her to keep her concerns to her* self before she destroys a family- but it's probably better to ignore her.

Bugsy - poor you. I really feel for you.

Do you think you can ever imagine him telling you that you can trust him again and he will have no further contact with this woman or with anyone else? I think if I discovered my DH was with someone even when we were at councelling then I would never beleive anything he said and if that was the case then there would be no point in torturing myself with what we might regain as it could never happen. Sorry. This is negative but I think you should chuck him out. Surely its up to hom to prove his commitment to you.

bugsy, Your dh is either in deep denial or he is.... no I can't type what I'd like to say. It is SO out of order telling you he phoned this woman, and not telling you outright, lying to you first. And has he the sensitivity of a log? what's all this stuff about this woman being concerned for your marriage? If she's that concerned tell him she should come to the counselling sessions with you! Seriously, it seems he's not been on the same wavelength as you over the time he was away. Did he tell the counsellor or you what has been going through his mind all that time? He left knowing you had found out about this woman and came back knowing he was going to go to counselling with you. What was he thinking about in between?

Sorry, but he sounds like he's being much too flippant. What's he trying to run away from? What would happen if you cool it, be matter of fact and say you don't want to go to counselling sesions with him, you can't be bothered with all that and can he just move out since he's wasting eveyone's time? Oh dear this is a bit harsh. I will try and say something more constructive later.

Oh Bugsy please don't let him treat you like a fool!! He must not be taking your threats of splitting up seriously. You need to get him out of there NOW!!!! And as for seeing her and then lying again!!!! WHAT A PIG! Sorry bugsy, I know this isn't constructive.

I think you were very brave and thoughtful for your children to go to counselling and try, but he has proven that no matter what he cannot be trusted. Make an appointment with a lwayer as soon as you can to get all the relevant info on the next steps and help you are entitled to.

I so feel for you and I can tell you are a VERY strong person. You have the strength to leave him and come out of this with your head held high. He'll be left alone feeling like the prat he is!

Bugsy I may be wrong but I didn't pick up from your post that the counselling itself was a failure - just that in general dh doesn't seem to be taking this as seriously as he should. I hope you will keep going if it wasn't a complete waste of time.

YOu have every reason to be furious about his attitude - any of us would be - it is bad enough doing what he has done - and yes I am one of the people who has said that she thinks the marriage CAN work again - but only if he is REALLY REALLY repentant and will to do ANYTHING to make it work.
I have to agreed that I would be inclined to chuck him out if only to get him to take it seriously. If it were me, then to ever believe that he really loved me agin he would have to do a lot of ''proving it'' - ie working hard to show how much he loves me - for me seeing how he reacted if I chucked him out would be one test that he'd need to pass. Yes it is risky - maybe it would be throwing him into her arms. If you want to keep him come what may then it's clearly not the thing to do - but if you only want to keep him on 'your' terms then it might well be worth a try....

Bugsy, Just a thought. How often do you hear of someone cheating and ending a relationship to be with someone new and then 6 months a year down the line they are alone trying to get back what they lost, but its too late because the other person has moved on. you sound like a lovely caring person, and someone out there will appreciate that.

I wouldn't write off counselling because you didn't get very far in the first session - this was my experience too and I almost didn't go back. The counsellor takes a little while to get to know you and your situation, before she/he can help.

Having said that, I agree with the others that he needs to take everything a bit more seriously. He really needs a short sharp shock of some description.

Bugsy, as NQWWW says, it is very early days in the counselling and I would try to persevere - if only to help yourself. This is exactly the experience I had the first couple of times, sobbing my way through it with DH all stony faced and saying 'I've said I'm sorry .. what more do you want'. I found a letter DH had written to his girlfriend, it was a 'closure' letter but why on earth did he have to write it - I found it before he sent it (unless he sent another?)and what a prat to leave it in a fairly obvious place where I would find it.

Loads of sympathy, it really really is a horrible situation.

Oh Bugsy, so sorry that your dh does not seem to recognise the seriousness of the situation. I hope that you continue with the counselling, with or without your dh - whichever option YOU prefer and that you get some benefit from it.

Whatever you decide to do next, please look after yourself and come and scream on mumsnet if things get too much.

Thank you all for your sympathy and suggestions. I feel very down about the whole thing. I'm not sleeping well, eating etc. etc. Stress levels and blood pressure must be through the roof.
I think he must be on stupid pills at the moment. I don't think he has grasped the seriousness of the situation at all. I was stunned when I found out he was still phoning her. I keep wondering if she was a UK resident would he have left us already? I just don't get the impression that he is bending over backwards to make amends.
He said that part of the reason he was calling her was because he felt lonely because I had shut down so much. He says I am pushing him away with my coldness.
I don't want to be taken for a fool and yet I want to do what is right for my children. I couldn't bear to look back in 5 years time and wish I had given things more of a chance.
My gut reaction is that he should go but I suppose I am very frightened of the ramifications for me and my two innocent children.
I'm going to have to stop now because I'm welling up in the office and if I start I'll never stop.

i'm so sorry for you bugsy - only seen the thread today as new to the site
whatever YOU decide to do will be the right thing
thinking about you - god! you are so strong

Bugsy I don't balme you for taking your time. It's hard to think of a more difficult decision for you and your family. But please, do not under any circumstances let him lay a guilt trip on you for you so called "coldness". He is the one that has betrayed a loyal and trusting partner - you have done nothing wrong. He needs to win back your trust through demonstrating his commitment to you.

your coldness???????????? What planet is this man living on. I can understand why you don't want to rush things, and I can uncrstand tat you don't know whether you want him to leave or not- but you have to make him understand somehow how much he putting at stake. if he thinks that he can get away with it by saying sorry and then blaming you for being cold he has to be made to realise that he can't. How about doing something really drastic- change the locks on the house and don't let him in for a few days! Mind you maybe not if there are children around. Not a good scene. Perhaps ask him to stay somewhere else for a week or two while you decide what you want to do - and tell him it'll give him a chance to decide whether he wants to continue phoning the cow. If he does - he doesn't come home- simple. if he comes home he has some serious bridges to build- him- not you. I think you're going to have to get really mean before he even begins to understand what he may have done. The fool.

Bugsy you have every right to be cold towards him. He needs to wake up and take responsibility for this - it seems that throughout this whole thing he has been blaming you for him having an affair.
Chuck him out - tell the kids he is away working they don't need to know the details - and hope that he comes to his senses. If he doesn't he's not worth having.