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Original poster

Work capability assessment changes

163 replies

Orangesandlemons77 · 13/03/2023 13:42

Does anyone know anything about this please? Have seen something in the media about it. A change or removal of the WCA for ESA (UC?)

I'm in the support group for ESA, will this affect me? I'm in the group where they say they will not assess them anymore.

OP posts:
RicchT · 15/03/2023 18:47

Eightiesgirl · 15/03/2023 18:27

@RicchT From what I understand you'll still get the same money coming in if you are on any rate of PIP, either standard or enhanced. Your LCW/WRA payment will be replaced with this new UC disability payment that you will get as long as you get PIP. As for ESA I'm not sure what's happening with that, but that gets deducted now anyway from the LCWRA payment you currently receive. I may be wrong but that's my understanding and I agree its all very complicated.

Thank you for answering my question, really appreciate it 💕

Eightiesgirl · 15/03/2023 18:53

@RicchT Try not to worry, there will be a lot of people confused by this, so let's hope things are made clearer by the government in the next few weeks.

Gingerkittykat · 15/03/2023 18:54

What happens to people like me who are currently appealing my PIP decision, in my case to go from standard to enhanced. My representative says it probably won't even go to tribunal as I have such clear evidence to back up my claim and the DWP will give me the extra points just before the tribunal date.

I got my new award in August, did the mandatory reconsideration straight away and then put the appeal in September. It's now 6 months later and I'm still waiting for a decision.

swallowedAfly · 15/03/2023 19:01

I'm more worried that if LC doesn't exist for people who don't get PIP they will be considered fit and healthy and made to apply for jobs that they could never actually do.

I actually work but my health is going downhill fast and I worry I'll end up back on benefits (I came off of DLA and Incapacity benefit in 2012 and have managed to stay off till now but my physical and mental health is nosediving and work not being at all helpful ie. accommodating). If I have to give up my job for health reasons and don't receive PIP will I just be a jobseeker being either constantly sanctioned for not being able to do the things they demand of someone in full health?

XenoBitch · 15/03/2023 19:26

swallowedAfly · 15/03/2023 19:01

I'm more worried that if LC doesn't exist for people who don't get PIP they will be considered fit and healthy and made to apply for jobs that they could never actually do.

I actually work but my health is going downhill fast and I worry I'll end up back on benefits (I came off of DLA and Incapacity benefit in 2012 and have managed to stay off till now but my physical and mental health is nosediving and work not being at all helpful ie. accommodating). If I have to give up my job for health reasons and don't receive PIP will I just be a jobseeker being either constantly sanctioned for not being able to do the things they demand of someone in full health?

That is exactly my worry too. Also the news that there will be tougher sanctions.

Eightiesgirl · 15/03/2023 19:27

@Gingerkittykat People will end up no longer appealing PIP decisions if they are awarded standard but think they should have got enhanced. They won't be able to afford to wait till a tribunal make a decision, as there will be so many people appealing who have been refused PIP completely. As you've been awarded standard but are appealing the decision to try to change it to enhanced, can I ask have all your PIP payments stopped completely in the meantime? If that's the case I can imagine it's very hard to manage financially whilst you wait for a tribunal date.

Gingerkittykat · 15/03/2023 19:34

No, I still get standard payment so my payments are lower.

I was specifically worried about losing my place on the support group of ESA if there was a joint assessment and being forced to attend the jobcentre and do preparation for work activities etc,

swallowedAfly · 15/03/2023 19:39

XenoBitch · 15/03/2023 19:26

That is exactly my worry too. Also the news that there will be tougher sanctions.

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How does that even work? UC is not enough to pay rent and bills and eat and stop a house from completely freezing as it is - how can sanctions be viable let alone tougher sanctions?! If they force someone into homelessness they will end up costing the taxpayer more in temporary accommodation. It is evil and an own goal.

swallowedAfly · 15/03/2023 19:41

I should apply for PIP but I'm so down and anxious currently and getting no sleep worrying about being off of work and so tired all the time. I don't think I can face it.

Eightiesgirl · 15/03/2023 19:45

@Gingerkittykat that's what my dh is worried about too. If he loses PIP then, not only will he be worse off financially, but he will have to attend the job centre to either look for work or take part in work related activities. He has psychosis and doesn't go out alone, so God knows how he'd cope at the Job Centre. As for ESA, I don't think it's going to exist anymore when they bring in this new system and if you don't get PIP then you'll only get the standard rate of UC with no extra payment for being unable to work or take part in work related activities and if you don't turn up then you'll be sanctioned. Basically, everything is going to hang on being awarded PIP and if you don't get it then you'll need to find a job quickly.

Eightiesgirl · 15/03/2023 19:50

@swallowedAfly Can you get anyone to help you apply for PIP? Can you contact the Citizens Advice Bureau and ask if they can put you in touch with someone who could help with the application? The whole process seems to be designed to put the most vulnerable people, who are the ones who actually should be getting it, off applying.

swallowedAfly · 15/03/2023 19:58

Add proud, stubborn and very private to the obstacles I'm afraid. I just can't imagine having someone help me with such a humiliating (I assume it is humiliating, DLA forms certainly were) form.

I just went and looked at the 'how to apply' page and even that made me not want to apply. Be questioned on and have to give details about any time you've been abroad for more than 28 days in your whole life?? How is that necessarily or justifiable?

Eightiesgirl · 15/03/2023 20:03

@swallowedAfly I'm sorry you feel like that. It is a case of leaving your dignity at the door with some of these people. Until people have actually tried to claim these benefits, I don't think they realise just how difficult it is.

XenoBitch · 15/03/2023 20:33

swallowedAfly · 15/03/2023 19:39

How does that even work? UC is not enough to pay rent and bills and eat and stop a house from completely freezing as it is - how can sanctions be viable let alone tougher sanctions?! If they force someone into homelessness they will end up costing the taxpayer more in temporary accommodation. It is evil and an own goal.

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They don't care. There are multiple accounts of people dying from starvation or suicide after having benefits stopped.

I can understand how you feel about applying for PIP. I know a lot of people on it, and not a single person has said the process went smoothly at all. My old CPN was always trying to get me to apply, but then said there was a huge risk that the process would make me very ill.

Callmenat · 15/03/2023 20:45

Let's hope that those who can't work are supported but those who can, but choose not too, are nudged back into the work place. I think broadly today is positive in that respect.

Original poster
Orangesandlemons77 · 15/03/2023 20:46

I wonder what will happen to people like me, I'm on cont based ESA in the support group long term, in the group they said they were not going to assess anymore.

We're probably not going to be claiming UC, my ESA is not part of that at present.

I do also get PIP but found that a nightmare to claim compared to ESA (who actually wrote to my GP with a form etc)

OP posts:
Original poster
Orangesandlemons77 · 15/03/2023 20:47

they seem to have called this 'new style' ESA and it is separate from UC

OP posts:
TracyBeakerSoYeah · 15/03/2023 20:47

It doesn't make any sense at all to just base UC payments on whether you need to claim or do claim PIP.

As we all know that the claiming PIP process is broken & all it depends on what day & which assessor you get.
e.g. if your disability is say schizophrenia or bipolar disorder & you're lucky enough to get an assessor who has worked in the mental health field or a dept such as A&E that sees a lot of mental health care crises then you are more likely to get PIP.

Get a bone brain assessor who previously worked as a nurse in gastroenterology with none or little knowledge of mental health & thinks they know it all, well you've got Buckleys chance of getting PIP

RicchT · 15/03/2023 20:53

I was really fortunate ( she says - touching wood ) that my PIP process was really straightforward. It took four and a months to get but the assessor was lovely and very kind.
I was on the Cont based ESA and then due to a decline in health was placed in the support group.
These aren’t means tested are they .

Beepbeepenergy · 15/03/2023 20:56

@XenoBitch you don’t have to be on pip to get LCWRA
I’ve been on LWCRA for 4 years now and got knocked back for pip about 3 years ago

XenoBitch · 15/03/2023 20:56

Callmenat · 15/03/2023 20:45

Let's hope that those who can't work are supported but those who can, but choose not too, are nudged back into the work place. I think broadly today is positive in that respect.

This is where the new announcements make no sense. PIP is a benefit that people both in and out of work can claim. The new rules will mean you have to be on PIP to be able to claim the new 'health element' of UC (too ill to work).

Many people on UC now that claim LCW/LCWRA do not claim PIP. Are you suggesting that they are the ones who choose not to work, and need a nudge?
By the way, it wont be a mere nudge... it will be poverty. If you are already unwell, the threat of poverty wont make you better.

XenoBitch · 15/03/2023 20:58

Beepbeepenergy · 15/03/2023 20:56

@XenoBitch you don’t have to be on pip to get LCWRA
I’ve been on LWCRA for 4 years now and got knocked back for pip about 3 years ago

The new rules means you will have to claim PIP to be in the renamed LCWRA (will be called 'health element').

NewNovember · 15/03/2023 21:07

kingsleysbootlicker · 15/03/2023 17:42

I don't understand this. Apart from the obvious problems caused by LCW/LCWRA and PIP having different criteria, if it is going to all depend on whether someone gets PIP or not, what is the point of the proposed 'health element' on UC... why not just increase PIP payments? Am I missing something?

Because pip is not means tested thousands of people claiming pip like myself are not entitled to UC. The government doesn't want to give us "disableds" any more money.

Eightiesgirl · 15/03/2023 21:14

Basically, if you don't get PIP then all you'll be able to claim is the standard rate of UC. There will be no extra payments of any kind, no LCWRA etc and you'll be deemed fit to work if you've been turned down for PIP or haven't applied for it. I could be wrong but from researching it, there won't be any such thing as ESA anymore either.

XenoBitch · 15/03/2023 21:15

NewNovember · 15/03/2023 21:07

Because pip is not means tested thousands of people claiming pip like myself are not entitled to UC. The government doesn't want to give us "disableds" any more money.

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It is not about not wanting to give you more money.. it is just that your household income is above the threshold to claim UC. I could not claim ESA or UC for years because my partner earned too much.
Plus, plenty of people who claim PIP also work. For some, they are able to work because they claim PIP.