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Infertility

Our Infertility Support forum is a space to connect with others in the same position, discuss causes, treatment and IVF, and share infertility stories of hope and success.

August 2020 IVF - continued

691 replies

Lepatz · 06/09/2020 07:17

Morning ladies!

We hit our 1000 limit on the original thread! That’s 1000 messages of support and advice, celebrating every happy milestone, and being there for uncertainty and bad news too. Thanks @Mseddy for setting up our little cohort :)

Will try to tag the regulars, apologies if I miss anyone. @Custardandcream @nextweek @kikisparks @StayingPositive8 @Bruce2 @CardboardCat @MrsT36 @loulamay @MsNoons17 Argh, my phone is refusing to autocomplete properly - I hope that works.

Wishing everyone heath and happiness - whatever stage of the journey you're on xx

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Lepatz · 10/09/2020 18:13

@Bruce2 Congratulations, this news has made me smile. I'm so happy to hear good news here - it's hope for all of us :) xxx

@MrsT36 sorry to hear about your lighter line - fingers crossed it's just dilution or some other factor, and that OTD will be nice and dark for you xx

@kikisparks I'm sorry to hear you've had a rough few days. The hotel sounds like a wonderful getaway!

@nextweek - I agree, this forum is so important for support and comfort xx

Still no word from the hospital re my funding question. But I'm feeling a bit calmer about it all today. The AF cramps and headache have both eased, which is really helping. And I just treated myself to a lovely deep massage - it's been forever!

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Custardandcream · 10/09/2020 21:19

@MrsT36 I’m sorry, hope you’re ok Flowers

@kikisparks sorry you’re having a hard time, it’s really good work are being supportive and a trip away sounds like a great idea

@loulamay I’ll be thinking of you tomorrow

@Bruce2 that’s fantastic news! Congratulations!

@Lepatz glad you are feeling a bit calmer, hope the clinic get back to you soon

Lepatz · 11/09/2020 09:06

Good luck today @loulamay x

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loulamay · 11/09/2020 09:17

Thanks @Lepatz! Some light pink discharge this morning so am prepared for another miscarriage but we shall see. I have a notebook with questions ready for my poor Dr if so, hahaha. Feeling quite determined and strong rather than sad so that's good. If it hasn't worked out then a month or two break is what we'll do - talked about it yesterday. This process is hard work, both physically and emotionally and I feel like it's taken over our lives a bit, of late! Luckily we have some frosties.

Hope everyone has a lovely day. Thank god it's Friday. xxxx

kikisparks · 11/09/2020 09:53

Good luck @loulamay I hope it’s better news than you are expecting but that is great you’re feeling determined and strong and have a plan.

nextweek · 11/09/2020 10:04

Good luck @loulamay keeping everything crossed for you!

nextweek · 11/09/2020 11:31

I've been having some aches and twinges today and it's really stressing me out, I know it could be something and nothing, but I can't help panicking. My scan feels so far away, I hate not knowing what's going on!

loulamay · 11/09/2020 15:34

Hi all. Update from me - embryo hasn't grown and there's still no heartbeat so it's sadly no longer considered a viable pregnancy. It's what I suspected so actually think I came to terms with it at the last scan and feel ok. I was lucky enough to have an awesome 45 minute chat with my Dr, who is just so great and he answered all of my questions. He is doing a D&C on Monday to try and get some of the tissue that can be tested for abnormalities. I took notes from the session, not sure if anyone would like to see? It's a bit of an essay!

Bruce2 · 11/09/2020 16:45

@loulamay sorry you've had it confirmed as not viable. That truly is heartbreaking but you seem like a very strong lady. You're doing amazing. Definitely let us know outcome of D&C

@nextweek I'm hating the twinges at the moment. Makes you feel so uneasy and like there's something wrong
Hubby and I have also been struck down with food poisoning past 24 hrs so that's a huge worry over my head right now, not that o can do much to change anything. What will be will be, just need to wait for 12 week scan now

kikisparks · 11/09/2020 16:54

@loulamay Been waiting for your update, I’m so sorry Flowers you’re so strong, you sound like you’re handling this so well. I hope that the D&C is straightforward and not too painful and he gets the tissue he needs for the test. I would really appreciate seeing what your doctor said in response to your questions if you don’t mind sharing, but absolutely no rush, and only if you’re totally comfortable doing so. I’m really glad he gave you lots of time to ask questions which hopefully made you feel a little more informed of your options. Hope you can rest over the weekend and take care of yourself with nice food, a bath, tv and whatever you need.

Custardandcream · 11/09/2020 21:24

@loulamay I’m so sorry Flowers I’m very glad you had a good chat with your Dr and I really hope you get some answers from Monday. I agree a bit of a break will give you time to recover emotionally and physically.

@nextweek and @Bruce2 the twinges are quite stressful aren’t they? Hope you feel better soon Bruce2. I got angry and shouty earlier (not my finest moment Blush) then burst into tears because I was scared I’d caused a problem! I’ll be honest though I was worried the whole 9 months last time and never felt particularly confident.

MsNoons17 · 11/09/2020 22:32

So sorry @loulamay

nextweek · 12/09/2020 07:51

@loulamay I'm so sorry it wasn't better news and hope everything goes ok on Monday. It sounds like you have a really strong and positive mindset.

@Bruce2 hope you're both feeling a bit better, food poisoning is the worst!
@custardandcream I've found myself very emotional and irritable at times, its just all the uncertainty. I know I need to try and de-stress, my scan is still a long way off

loulamay · 12/09/2020 10:40

Okay here are my notes! Sorry that it's quite long but I am a 'knowledge is power' kind of gal!

Dr Zinn – 11/9/20
Benefits of having a D&C procedure over natural miscarriage.

Karyotyping – counts up the chromosomes to see if the count if normal. Doesn’t guarantee that there isn’t a genetic problem at a deeper level. If the count comes back as abnormal, then we can say that this was pre-destined to be a miscarriage and we couldn’t have done anything to influence the success of this particular pregnancy. There’s an age-related risk and it’s a numbers game. Going to do a D&C to try and get this tissue for the testing. Chance that if the sex chromosomes of this embryo are female, if the count is normal, we won’t be able to be 100% sure that it’s the pregnancy chromosomes and not mine. If male, obviously we’ll be able to tell that it’s not me. It might also be an issue in mine and OH’s DNA called a balanced translocation.

www.verywellfamily.com/balanced-translocation-and-recurrent-miscarriage-2371840#what-balanced-translocation-means

D&C will ‘clean out’ the possible debris in my uterine lining which could negatively affect pregnancy next time. Some studies suggest that women who have had a ‘cleaning’ of the uterus have a higher success rates in next pregnancies because the cleaning may reduce the chance of the immune environment being negative.

Another procedure, which is similar, is the endometrial scratch, theory behind it is that it improves stem cell production by stimulating new cells in the endometrium and enhancing the body’s natural ability for healing. Boosts endometrial quality. No way to say if it makes the difference in a successful pregnancy but it does no harm. Can do that test in the luteal phase.

Histological dating. Possible to take a sample of the endometrium in the luteal phase to check on the best ‘window’ of hospitability for implantation. Can be different for different women. The purpose of this (it’s similar to the ERA test) is to find out the best time for the embryo transfer to try and optimise implantation. As I’m not having an issue with the implantation part, we probably won’t do this.

Immune stuff: the embryo can overcome the immune system, but the immune system can also ‘eat’ the embryo. The receptivity can be almost ‘too much’ or not enough. The Clexane I have been taking will reduce the inflammatory response in either case so we'll include it next round.

There is information that we can get from PGS testing our embryos. Upside: you can reduce the frustration and ‘time-wasting’ of future transfers and possible miscarriages. The downside is the manipulation of the embryo, which might not survive the process and the fact that it’s costly. You can also get normal embryos but that’s still not a guarantee that I won’t miscarry.

There are women whose bodies and immune system (and endometrium) are less discriminatory (it’s called unfussy uterus) and accept implantations more readily than others. So, you end up potentially having more miscarriages than other women, because normally the embryos would be rejected and not implant at all. There’s a test that you can do (pioneered by Dr Lesley Regan) to check out thrombophilic defects which looks at the pattern of blood clots. Still in its formative phase. The result would still be to use Clexane in any case. Could also add low-dose aspirin next round to cover off any ‘sticky blood’ issues.

www.researchgate.net/publication/11311348_Thrombophilia_and_pregnancy_loss

Read her book: www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B07232ZCYJ/ref=dp-kindle-redirect?_encoding=UTF8&btkr=1&tag=mumsnetforu03-21

No obvious issues from my scans of any anatomical or uterine issues with things like endometritis or polyps. Will be able to see more with the D&C in any case.

Natural Killer cells? Expensive test and would be treated with Clexane anyway. Possible additional use of steroids on next protocol. Will depend on the D&C results. Soft data does exist for some people as to its benefits.

Custardandcream · 12/09/2020 21:39

@nextweek yes I really need to de stress my scan is over two weeks away yet!

@loulamay those are very detailed notes! It sounds like you have a good plan for the next steps which is great, I do know of people who have had success with an endometrial scratch.

Mseddy · 13/09/2020 11:03

Hi all. Sorry I took a few days away whilst we where on holiday to process everything. Congrats @Custardandcream on the bfp and @Bruce2 on the scan.

@loulamay im so sorry to hear your news Flowers this whole journey sucks.

@MrsT36 I hope your lines have started to get darker, I know how you feel right now, it's awful.

My bleed following my chemical was odd and I wanted to see if others had anything similar. Sorry if this is TMI. I got my fainter line on the Sunday morning and then had pink when I wiped in the evening. I wouldn't say the bleeding ever got to more than a light period/just more than spotting volume wise, but there was a fair amount of "lumps". I had some really bad cramps through this and even some pain "up" if that makes sense. This all stopped on Thursday. My thinking was that because I was still on progesterone until Monday that that bleed was my body loosing the embryo and its related bits, but that my lining was still in place as the bleed was no where near anything like a normal period. Anyway its Sunday so nearly a week post progesterone and still no big bleed like last time. Has anyone had anything similar? Is my cycle going to be messed up for a while?

nextweek · 14/09/2020 07:39

@Mseddy sorry I don't have any advice on that, but just wanted to say i hope you're doing ok and hope everything settles down quickly for you

Bruce2 · 14/09/2020 12:59

@Mseddy

Hi all. Sorry I took a few days away whilst we where on holiday to process everything. Congrats *@Custardandcream on the bfp and @Bruce2* on the scan.

@loulamay im so sorry to hear your news Flowers this whole journey sucks.

@MrsT36 I hope your lines have started to get darker, I know how you feel right now, it's awful.

My bleed following my chemical was odd and I wanted to see if others had anything similar. Sorry if this is TMI. I got my fainter line on the Sunday morning and then had pink when I wiped in the evening. I wouldn't say the bleeding ever got to more than a light period/just more than spotting volume wise, but there was a fair amount of "lumps". I had some really bad cramps through this and even some pain "up" if that makes sense. This all stopped on Thursday. My thinking was that because I was still on progesterone until Monday that that bleed was my body loosing the embryo and its related bits, but that my lining was still in place as the bleed was no where near anything like a normal period. Anyway its Sunday so nearly a week post progesterone and still no big bleed like last time. Has anyone had anything similar? Is my cycle going to be messed up for a while?

Sorry @Mseddy never had anything similar to help compare. Hope you're doing ok though?

Hope everyone is doing ok this Monday

Not sure if anyone has any testing/scans left but good luck if so.
Nothing much to report my end. All quiet and trying to not think too much about it all as still very early and I'm extremely nervous this time round.
Xx

nextweek · 14/09/2020 14:23

@Bruce2 Have you both recovered from the food poisoning? I can't remember if you said previously but was your husband allowed to attend the 7 week scan?

Bruce2 · 14/09/2020 15:03

@nextweek
Yes thank you, both feeling much better!!
Yes he was allowed to attend, was lovely as he got to video the ultrasound so we have our little baby's heartbeat on our phones now. Just a flicker but you can make out the top and bottom of whole thing.
Apparently he should also have been at the transfer but I didn't read the instructions properly so didn't invite him..Not that it matters now I suppose.

Lepatz · 14/09/2020 15:04

Hi everyone, hope you all had peaceful weekends. I've had a couple of days away from both my computer and the whole process and starting to feel more myself. Still no update on next steps, but I'm resigned back into the process :) Started running again, and the sun is shining - the world seems a brighter place.

@loulamay I'm so so sorry to hear your fears were confirmed. You do sound so strong, and thank you for sharing those notes. Good luck with the D&C today xx

@Bruce2 Oh bleurgh - food poisoning on top of everything must have been rotten. Hope you're feeling better in all the ways now :)

@Custardandcream @nextweek Hope you are both keeping well :) xx

@Mseddy I actually thought about posting a similar question just before the weekend. I had my last progesterone a week past Saturday, but no bleeding til Tuesday, which only lasted a couple of days. I had cramps all that week, and kept expecting a tsunami... but hardly anything came of it. Maybe 20% or so of my usual flow. As an aside, I'm now fairly convinced the cramps and bleed I had on 7dp5dt was the embryo giving up - all my symptoms started fading from pretty much exactly then. So now I'm wondering if I should have tested earlier so at least I would have known if it was a failure to implant or a something a little further down the line.

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loulamay · 14/09/2020 15:55

Hi everyone,

Bit groggy and sore after my D&C but doing ok. Not sure how long I have to wait for results but seeing my Dr for a check-up later in the week. He mentioned this morning before I went into theatre that I might have a bit of a hormone crash tomorrow so I bit the bullet and told my boss that I'd had a miscarriage and have a few days off which is a relief.

@Lepatz - so glad you're feeling brighter. Sunshine is like therapy to me and everything seems better on a blue sky day.

@Mseddy - My period after my chemical was pretty heavy. Can you call the clinic and see what they advise?

@Bruce2 - sorry you're feeling anxious. Come on here and stress away any time you like! We all totally understand.

@nextweek @Custardandcream - hope the pre-scan waiting isn't too bad!

No-one has to answer this of course, but how is everyone feeling about their next steps? I went straight into my next transfer after my first BFN and then second chemical pregnancy, but going to take at least a couple of months off this time round, just to give my body (and mind!) a rest. Also not sure how I feel about doing PGS testing and wondered if anyone else had been offered that? I think it's quite expensive and I keep reading different opinions online about its usefulness.

Sorry if this is in any way insensitive or too much for those still processing their news xx

nextweek · 15/09/2020 11:05

@loulamay glad the procedure went well and hope you're recovering and taking care of your self.
@Bruce2 my husband wasn't allowed in for the transfer and not sure if he'll be allowed in for the 7 wk scan. I really hope he is, it'll be awful if we get bad news and I'm there on my own!

Bruce2 · 15/09/2020 11:15

@loulamay I waited a year between frozen transfers
Did one in 2018 and then one in 2019
Both failed. I'm sure the outcome would have been same if I'd done one month after another mind you!
Only you'll know when you're ready emotionally. But I gave my body 11 months of a break and still got a BFN.
Really think it's to do with the embryo quality rather than your body but that's just my uneducated/non-medic opinion.
Both my frozen embryos looked great on paper but never developed after transfer do there must have been chromosomal defiance's or genetic issues that would never have been picked up during the process.

I wish I hadn't waited so long between now. But that's just me

Hope you're doing ok xx

Bruce2 · 15/09/2020 11:16

[quote nextweek]@loulamay glad the procedure went well and hope you're recovering and taking care of your self.
@Bruce2 my husband wasn't allowed in for the transfer and not sure if he'll be allowed in for the 7 wk scan. I really hope he is, it'll be awful if we get bad news and I'm there on my own![/quote]
Oh that's hard, I hope they can at least allow him in for a bit.
Our clinic had no issue with mine being there, they encouraged it.
Funny how they're all so different
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