SAHMs...would you encourage your daughters to SAHM or WOHM ?

[mozhe]

I ask out of genuine interest....people have often said to me that I became a committed WOHM because I had such a strong model in my own mother....and I would certainly be very disappointed if one of my own daughters chose to be a SAHM.
SAHMs what do you think ? And why ?

This is interesting - do people become like their parents? Presumably quite a lot. So the parents' attitude to work, life, honesty, morals etc does have a big impact as does whether the mother works or not or whether the father is a benefit cheat who has never done a day's work in his life or is in and our of prison or whatever it is.

So let no working or stay at home mother think that that will not influence their daughters on these issues.

In answer to the op - as a SAHM - I shall encourage and support them in whatever they want to do.

Oh, completely. We're 100% aware of our influence on our children, for good or ill.

When people use this phrase SAHM are they really meaning a woman who has children and never works again? Not ever. Not even one day a week. Whose children never see her leave the house to go somewhere and earn money. Whose children might actually have no experience ever of a working mother. Because surely these women are few and far between.

I know everybody knows some tennis playing yummy mummy but I've always assumed that they are statistically insignificant.

If you are taking a few years off while your children are little, is that really a SAHM? It's just a career break isn't it?

Of course, the parental model is terribly strong - mostly people seem to either accept it or react violently against it.

I spent the end of last week and the weekend in Amsterdam, seeing my sister (and family) who moved there a few months ago. My sister and I are very alike in many ways, even though we stopped living in the same home and country nearly 20 years ago... She and I both live in Art Deco homes built in the same year, even though we live in different countries, and entirely without consultation with one another... those kind of coincidences happen to us all the time. We have lots of similar beliefs and behaviours brought to us from our family. That's just life.

Of course, the parental model is terribly strong - mostly people seem to either accept it or react violently against it.

I spent the end of last week and the weekend in Amsterdam, seeing my sister (and family) who moved there a few months ago. My sister and I are very alike in many ways, even though we stopped living in the same home and country nearly 20 years ago... She and I both live in Art Deco homes built in the same year, even though we live in different countries, and entirely without consultation with one another... those kind of coincidences happen to us all the time. We have lots of similar beliefs and behaviours brought to us from our family. That's just life.

And again with the pointing out that I have no intention of working outside the home for money again and am not a 'tennis-playing yummy mummy.'

Sorry, Suebaroo, I only skim read the thread. But I've often got the impression on these discussions, that the stay at home mothers are staying home for a few years only and therefore the division between working and staying home isn't nearly as great as people make out.

NKF, I'd agree with that, very true.

NFK - I agree with you too - the vast majority of SAHMs only do it for a few years whilst their children are small

However, thinking about it further, the problem with saying that is that it boils down to saying 'well, it's ok to be a sahm, as long as you do go back to work eventually'

Well, not really Suebaroo. I think it's more the case that it's not a real divide. At most it's about whether or not women work when they have pre-school children.

am agreeing with you again NKF

precisely, NFK.

NKF - I agree that the world is NOT divided into two camps of 40-year career WOHMs on the one hand and eternal SAHMs on the other. It's far more complicated than that, with lots of different "segments" (horrid jargon) of women with different career paths. The Xenia's and Mozhe's of this world, who want to work full time all the time and take off minimal time for childbirth (the "40-year career WOHMs) are a tiny, but (on MN at least) vocal, dogmatic minority. Just as the eternal SAHMs are also a tiny minority.

My mum was SAHM unti I was about 12 and my yougest brother was 10. She never would have said it, but I think she always felt that she should have been doing something 'more' - she had a lot of preassure put on her from her own mother.

I am a SAHM, and I feel like my Mum is a little disapointed - I think she would like me to work part time, as she now works and finds it very fulfilling.

I find being a SAHM very fulfilling, and, assumung we can afford it, I would like to be SAHM for ever really! I enjoy being involvd in community and kids activities - certainly don't have a spare minute to sit around or to play tennis!

I will encourage my DD to pursue her interests and get as high an education as she wants and can gain. TBH though, I will be disappoined if she puts her own children in full time child care as I don't think its ideal. I'd encourage her or her DH to care for them at home at least part time, and hope I might be able to help as well (this is a long way off...DD is 3!)

I certainly want to convey the message that being a SAHM is a valid and important job. The rest is up to her really!

NKF, in the context of this particular debate? I'm not so convinced. I do understand your point, and, like I say, I don't disagree that there really isn't an awful lot of difference between those who choose to work when their children are very small, and those who choose to stay home.

However, it does follow from that that there is a difference between those who work for any period when they have children, and those who choose to be 'just a housewife'.

And what appears to happen - and has happened on this thread - is that the oppobrium that was being spent on the SAHM who just does it when her children are small gets heaped instead on the sahm who does it very long term on the understanding that 'well, there's not that many of them about'

reads that through and is not sure she's been clear

hmm, if any of that doesn't make sense, ask for clarification, I'm a bit distracted today.

On the how do you define a SAHM issue, according to the Equal Opportunities Commission stats only 42% of all mothers do paid work (36% with children under 4 rising to 56% with children from 16-18) compared to 96% of men. So yes, many women may only take a couple of years off (you get at least a year on maternity pay anyway) but there will be others who take up to 18 years off. And, my point earlier, was that it doesn't matter how much time you take off, it is still almost certainly going to affect your long-term earnings and career prospects.

I agree that people can make assumptions about the yummy mummy, gym bunny SAHM (actually I'm more familiar with the teenage dropout who is trapped on the dole) but people also make the same assumptions about the career minded, uncaring WOHM. I work part-time fitting my hours around school hours (I'm a teacher anyway so that only means taking 4/5 hours and I get 13 weeks holiday anyway). I make my kids lunches as does my partner (we take it in turns), I drop them off at school and pick them up. I help with homework etc etc. It annoys that some people assume that WOHMs can't take an active role in their family life and kids' school life (as I've said before there's absolutely nothing more I could or would do for my kids as a SAHM than I do as a WOHM and there's a lot I couldnt't do) and the community. As a teacher I'm involved with the communtiy all day every day. I probably do as much voluntary work as any SAHM. I, like thousands of otehr WOHMS, just do this stuff AS WELL as bringing up a family.

Depends on your career. I doubt it really matters to prospects if you work the checkout at Tesco or whatever. It would in some careers like medicine may be where you have those crucial mid years. I hope now we have the new age discrimination laws where they cannot make you leave work until 65 by force and even then they have to go through procedures before they force you out, that healthy fit older women will have a new lease of life/career in those years if they choose to go back.

My mother could have gone back - she had loved teaching for 13 years, supported my father etc and I think missed it. She should have gone back when we were teenagers and I suspect she felt a bit redundant but then she might have been equally depressed back at work. It's not at all clear if the two were related. Some people are fed up whatever they do.

The other interesting point - see recent Times articles and research - is how women change at 50+ as your hormones change. You are no longer Mrs Nich Guy smoothing the feathers, flattering the men, nurturing the women. Your testosterone or it's equivalent comes into its own and presumably your career potential too. Apparently it nearly breaks up some marrigaes but I bet it could be a force for career good too.

I would like my daughter to be happy and fulfilled, whatever she does.

The only worry I would have about her being a SAHM (in this day and age of high divorce rates) is the issue of economic independence. As long as she was capable of earning a living if push came to a divorce court, that would be fine.

FWIW as a WOHM I actually think I took the easier route ... but perhaps that's another debate.

Blackandwhitecat - I'd never seen those figures before and they surprise me. I had no idea. I really did assume that the stay at home period was relativeere's a lot of unemployed women out there!ly short for most women with children. That means there's a lot of unemployed women out there!

NFK, b&w cat's stats are wrong. It's something like 55% of mothers of under 5s don't work (hugely skewed by the fact that very few single mothers work, and lots of women in relationships do) and nearly 80% of mothers of over 11s do (a similar figure to men in the workplace).

Okay, Aloha. Those figures certainly sound more likely.