Work capability assessment changes

[Orangesandlemons77]

Does anyone know anything about this please? Have seen something in the media about it. A change or removal of the WCA for ESA (UC?)

I'm in the support group for ESA, will this affect me? I'm in the group where they say they will not assess them anymore.

That is how is sounds to me too. I think by the time it is rolled out, all ESA will have been moved over to UC anyway.

@XenoBitch yes, I honestly don't think a lot of people understand what the situation is going to be. No such thing as ESA, LCWRA etc Only those who have successfully claimed PIP will be OK. Everyone else will be "nudged" (i.e. Forced) through poverty, into taking any job and if you refuse, your measly amount of UC will be stopped. There will be people who lose everything because of this, become homeless, commit suicide etc It's really bullying by the government of the most vulnerable in our society.

Yep, people heard Hunt say WCA will be stopped... and just assumed that it means that it means assessments will be just paper based, or that it will mean you could be on benefits for years with no assessments ever. Many see it as a good thing... it is not. It will be replaced with something, and in this case it is being replaced with PIP assessments which are a lot harder than ESA/UC.

Like I said before, I am in the LCWRA group.. have been for 7 years... but I am not on PIP, mainly because I would not survive the process of applying.

When you claim PIP, they say it is not related to work but then they do use that in the assessment. They ask about work and any work you do can be used against you in the PIP decision. And now they are using the PIP to give people the new health element and no ESA.

I don't see how this would encourage people to work. It might make it much more difficult to claim PIP / health element though. It's a worry.

I appealed PIP twice despite being in the support group for ESA. PIP knew of the ESA award but ignored it, saying it was a different benefit.

I did get PIP eventually but it was a long stressful process. I worry this will make more vulnerable people give up.

Hopefully they won't get in at the next election and things will change. There are some negatives with the WCA but PIP is no better really in terms of being a nightmare to claim and it also focuses on what you can't do / need help with etc.

The point of my answer clearly went over your head. The poster asked why not just increase pip payments and the reason is because there is no need to increase a non means tested benefit. By making the health element part of UC it goes to lower income families who need it.

Sorry, I am not that bright with reading comprehension. Feel dumb now!

No please don't apologise I probably didn't explain myself very well.

@XenoBitch Don't feel dumb, you seem to have an excellent grasp of the situation to me. My head is spinning with all this and I bet a lot of other people are the same. I think a lot of people are going to be shocked when they realise the implications of today's announcement.

I am on high alert right now about it I guess. It is terrifying.
In the next few days will be proper breakdowns in the press about it, and scum rubbing their hands together about the prospect of the "depressed and people with bad backs" group all being suddenly found fit for work and being forced to work for Amazon or in a fruit farm.

I’m worried about the people who have shorter term illnesses remember the basic pip rule is that you have to have had the disability for 3 months and to expect it to last another 9 months. What about people with shorter term illnesses perhaps people who have had an accident or sudden illness which won’t last a year. At the moment cancer patients automatically go into the support group what will happen to them

This ☝️

Apparently there is something in the white paper which says that cancer patients will continue to get extra without being in receipt of PIP in a similar way that LCWRA is awarded now without assessment.

I just started a thread in AIBU about it. I must be a glutton for punishment!

Am I right in thinking that there are three ESA types:

Contribution based ESA
Limited for work ESA
Income related ESA

There is contributions based ESA and Income related ESA and within each of those there are 2 groups.
Income related ESA is no longer an option for new claims - it now comes under Universal credit. But it's possible to claim Contributions based ESA and Uc together.

I note in the white paper referred to upthread that it says they remain committed to a contribution based payment wonder if that is referring to cont based ESA.

I haven't found many people, other political parties, disability advocates, MH charities etc talking much about the reform yet which is a surprise. Usually when disability benefits are threatened, there's a lot of commotion but it's been very quiet so far.

@RumHam I've found the same thing too. I've been searching online for information but, apart from mumsnet, no one seems to be talking about this much. Where are the people that should be standing up for the rights of the disabled? I honestly don't think people have understood the implications of this. They have just seen that the Work Capability Assessment is going to be scrapped and think it's a good thing. They don't seem to realise that, in a few years, unless you get PIP you will lose a lot of money and be required to seek work whether you are able to or not otherwise you will be heavily sanctioned.

@RumHam actually just found a good article in The Guardian online about it.

Spot on, I think you're right in that the implications haven't really been realised yet. Most of the comments I've seen are only for childcare and over 50s going back to work. From the few official comments I've seen, they seem to be positive for the disability reforms which just baffles me! Getting rid of medical assessments sounds great at first glance and in an ideal work, a lot of them shouldn't have been needed given the amount of medical evidence most claimants submit but this just feels wrong as PIP is so hard to get (and keep!) and you can work on PIP anyway but it makes sense in their eyes as they want to deem what work you can do now, not what you can't do so no wonder they are using PIP to score everything as it's the only disabled benefit you can get while working full time. Working one day again isn't what scares me, what scares me is being forced into it regardless of how my health is.

@RumHam Exactly, most people on benefits due to ill health want to return to work, but only when they feel well enough, not because they have been forced to or they will have their benefits stopped. I, also, cannot believe how anyone thinks these new "reforms" are a good idea, particularly so called "official representatives" for disabled people and disability charities. Don't they understand that this means the only assessment will be the one for PIP, which is notorious for being the hardest to get and if you don't get it, you are going to lose about £350 per month from your UC award and will be forced into finding any work, no matter how unsuitable. As you say, PIP is awarded for help with daily needs and many people on it manage to work. We are constantly told (especially on mumsnet) that PIP isn't about whether you can work or not, so why choose PIP as the future deciding assessment for fitness to work? It just doesn't make sense!

There has been a bit of stuff on the benefits and work website which I mentioned at the start of the thread, but I agree not much in general.

Maybe the implications have yet to sink in.

Not everyone on PIP will be on UC. many will have working partners or significant savings or assets which rule them out of claiming a means tested benefit like UC.

If there are not going to be any work capability assessment though does this just mean that people claiming contributions based ESA will just esa able to claim the £77 a week assessment rate and nothing extra ? Or if they are awarded PIP will they then get the extra support group rate ? Currently if only awarded LCW/ Wrag, the ESA stops after 12 months - will it then stop if you don't have PIP in place by then ? I really can't see any of this working !

There is an interesting article about this on the MIND website.