Week 5 - Low Carb Bootcamp - the end of the first half

[BIWI]

Morning all.

A very early start to this week's chat thread, as I'm 8 hours ahead of the UK right now.

Here's the Spreadsheet of Fabulousness one more time

Hopefully by now, low carbing is starting to become a habit rather than a hardship. We're out of the dreaded weeks 4 & 4, so for those who haven't seen much movement on the scales, things should start to get going again now (although don't expect to see huge losses from here on - around 1-2lbs a week is a normal and healthy rate of loss)

For those who aren't seeing any movement in the bathroom make sure you're eating plenty of fat - see how you can find ways to add more fat to your diet. Similarly water. And look at what you're eating, and be sure that you're getting your carbs in the main from veg and salad.

I have noticed that there's a fair bit of slippage cheating starting to creep in, and I'm calling you all on that! Remember that this isn't an especially forgiving way of eating, and if you cheat, you won't lose!

But good luck for the rest of the week

@prettybird if DS is doing all the right training at the gym to build muscle, but he's losing weight - then I'd say he probably needs to add more carbs into his diet as well as the fat!

But more than anything else, why is he worrying about his weight?! He's young, he's fit and he's very active. He shouldn't be stepping on the scales.

Woohoo! New low on the scales this morning. Broken past a rather isolated low 2 weeks ago. That's been a while coming.

Also, I had to take my watch in a notch. Not really a spot I wished any slimmer but yay.

Feeling a bit despondent - I weighed this morning and I'm practically the same weight as at the beginning of bootcamp. But I've been really strict - no alcohol, not even a tiny bit of choc, meals mainly based on meat or fish and FLGV. Last time I did this the weight came off really easily, so I can't figure out what I'm doing wrong. So meals are (typically)
B- eggs mashed in butter
L- tuna/pork w mayo and salad
D - varies, but typically something like roast chicken thighs and green veg.
S - coffee with double cream, pork scratchings.

Last night I had sausages with kale (and, strangely HM baba ganoush that was left over - aubergines, tahini, olive oil). I didn't check the carbs of the sausages- but this couldn't be responsible for 2lbs on could it? Or could it be that I had some cheese for afters? Should I cut out dairy completely? Should I start portion control or checking carbs more carefully? I might start writing down what I'm eating more carefully as clearly SOMETHING is going wrong.

Aaaaaaargh..... . Any suggestions welcome!

Should say, I'm 47 and could be perimenopausal?

Sausages are often very high in carbs - can't believe you didn't check!

The most obvious thing is to ask if you're eating enough fat? If you're typically eating tuna and roast chicken they could be pretty lean (obviously depending on the cut of the chicken and if you're eating the skin!)

Writing down what you're eating is a pretty good start, as it could be that you're also guilty of carb creep - if you're not checking your sausages, what else are you not checking?!

Surely if your son wants to gain weight he needs to eat carbs? surely eating all that fat will just fill him up??

if its muscle gain then he needs to eat lots of protein when he weight trains but also carbs to compensate for the energy loss too? im no expert but he sounds very healthy and insulin sensitive. eating good carbs will increase his appetite. Athletes eat a huge amount of food and it isnt usually low carb. perhaps he just needs to eat mooooore!

i know there are lots of studies into low carb during exercise and that it may help fitness but unless he will have expert supervision it will be a difficult balance to strike on his own.

Tahiti (sesame) is pretty high too.

New low for me too this morning! another half a lb down and i will be 12st something not 13st something! its a bit of a whoosh actually after my (week long) blip for surgery etc. that makes 9lb lost during bootcamp and 17 overall.

last time i weight this much was nearly a year ago in my first trimester. still 7lb to pre-preg weight and 2 stone to goal!

He's worrying about his weight because his coach wants him to bulk up! Personally, I think it is just age and it will come with time (I remember Stuart Hogg being a skelf at 18 ) and for the moment he should be proud of his 6-pack.

To give him his due - and shows his developing maturity - he's decided to stop worrying about it as he is happy with the way he is - so he's not going to eat rubbish for the sake of it! I make him plenty of rice or oven chips alongside his protein in his meals - but he hates sauces and doesn't have cream on his berries, so I have to think of other ways of adding fat to his diet (hence the granola ). His new treat (leant about after his 1st hangover 2 weeks ago ) is toast and Bovril with plenty of butter - so I'll encourage more of that.

I also suspect his "weight loss" at the moment is day-to-day fluctuation (at the moment he claims it is the "dreadful" Salter scales and I should buy some more )

@lovelycuppateas how much water are you having? Also - are you close to target, if you have done this WOE in the past? I haven't been posting long, but have read through lots of the threads and people definitely find weight loss slows as they reach target. Hope you get a whoosh soon, or you can work out something that is slowing you down.

@prettybird definitely sounds like a few more carbs needed if he wants to gain weight, lots of porridge / flapjacks / oatcakes? (I am an oat-lover, if you can't tell...!)

Woohoo for you @MrsBertBibby - love getting past a new milestone

Slightly weird NSV here - I had a laporoscopy years ago, left me with a small scar on the RHS of my tummy. You could still see it after my first pg, but after having 6lb+ twins 10 years ago, my tummy is very stretch marked and I haven't been able to see it for years. But this morning, I could see the dent where the scar used to be - so for ages it must have been filled in with with fat under the skin Must be a good sign that I can see it again, I think.....

prettybird I don't have any experience with purposely putting weight on (I wish!) but I think protein shakes after a workout are good for this. My baby brother is 15 and he is like a bean pole but wants to "bulk up" too and I've noticed a difference in him since he has been doing a lot of weights and body combat at the gym, at home he eats normally but doesn't have any sugar (more due to his braces). He has some sort of whey protein shake after the gym. All the fitness people I follow on instagram eat shit loads of potatoes, so he probably needs more carbs.

LeapinLizards I think you have done wonderfully well considering your circumstances, don't beat yourself up over it and I'm very sorry for your loss

I'll maybe try to adapt my granola recipe to make bars for him. I've finally written down the proportions of the granola (the rolled oats, nuts, oil etc) so I can make it consistently. Not sure how to make it "solid" though: add more coconut oil (and maple syrup?) and bake a smaller amount without stirring firmed down in a Swiss roll tin?

Ok, will check sausages next time. Accept the big stick from BIWI. Tahini I did check - 3.4g carbs per 100g, so not high really when it's mixed in with aubergine/olive oil. But maybe I ate too much of it (was very delicious). I'll write stuff down and be a bit more careful and see what's happening - thank you.

Just checked sausages - 3.5g of carbs per 2 sausages (I had 3, so max of 5g of carbs). Doesn't seem that high to me, but am I underestimating how many carbs make a difference?

@prettybird

i use peanut butter, butter and coconut oil to make my nutty bars. just need to have something soft that solidifies at room temp so adding these warm to the mix should work.

It's absolutely fine to not feel v hungry on this WOE, in fact that's one of the great advantages of it!

I use peanut butter to make granola into bars for my dd, she’s a swimmer so has them for post training snacks.

Gammeldragz I was never convinced that the advice I was given was accurate and safe, it was certainly punishing to eat so little over a long period, I stuck with it for 9 months and lost almost 20lbs. I love the thought that my brain needs more calories than my broken body.

I'm quite confused right now - on the one hand it's ok to not eat if you're not hungry, not eating much means I don't get enough fat so I add bpc, now it would appear that not eating enough could be the "thing" that is stalling my weight loss.

I really really wanted to be slimmer for DS's wedding but that's not going to happen but I need to be within a normal BMI to greatly reduce the risks involved with my surgery in the autumn. This is really important for me, having an eighteen hour surgery combined with my paralysed diaphragm is very risky and I'm lucky that I have an anaesthetist willing to look after me at all.

The risk of suffering serious/life threatening complications have been put at 70/80% with a normal BMI that drops to 50% that's massive. I'm not ready to die yet and certainly not because I've got fat that won't fucking piss off.
I never really believed that not eating enough stopped you losing weight but I will make a huge effort to eat more, increase the fat and koko.

I love this bc, brilliant support from lovely people.

@prettybird your son probably needs to use protein shakes to build up if he's doing weights. Try SIS website for a decent brand (you can also get in some Sainsbury's and Tesco). My husband uses the chocolate recovery one

Thanks, BIWI! Don't worry, I fully understand the peer pressure issue. I inwardly cringe at all the Frubes and other yoghurts the kids bring in to nursery. Just looked up the nutritional values and they're 10.7% of added sugar! Eeeek! And then I think of the homemade yoghurt I take in which consists of precisely none! (I know there are carbs in the milk, but I don't put any actual sugar in.)

But I know that, if I do have a child, I'm going to have to buy them such rubbish to help them fit in with everyone else. Grrrr!!!!

But, be that as it may, if one excludes peer pressure, (say I lived on a tiny island with my family and nobody else) would the diet you advocate here be suitable for a child from weaning, or do they 'need' carbs in the same way they need high fat food?

@Seafour

Sound like you have a lot on your plate (oh god that pun was unintentional) Yes i also think the idea of not eating enough stalls your weight loss is also a myth.

I always thought it was a contradiction in the calorie model of weight loss that they would say 'well its simple just burn more calories then you eat' but also apparently 'if you eat too little you will not loose weight' well fuck me i thought 'its just a simple equation'!!!

I think it is michael mosely who looked at this and discovered that 'starvation mode' where your metabolism drops only actually starts after 3-5days of water fasting and even then it is only fraction of what you are burning.

@TimeIhadaNameChange

Carbohydrate is not considered an essential nutriant at all. The body only needs a fairly small amount of glucose for brain function and the body is perfectly capable of converting fat into glucose (that is what ketone are) so technically no.

However i do think it is virtually impossible to both avoid carbs and have a balanced nutritionally complete diet, however unless you live entirely off meat you will be eating some carbs anyway. there are some culture that live entirely off fat and meat (inuits) do know much about their health though.

If you think about what humans would have evolved eating it is in line with what this diet is although i doubt hunter gatherers ate this much meat (our teeth appear to me more like a cows then a cats so more for grinding plants then tearing meat)

Hunter gatherers would have dine a lot of foraging so lots of leaves and insects for protein but limited fruit (seasonal) and limited meat (hard to catch) and limited carbs (what root vegetables they could find would be nothing like potatoes today.

Gammel I think I suggested Seafour add in the BPC as she wasn't eating enough and needed to get her calorie and fat intake up.

CerealKiller the FastFix program was based on Prof Roy Taylor's research into reversing diabetes by mimicking the dietary effect of a gastric bypass. It had been known that a gastric bypass to treat obesity could sometimes spontaneously reverse diabetes and Taylor proved that it was the change in diet that was the cause. Just switching to a low carb diet has not (yet) been proven to reverse diabetes. In my opinion the Newcastle diet is a fast fix for people whose lives are in danger from the complications of diabetes, or facing amputation or loss of eyesight or loss of renal function. If you're prediabetic or newly diagnosed with diabetes then you have more time to experiment with a slower rate of weight loss.

Farine for kids school lunches then a lot depends on your children. Mine are fussy eaters and have food allergies to boot so they eat a pretty conventional diet except much lower in sugar since they aren't expected to eat tons of fruit. They do get fruit but we don't go in for this five a day bullshit and it would be mainly berries, apples or pears. The only really sugary fruit they eat is an occasional banana. They do have biscuits and ice lollies but we don't eat dessert. They're allowed a sugar-sweetened drink once a week and the rest of the time they drink water. They mainly eat meat, potatoes, bread and veggies so it's not low carb per se but lower than average.

Seafour, on the last bootcamp I was definitely not eating enough. Stunt advised me to up the calories (mainly in the form of fat), and I dropped 2lbs within the next couple of days. Your body without doubt adjusts it's 'energy conservation' if it thinks there isn't quite enough coming in. That's not the same thing as the drastic concept of 'starvation mode' on a tiny amount of food, it's just a small sensible adjustment your body makes to balance incoming/outgoing. Which if you're trying to lose weight, you need override!