Maintenance, how much is enough?

[Longlongsummer]

I was wondering about maintenance payments. My ex has paid £180 a month for years. I get that it’s based on income, however he’s self employed so doesn’t declare half of it!

I used to have a good job however I decided to take a part time one to be around more for our son. I’m the main carer. So I don’t earn very much at all.

I think that this is very low. As effectively I am still covering over half of my child’s costs, in mortgage, clothes, food etc. My son in total does not cost only £360 a month I can tell you! I’ve added it up to budget better.

I’m sure that there are parents out there coping with less, less money and less maintenance. Why are we? Why aren’t we shouting that it’s not right?

I also pay for all the extra activities that my son does, music lessons, child care when younger, extra tuition. He has some mild learning difficulties and I’ve paid for extra help. I’ve paid for every single penny of everything without receiving any extra and I’m feeling a little sick of being both the main breadwinner and main carer.

I’ve talked with other lone parents, and this seems to be the norm. Mothers paid an amount based on CSA which is based not on what the child needs, but what the Dad earns and is the absolute minimum. And yet every father seems to take that as being ‘doing their fair share’.

And I’ve never complained to Ex. And yet I think, what are we doing as women, by just letting this happen? Why aren’t men paying half of the costs for their kids? Is this really common?

no morally I don't think they should pay half the costs, because those costs may well be decided without any input from them, and so it would be incredibly unfair, and another way in which RPs can extort more money out of NRPS for their own benefit rather than the benefit of the child.

The thing is most women WANT to be RP and therefore have to take the costs associated with that. Nobody is forced to be RP if they don't want to be.

Now that is quite an interesting statement!

How many people would agree with this?

@ThighThighOfthigh that's a very odd statement to make about budgets for bringing up children. Half the cost of bringing up a child is nowhere near as low as £50, let me assure you. Some of the essential expenses you have missed are: haircuts, trainers, school uniform, school trips, stationery & books, winter coats, school holiday activities- either childcare or play schemes, birthday presents for parties they're invited to, petrol, bus fares, their own birthday parties. That's before you consider "non essentials" like swimming lessons, football boots etc.

duchess well £50 a week would be about £216 per month.

So double that, 216 for each parent, that's £432 per month. I can tell you right now I don't spend even close to that PER MONTH on Ds.

Not even close.

So @holidayhelpppp
I’m money grabbing for my own benefit?
I’ve the privilege of bringing up our child alone and doing all the parenting, with zero co parenting support, because it’s nothing to do with my child’s best interests?
So I should suck it up and just pay the majority too?

Do you really think so lowly of single women and mothers?

@holidayhelpppp I did not choose to be RP, although I am very glad ex H was happy not to fight me for it. He wanted 50/50 at first, to avoid paying maintenance, then agreed to 10 days contact a month which reduced to 4 days which has since reduced to zero. Being the RP should not mean a complete lack of interest from the NRP or acceptance of all the costs. Why do you think it is fair that my ex can choose to do as little as he likes and I pay for everything?

Why are some posters racing to say how little kids can cost?

Don’t they want the best for everyone’s kids?

long again, stop twisting my words, I didn't say YOU were, but some RPs definitely do.

I don't think lowly of single mothers at all, I have a lot of respect for single parents whatever their sex.

I didn't say you should suck it up, I said you should expect what CMS tell him to pay, but realistically you're not going to get more than that.

I also explained why morally I don't think "half" really works.

haha, I do want the best for my child, and he has a very nice life. I don't have to throw money at him to achieve that, thankfully.

Being the RP should not mean a complete lack of interest from the NRP or acceptance of all the costs. Why do you think it is fair that my ex can choose to do as little as he likes and I pay for everything?

im not sure I said it was fair, but realistically you cant force someone to be interested in their children, and a sensible way to look at it is that anything could happen and you could be left to care and pay for them on your own, and you (and anyone else with children) should be prepared for that.

I also haven't said you should pay for everything?

Holidayhelppp of corse your right she can't ask CMS for more due to her private costs but some of your reply's sounded as if you was implying child support isn't for help towards housing costs when it is,

No it isn't to cover half the costs of a child yes it's calculated on the non residential parent income, you could also go down the road of parents who are together living with they child/children that's very rarely 50/50 on child costs.
I agree it needs serious adjusting especially parents who refuse to support they child at all but I don't think it should be 50/50 on childcosts especially holidays,hobby's and such that's down to the parent who wants to contribute to such things

well makes its just towards a payment for their upbringing, I couldn't find anything on the gov website that specifies its to pay for an extra bedroom.

The receiving parent can spend it on whatever they want.

It is definitely NOT a very good system, in fact its bloody awful, but until someone comes up with a better way which is actually viable, we are stuck with it.

@DuchessMinnie I fear many exes suggest 50/50 for that reason sadly.

I know a minority of women are selfish, I get that. I get that some men are the resident parents too.

However the vast majority of single mothers really are bringing up their kids to the best of their ability, to benefit their child. They tend to have been the main carer before separation. And so are after. I spend a lot of my money on my child, way, way more than his father. I do it because I am more invested in our child and his father has just taken a more selfish approach.

I fear many exes suggest 50/50 for that reason sadly

im sure they do, and some RPs suggest no overnight contact to maximise the money they receive.

@holidayhelpppp I am in awe of your superior budgeting skills because I do spend a lot more than that on mine and I am not extravagant. Their weekly bus passes are £17 each for a start so that's £110 per month alone if you spread the cost over the year. Childcare is £800 per month and babysitting £8.70 an hour maybe twice a month for 3-4 hours a time. Food maybe an extra £30 a week between them on top of the normal family shopping = £130 a month. Haircuts £12 each every 2 months, £10 per present for friends' parties- maybe average of 1 a month between them. School uniform £20 a month maybe, shoes £120 twice a year so another £20 a month. £30 a month in petrol getting them to places, maybe £30 a month for everyday clothes. That's £1,202 just off the top of my head- perhaps you could tell me where I am overspending?

@holidayhelpppp there’s a big difference in saying as you could have said to me..
Yes a father should be paying housing, and half of all basic needs. But the system is wrong.

Otherwise you are saying that I should, just by default, be paying more than half. Which is what you have been saying.

Do you not see how you prop up people like my ex by gunning for me and excusing them? Not just excusing them but by saying women like me are money grabbers? Or is that just some throw away comment out of thin air?

lol when have I said my budgeting was superior? maybe my circumstances are just different than yours..

I just hate the whole "well my kids cost me a grand a month" well good for you, but not everyones do!

Nursery costs are expensive, and previously DSS cost us a fortune in nursery fees but significantly less now he gets his free hours.

I am not sure childcare costs should be included in maintenance calculations though, in some cases they should but in others not so much.

no long im saying he shouldn't pay more because your mortgage is expensive.

I don't know how many times I have to say it, you seem to just me completely misinterpreting what im saying or just trying to start an argument.

@DuchessMinnie I added mine up and they are similar. I offered to sit down with ex and decide together what we mutually thought was important, for our son, and then split that. Answer was no!

@Longlongsummer yes, I get that. I spend way more too and that is because I am fully invested in being a parent and giving them the best upbringing I can. Ex H may be getting away with far cheaper costs but he does not have the satisfaction and clear conscience of knowing he did the right thing.

Do you not see how you prop up people like my ex by gunning for me and excusing them? Not just excusing them but by saying women like me are money grabbers? Or is that just some throw away comment out of thin air?

Please can you quote me where I have excused your ex?

can you also show me where I said "women like you are money grabbers"

@holidayhelpppp who says my mortgage is expensive? It’s cheaper than rent. I get it’s a little tricky to work out, however that doesn’t mean he gets to pay nothing, for me it’s the difference between a one bed and two bed, and splitting that difference. Hell I’d have even accepted a fraction of the cost!

I think that’s what happens. We get beaten down, made to feel that we are so lucky to bring up their kids for them, and that anything not totally inarguably a minimal need like food is something we just have to ‘suck up’ as previous posters have so kindly reminded me.

Why did you say women are money grabbers then? What relevance has it on this thread?

long but its not his responsibility to pay towards your mortgage, he is responsible to pay whatever cms tell him to pay. They don't care how many bedrooms you have!

Youre being very dramatic!

I didn't say "women are money grabbers" I said

and another way in which RPs can extort more money out of NRPS for their own benefit rather than the benefit of the child

and believe it or not, some RP's (note how I didn't say women at all there) do this!

Its relevant to the thread because you asked if morally NRPs should pay half and I explained why I don't agree.

@DuchessMinnie good for you. Our kids need someone to go the extra mile for them. You sound like a good parent.

I wish my ex just acknowledged that I’m financially taking the majority burden. He has become more and more selfish, and berates me if I don’t spend extra money on our son. A few years ago I asked if he could help with some extra tuition, that I’d paid for years. Even the word help, why did I use that? He’s not helping me. It’s just what parents do. Anyway he refused, and I did just ‘suck it up’, however as he was aware that my son really needed it (some learning difficulties), and perhaps felt bad, started sending me horrible emails about how could I not pay for it, that I had loads of money, that I was neglecting his son etc. as, like @holidayhelpppp was referencing, apparently as main carer I was so privileged anyway, poor him not having his son, so it was up to me to pay too.