Jewish Orthodox Mum Part II AMA

[mirah2]

I'm probably letting myself in for it, but here goes...

New AMA to mop up any questions that didn't get answered on the first (full) thread. If you're sure (after reading all of that thread) that your question wasn't answered, or have a new question, please post.

I probably won't have time to reply until after dinner and kids' bedtime.

I am NOT the OP of the original thread. My frame of reference - Modern Orthodox, British (living in UK), convert, mixed race heritage.

Fellow Orthodox Jews of Mumsnet - feel free to crowd share answers, but please remember:

• this is not the shul kiddush. This is a public internet forum anyone can read
• please be sensitive and think about how others (Jewish and not Jewish) might interpret what you say. We sometimes have different working definitions of words within our bubbles so be mindful of that.

Go forth and post!

I appreciate this question probably won't get answered until after Shabbat but I'll ask now because I'll probably forget otherwise:

Is there an "official" start time for Shabbat eg Does your Shul publish the time, a bit like a local Mosque publishes fast opening times in Ramadan, or does each household decide for themselves what time it starts?

@MissMarplesNiece I know from watching Jewish you tubers that yes, each region has specific start/finish times and these are published on the synagogue websites and I'm sure in hard copy too.

Again, I'm not Jewish, but yes they do publish times for the community to follow, on websites and by handing out papers with the times for the year. Not being Jewish, I could be wrong on this, but I'm reasonably sure there's a pre-Shabbat prayer service then Shabbat starts with the lighting of candles 18 minutes before sunset, to allow for error in calculating the time (i.e. everyone will have started in time for actual sunset). I don't know how they calculate when sunset will be, it doesn't seem to coincide with things like the BBC website times.

Back in the day, some areas had a guy who would announce the time for Sabbath starting and ending, like a town crier. I'm fairly sure that doesn't exist anymore.

I cannot thank the two OP for both threads enough . It has been so informative and interesting. All you lovely ladies have been so patient and committed to answering the questions. I hope you all thoroughly enjoy Shabbos and hopefully hear from you on Sunday .Thank you again.

@MatchesinEyes23 wholeheartedly agree.

Shabbat Shalom, good shabbos everyone! From someone that has been avidly following the threads.

Yes, I very much agree with every word of this.

It's such a lovely idea to have the family gathered together for one evening a week, to eat and talk together, no screens, no distractions. Regardless of religion or cultural heritage, it's a positive thing to do.

I’ve only read up to page 15 (and all of the first one) so sorry if these questions have already been asked. Huge thanks for an incredible thread ladies!!

I have a medical question about end of life care. I have cared for several Jewish people at end of life and there is often some conflict between staff and families about sedative and painkilling medications. We would normally give these to ensure the patient is comfortable and passes peacefully but these are usually refused by the family. Sometimes the patient appears quite distressed and often the staff can find this distressing themselves, but the families don’t seem to. I know it’s because nothing can be given that might hasten death in any way, but how is it viewed in the community? Is it just seen as part of death or do some people struggle with it?

Also when a miscarriage happens, is the woman niddah? That must be so difficult for the couple if they cannot physically comfort one another in their loss.

No worries. I’m just curious as to what sort of jobs/careers are the most common for both men and women from your community? Are there any patterns or is it very varied?

It seems quite common for families to own businesses (kosher food, hardware, modest clothing, jewellers) and the whole family ends up working there and the children take over when the time comes. More modern orthodox go to university and seem to like the financial or health care sectors.

Ive had a fantastic time today reading the 2 threads... I've got nothing done!

Holding a special fascination for me, when visiting my grandmother recently in hospital when she was dying I asked my mum why the board behind her said no pork, and my mum said it's because she was Jewish, she abandoned her faith but never could bring herself to eat pork.

Felt like a whole family history I knew nothing about. However I'm confused as to whether she would be considered jewish,she was born out of wedlock to a Jewish mother and a polish airman!

She then had my mother out of wedlock who then had me out of wedlock (you seeing a trend here?! 🤣)

Seeing as so many religions and cultures throw great shame on unwed mothers and bastards, are only children born within wedlock considered jewish?

No, any child born to a Jewish mother is considered Jewish regardless whether the mother was married or not when she had her child.

@Coppercreek1 It sounds you've just discovered you are Jewish! How fascinating.

Have really enjoyed these threads, thanks so much. I hope everyone had a lovely Shabbat.

i have a question: did the mikvah stay open during Covid lockdown?

Shavua tov everyone! (good week)

Disclaimer: this is not something I know a lot about but will give it a go:
anything to hasten the end would be not ok, as always preserving life is number one , but painkillers and sedatives I can’t see a reason there would be an issue. So I wonder if it would be the dosage that would be the issue? If my family member was struggling it would be upsetting for me.

Yes, a woman is Nidda after miscarriage . It isn’t easy.

Could you answer the question about Mikveh during the pandemic, please? I thought that was a really good question.

I had that feeling also.

I’d like to ask anyone who is not ultra orthodox what you may and may not do during Shabbat. Can you visit friends, for instance?

I thought of another nidda question. Do husbands and wives generally avoid touching each other in company whatever time of the month, so that it’s not obvious if the woman is nidda? Otherwise people would potentially be able to tell?

Nidda isn't only about touching, you can't even pass something directly to your spouse. So if you want to pass a book, cup of tea, or even a baby you need to set it down on a surface first, where the spouse will pick it up from. Moses and Zippora always do tiktoks about this.

Thanks to all the PPs for the lovely messages on this thread, really appreciate it! Dipping back now as Shabbat is out.

Yes - well spotted, many couples do try to avoid public touching or PDAs.

Yes. We just went out for Shabbat lunch with friends. Being able to chill out with local friends is one of the great things about Shabbat.

Shabbat rules re what we may and may not do are pretty much the same for all streams of Orthodoxy. Modern Orthodox, Haredi Litvish and Hasidic will all keep the same basic rules (as always with some differences!). The boundaries are flexible - because we all meet a minimum standard, we go to each others synagogues and simchas (celebrations) and I have often eaten meals with Haredi Litvish families. Hasidic less so (other than Chabad, who are a group dedicated to outreach), but this is because at an individual level I feel like there are more barriers between us. And other ladies here may socialise more with Hasidim than I do.

It doesn't always feel like it, but we are one community despite some very different outlooks.

If an orthodox jew worked as a doctor or in a job which required for them to work on Saturdays how would they work around this? Are there exceptions for people who don't have a choice but have to work on these days

Also what happens if a couple accidentally breaks the laws of niddah? Or if the urge to hug or have physical contact leads to breaking the rule? Is there a compensation to pay for it like fasting or giving in charity?