Maintenance, how much is enough?

[Longlongsummer]

I was wondering about maintenance payments. My ex has paid £180 a month for years. I get that it’s based on income, however he’s self employed so doesn’t declare half of it!

I used to have a good job however I decided to take a part time one to be around more for our son. I’m the main carer. So I don’t earn very much at all.

I think that this is very low. As effectively I am still covering over half of my child’s costs, in mortgage, clothes, food etc. My son in total does not cost only £360 a month I can tell you! I’ve added it up to budget better.

I’m sure that there are parents out there coping with less, less money and less maintenance. Why are we? Why aren’t we shouting that it’s not right?

I also pay for all the extra activities that my son does, music lessons, child care when younger, extra tuition. He has some mild learning difficulties and I’ve paid for extra help. I’ve paid for every single penny of everything without receiving any extra and I’m feeling a little sick of being both the main breadwinner and main carer.

I’ve talked with other lone parents, and this seems to be the norm. Mothers paid an amount based on CSA which is based not on what the child needs, but what the Dad earns and is the absolute minimum. And yet every father seems to take that as being ‘doing their fair share’.

And I’ve never complained to Ex. And yet I think, what are we doing as women, by just letting this happen? Why aren’t men paying half of the costs for their kids? Is this really common?

The thing is though, you chose to have your kid too. Yes you need a bigger flat/house, that's because you chose to have a kid.

I agree in an ideal world, the NRP should pay half of what the child costs not a % paid on their income - but how would that work? Our system is far from perfect but you chose your partner, you chose to go part time and you chose to be a Mother, those decisions mean your lifestyle is more expensive surely?

More than the present 12% for a first child, for sure. No NRPs are paying 50%, they have plenty of money to live on. Yes I’ve heard all that about them having to support a second household. Does that include kids and if so, whose kids?

You cannot categorically say "they have plenty of money to live on"

I imagine some of them will earn minimum wage. Lets say thats 40 hours a week so roughly £1262 a month. (Thats with no pension deduction)

So then less 12% theyd be left with about £1100 give or take (i think cms do 12% of your gross wage dont they? Idk anyway)

So out of £1100 youve got your rent or mortgage lets say £500
Gas electric ct and water at lets say £200
A car and insurance at maybe £100?
Lets say fuel another £100
Food maybe another £150?

Youve got £50 left. Thats not plenty of money is it.

Well dp supports our child which i dont think is particularly wrong to be honest.

Hed need his own house regardless of whether he had me and ds though..

@giantnannyknickers it’s amazing that anyone can assert maintenance lower than half the child care costs is to fund our lifestyles!

I’d laugh if it wasn’t so painfully horribly wrong. As my ex swans off on holiday and I am working until I die with little pension... because I sacrificed financially for our child.

@Tatty101 I’m just very surprised we let a father not pay half the costs and say nothing to them. Yet if a mother complains she ‘chose him’ so it’s somehow her fault? My sons costs did not change whether I was working part time or full time. I still pay most of his care. It’s not right.

If I did the same, and paid strictly what my ex pays for my son, he’d be sleeping on a couch for the rest of his childhood in the living room. I think people would have something to say about that! I don’t think anyone would be saying ‘fair enough, your ex doesn’t pay enough so why should you?’

At minimum wage levels there would also be child benefit for the extra child in the new household and tax credits.

Anyone having an extra child should really consider whether they can afford it while still supporting the children they already have. I know life doesn’t always work out like that. But that’s the point, isn’t it? The NRP already has commitments and has to pay those first. Or would you prefer that the existing children are simply forgotten about altogether?

“As my ex swans off on holiday and I am working until I die with little pension”. Part time of course. Or you could work full time and have a better pension. Rather than attacking him your ex who is actually paying the accepted amount of maintenance, start a life for yourself and take some responsibility that you chose to have a child. He is still in that child’s life. Right know you sound like you expect everything to be provided for you simply for having him

OP - why don't you channel some of the anger you have shown on here and ask him for more each month?

What did CMS say when you contacted them recently?

You’re not going to get more. And it may be unfair but unlikely to change while you’re a parent.

I think you need to think about what you will do as your ds gets older and turns 18 and the cs stops completely. And any other child related benefits you may get now.

Would your ex be open to taking on a heavier load with regards to caring for his ds? Does he live close enough to school to enable 30/70, 40/60 even 50/50? Obviously he would have to get an extra bedroom but this would be in the ds best interests anyway. A sofa doesn’t sound ideal.

Are you able to move back into the higher paying work? If not in the near future, will it be easy to transition back into it when your ds is older?

You say you have a dh; is he being fair with regards to paying equal towards living costs? (I know that sometimes the new dh expects to pay 1/3 and then the parent with child is paying 2/3s of the living costs which makes it difficult)

cats i didnt mention any new child??

If youre single, on min wage, living alone and paying maintenance you simply DONT have plenty of money.

You clearly know im right because you've totally ignored the point im making and are crying about child benefit and "oh wont someone think about the first children"

For us personally the maintenance payment dps ex gets is way more than we spend on ds a week.

Wont anybody think of poor destitute ds? No because hes the second child and his welfare doesnt matter.

Fwiw i dont find children all that expensive bar child care.

And before you say it dss was 12-14 when he lived here so i do know about teenagers too.

If youre single, on min wage, living alone and paying maintenance you simply DONT have plenty of money.

Indeed. Hence the very small maintenance they would be required to pay. It would be tiny

Yes menorca itd be about £170 per month, but as i showed above theyd have practically nothing after paying that and bills so what im asking is all those who suggest a higher percentage - where do you think that should come from because quite clearly some NRPS wouldn't be able to afford it.

I guess if you’re on min wage and finding it hard you could always try to get a better paying job. Min wage is only a start, other jobs are available and unemployment is at a record low. Yes and you’d have to pay more money for your child if you earned more but it’s proportional. Having a child costs money.

And if you’re on min wage maybe you shouldn’t be running a car, looking at your example. Buses are available.

I guess if you’re on min wage and finding it hard you could always try to get a better paying job

Ah yes because its that easy isnt it.

Would you say that to an RP who was finding it difficult on min wage or?

I suppose if you have a PT job and need more money you could go FT? Ah wait no thats not acceptable is it.

Its like you dont even live in the real world.

Buses arent always cheaper than a car. For instance id need 2 busses a day to get to work which would cost me more than all the payments for my car split into days.

Practically nothing - not really.

What about the situation you describe - single and on minimum wage.

And add a child in to mix.

£50 per month is practically nothing menorca

Could you live on that after bills?

Well when you add a child into the mix youd get a considerable amount of UC, plus CB and possibly maintenance from the other parent.

Thats not what were discussing, though is it?

Its really not unreasonable to suggest someone on minimum wage tries to get a better job or a promotion or increases their hours if they find they don’t have enough money. It’s as if YOU don’t live in the real world. Do you think everyone lives on min wage? Have you seen the cost of housing and cars?

The RP’s money is for the child. The child has two parents and both should pay. It actually is hard to get work to fit around small children. I worked all the way through and I was lucky enough to have a good job and be able to afford childcare. Well, not lucky, I had good qualifications and a career before I decided to have children. But I do realise it’s hard for people who gave up work maybe because a husband agreed that was the best way to do things and then the husband upped and left and they were left high and dry and jobless.

Right now I work part time but that is entirely my choice because I earned enough to be able to take the cut. I can still pay my way. I’m not desperate for money from my good-for-nothing ex but I realise some RPs are. I also believe parents should pay towards their children.

Absolutely I couldn’t.
My income when I incorporate maintenance is >£4K a month

If you’re on minimum wage - then I’m afraid that’s the life you have to suck up

cats a lot of people do work for minimum wage. Youre totally deluded if you think thats not the case.

I know exactly how much cars and houses cost considering i own both. That doesnt mean people dont earn min wage though!

Ofc its hard to get school hours work but you can, like you say, pay for childcare. Which as a single parent youd get financial help towards.

It probably is harder for women who were previously SAHMs and this is one big fat reason why id never reccomend it to anyone. Thats not entirely the husbands fault though.

Both parents should pay towards and even £170 a month is doing just that.

You suggest a higher % but it clearly wouldn't work for a lot of people.

Does that not apply to mothers then too menorca?

I’ve never had any financial help towards any childcare. But then I’ve been a working parent the entire way through - the funded free hours came in after my time. So many assumptions here - “single parents get free stuff”. No they don’t. Nor would I expect to. But then I don’t work for minimum wage and never dared depend on anyone else.

In my case the “poor NRP” got a settlement from me that means he can live mortgage free and have money left over. He still resents paying the tiny CMS sum for his DD.