MLM-Bot Watch 5 - Juice+, Forever Living, Younique, Arbonne, newbie ARIIX, and our own Parslai-powered Timeless Vie

[acatcalledjohn]

As you were, team, as you were.

Timeless vie is genius, just wanted to say

FLhahaha Since virtually no FL Bot can ever have been in receipt of £82 thousands from so-called 'retailing' and 'commisions,' ever (let alone in a 12 month period), virtually no FL Bot can ever have been registered for VAT in the UK.

I think you will find that UK registered 'MLM' front companies have offered to pay VAT on all transactions between them and their non-salaried commision agents. These transactions are usually falsely described as 'distributor purchases at the wholesale price.'

This has helped to make it appear to casual observers (including tax officials) that all the unlawful investment payments (based on the false expectation of future reward) have been lawful purchases of good and services (based on value and demand). It's also made the UK government a major beneficiary of a serious fraud perpetrated against a significant percentage of the UK population.

Current estimates are that over 3 millions people have been churned through 'MLM' rackets in the UK and Ireland, since the 1970s. This figure, however, doesn't indicate persons who have been through more than one 'MLM' racket.

Based on figures from the so-called 'UK DSA,' the number of UK and Irish citizens being churned annually at the moment through 'MLM' rackets, is probably 150 thousands to 200 thousands. At the current rate, that would be up to another 2 millions over the next decade.

Char, yes the webpage has ended, we know you're not a bot lol.

Place marking, glad to see Ariix in the title!

Clarella - 'Ariix' (I fear) is going feature a lot more soon.

The 'Ariix' bosses have probably smelled that various other 'MLM' rackets are facing melt down in the UK. These MN threads along with TV have played a leading role in breaking the monopoly of information maintained by the bosses of 'FLP,' etc.

'Ariix' has been designed to takeover existing 'MLM' rackets, but then viruses do tend to mutate.

Penny - it's exactly like that ha ha!! I was half expecting Kevin and Perry to pop up waving bottles of aloe gel!

Just to mention that there's a thread in AIBU where the OP's friend appears to have believed that she wasn't involved in network marketing but had been given an 'exclusive' UK franchise for something.

How much discretion do MLM sellers have in tailoring an initial sales pitch to new recruits? ( Genuine question - I don't know whether they even have any at all.)

Eye I am certain no bot has received £82k income, but VAT is on turnover, and it is a funny old thing, which is why I think it is worth sending to HMRC. I am not sending it to the income tax lot, because although I would love all the bots to need to start explaining stuff to HMRC, I don't want to waste HMRC time when there is no income actually there!

So - Data Protection next

The Handbook says:

14.1. Distributors who collect and retain personal information relating to third parties, must be
aware of and comply with the laws of England and the Data Protection Act 1998 (“the
Act”) concerning the processing of personal data. This applies to personal information:
• held manually, for example in a filing cabinet and/or on a personal computer, for
example on a database, and
• which may relate for example to retail customers, prospective Distributors or
Downline Distributors, and
• from which such persons can be identified.
14.2. Processing data includes: the obtaining, recording, holding, organising, adapting, altering,
retrieving, consulting, disclosing, alignment, combination, blocking, erasing or
destructing of the information or data.
14.3. Distributors, who process personal data must also consider whether they are required to
notify the Office of the Information Commissioner of their data processing activities.
Guidance can be found on the Information Commissioner’s web site: www.icos.gov.uk.
General information is available on the following web site: www.dataprotection.gov.uk
or through their information telephone line: 01625 545745, or by e-mail
[email protected].
14.4. The Company, as Data Controller, has duly notified the Office of the Information
Commissioner of the purposes of its data processing.
14.5. Distributors agree that the Company may retain and process all personal information
given to the Company by the Distributor for purposes including marketing, business
creation and development, management reporting, bonuses payable and awards. The
Company may record this information both manually and/or on a computer database and
will be the Data Controller for this information.
14.6. The Distributor agrees that the Company may disclose and transfer this personal
information to his/her Upline Sponsor and to other members of the Company’s group
situated outside the European Economic Area under which the Distributor may not have
rights under data protection law and to other persons for the purpose of the Company’s
business.

This makes it reasonably clear that people (bots) holding information are required to comply with the DPA and probably need to register. It also gives permission for FL to transfer info to uplines, but it does not give permission the other way round. So my guess is that any bot transferring info upline is in breach of the DPA.

The trouble is I have never had any contact with FL personally so I don't have anything to complain about. Again I have checked and, surprise surprise, I can't find any bot registered. Does anyone know where I might find a list of (relatively) top bots (maybe Sapphire and above?) The handbook shows they will have large numbers of Downlines and so will therefore have a considerable database of info.

And if any former FL person wanted to make an access request to their upline or FL that would be interesting.

What is the time limit, again. 40 days is it ? (Plus another eg 14 follow up days in the event of non- response to the first request.)

FLhahaha - Am I right in assuming that incoming-payments from so-called 'selling/retailing' and 'bonus-commisions' can be the only basis for calculating the 'turn-over' figure which would make VAT registration applicable if £82 thousands incoming payments (defined in this way) was exceeded by any FL Bot?

Also, is there any difference between what the 'FLP' mob says constitutes 'turn-over' and what UK tax officials define business turn-over as including?

When I've spoken to senior Income Tax, and VAT, Compliance officials in the past about 'Amway' (off the record) they couldn't actually remember seeing an income tax bill relating to someone who was involved with 'Amway.'

Remember, approximately I millions people were churned through 'Amway UK's' so-called 'income opportunity' 1973-2006.

As far as I recall, I spoke to serving VAT officials in the N. of England in 1998-99, but I spoke to a retired Income tax Compliance official, perhaps 10 years ago.

FLhahaha

Top Bots are listed in the magazines (look after page 20 of this one from last year).

gallery.foreverliving.com/gallery/GBR/download/Magazine/June2015.pdf

Not seen this before. A meet up for mlm sellers. Sounds hideous. www.facebook.com/chelle1878/posts/10153225489222331

I have just been invited to an ariix product launch...

Ooh motorhead look at you at the leading edge of MLM scams

I know! throwing but I think the offer might get withdrawn as I asked why she wasn't doing JP anymore..

Motorheadmum Is this event open to anyone? I wonder if 'MLM' bosses will now start to do strip-searches and electronic scanning of 'prospects' whom they suspect might be MN TV spies trying to gather evidence?

You can get some pretty sophisticated hidden cameras off the Net these days. They're even hidden in teddy bears.*

gadgetsandgear.com/security-and-spy/

I want to expand on this, maybe so last can use it for a future blog post. Any suggestions?

Ok, just had a wee little conversation with a very lovely FL bot, and now I have some burning questions for all of you and especially eyes ....

• why do they never mention who they work for or what type of products they sell when first posting? It's always just something vague like "health and wellness"

And, the big one.... Why do I always find it a bit hard to resist their claims of financial success and amazing products despite everything I know? It's like somehow they have a way of overwhelming my rational brain...and I'm highly cynical and not very materialistic so if I am susceptible it shows how good they are at luring people in

eyespying this one is at her home. They do have James lavelle doing a big talk near me later this month... It was interesting her response to why she is no longer doing JP.

What was her response?

PS - if you can say, of course. (You may not be able to.)

Throwing

That it was new to the uk, more diverse products and surprise a more generous compensation plan... She says she is having more success than JP. Her diet lady lost less than I did on a week at slimming world and it cost her about 10 times as much!