Would you be my Infertility/Clomid/Follicle tracking friend please?!

[scienceteachergeek]

Hi there ladies

I’m really looking for a ‘clomid friend’ or ‘infertility pal’!

I’m 30, DH is 38. I came off the pill July 2013 to regulate my cycles and ended 15yrs of antidepressants in March 2014 as I’d read that was the best plan if possible.

I’d been having regular 27/30day cycles since I came off the pill but after no positive tests, buying OPKs and the Clearblue Advanced Fertility Monitor, plus charting temps and monitoring my cervix and mucus it quickly became apparent that I wasn’t ovulating. After all the blood tests, sperm analysis, trans-vaginal scans and the HSG it showed that he was fine but I wasn’t ovulating, but there was not obvious reason why.

Fast forward to now, 2yrs since coming off the pill, I have been prescribed clomid and have taken my first 5 tablets. I’m day 12 today and have been having follicle tracking to check if the drugs have worked. My largest follicle was 16.4mm today and have to go back on Wednesday to check it again.

Do any of you know if that’s a good size? Or have any experiences of being further down the clomid path? Or are you in a similar position? I just feel like I’m going out of my mind and could really use a buddy!

Thanks for reading and hugs to you all. Interested in hearing from any of you xxx

I have some symptoms that fits the protocol for straight to lap and dye :-( At least we get to know whats happening in there and hopefully treat anything that is happening all in one go!

Hello my lovely ladies and good to have you back birchy.

So many posts I can't keep up, to all those in fertile window keep shagging. I'm in TWW and totally off sex poor DH... 9DPO today and have been so busy haven't thought about testing but no doubt the POAS addiction will raise its head soon...

My invisible clear aligners/braces are much better thanks to those who asked.. The first two days were awful but a week and a day in and I don't notice them. I am supposed to change them every two weeks so hoping they won't hurt next time I change

Read something lovely on facebook today about John Legend and his wife who are finally pregnant after 5 years. The article said some great things about infertility...would have been good if I could have tagged you all in it! I'll try and find a link.

Hello lovely ladies

I hope you're all well. Sorry I've been offline for the past few days - work has been absolute madness. I'm supposed to be off for a week from today as I am so exhausted I decided I needed some time away from work...anyway, somehow I've been roped into helping at a conference in London on Thursday, which means a lot of travelling today and Friday (on my days off, grrrr). London's a long way away from where I live, but I don't mind as I worked there for quite a few years and have loads of friends there, but it's a bit annoying having my week off interrupted. Also, I've ended up having to pull late night shifts the past few days trying to get work finished as people are total arseholes and have to be unnecessarily difficult, and they've suddenly decided that everything needs to be done NOW (do the client Christmas party invitations REALLY need to go out next week? Is that in any way MY job? No!). Anyway...[pauses and takes huge breath]

Bananafish - Thank you for explaining everything. It's all very confusing! I really don't know all that much about IVF. It's good that it sounds like there's stuff they can do, or at least try. How are you doing at the moment?

As for my oestradial - this was taken on CD2. Are you sure it's good to be low? The GP said it's "too low" although he wasn't able to tell me anything else. I just need to speak to a specialist but that's going to take forever .

Science - That must be stressful about the fibroid. At least it's very small (I say that NOT being a doctor!). My friend just had an operation to remove hers and it was 25mm! At least they know it's there and they can keep an eye on things.

I hope the sickness has died down. I'm loving the gifts!

Yes - I saw that about John Legend. It gives me some hope. It was his wife that I mentioned on this thread a few weeks ago. They must have "come out" about their infertility once they knew that she was pregnant (which is totally understandable). We definitely need more celebrities to be open about it, because that's who the general public listens to. People are so clueless about the whole thing. I guess I was until I started trying .

Badleg - Hope you had a good day off and that you've managed to DTD

Birchy - I had a lap & dye in July. It's nothing to worry about, although obviously not loads of fun! They will be able to tell a lot by doing it, and you'll either be given a clean bill of health or they'll have a better idea about what may be causing problems.

That's a shame that you only get one shot at IVF on the NHS. The area I grew up in and lived in until a few years ago historically allowed NO IVF on the NHS. It changed it's rules about a year ago to allow one. That would have been awful. Are you in a position where you could save up and go privately?

Do not even think about the bridesmaid stuff! Hopefully it will tempt fate . Really don't stress about it as this is so much more important than looking skinny in a dress and not vomiting when walking down the aisle. Personally I wouldn't stop as I would always think "what if that was the month when things went right". That said, if you'd welcome a break from TTC for your own mental wellbeing then maybe it is worth stopping for a month or two.

NewLeaf - I'm glad the teeth/mouth are a bit less painful. I'm sure it will be worth it in the end. I always said I'd get my teeth whitened next year if I'm still not pg. Sadly I'm now probably going to have to save everything I can incase we need to pay for private IVF.

Vap - How are you doing lovely? I've followed your other posts (e.g. climbed prescription one). I really hope things get sorted soon. At least January isn't too far away now.

Well I'm currently CD15 and no hint of a peak. It's so annoying because we've been DTD loads and my cycles had seemed to be getting a bit better. I'm really worried that ovulating late in my cycle (sometimes CD22 of a 28 day cycle!) is buggering up any chances. I'll need to speak to a specialist though.

I'm a bit frustrated because my PMI insurance which I get through work (but which I have to pay the taxable benefit, which is quite a bit over month) supposedly covers me for "infertility investigations" (i.e. a consultation, bloods and scans but nothing more). Anyway, on calling them to say that I'm getting a referral to a clinic near work they tell me that the clinic isn't covered under their policy! I just don't understand how, as it's one of the best/most well-known clinics in the country. When I asked them which hospitals/clinics nearby were covered, they couldn't tell me. What a total joke!

Anyway, in other news my immediate family all know about my TTC and infertility after I had a very public breakdown at the christening on Sunday. FFS. I'm just a total mess at the moment and just CAN'T be around babies. They were all lovely and I got a really sweet email from my aunt afterwards saying how she couldn't imagine what I was going through but that she had everything crossed for me and DH and that it was brave of me to try and make it to the christening (which then made me cry even more!). URGHHH. DAMN YOU EMOTIONS.

Flatwhite, im so sorry you had a melt down although understandably! I am crying at everything these days - had a great cry last night at educating cardiff!! WTF

Can you tell me anything more about your lap&dye? I don't know a lot - a general anesthetic which I am terrified about - have never been a patient for anything before and I don't like the thoughts of being put under. I don't really care about the cutting etc its the anesthetic I am afraid of. I also have a fear of hypnotism and not coming around again :-/

Do you know how long your waiting list was for your lap&dye from you were referred. The nurse couldn't tell me (and I know everywhere will also be different).
Did you have to take time of work? I understand the gas they blow up stomach with can be painful/uncomfortable.

Regarding IVF - we could save up and have some IVF but it will be so hard to do it but worth it! it will be something that we would most definitely do. The annoying thing is I come from a really cheap part of the UK to live only I cant get a job there and only managed to get a job in a really expensive part of the UK. If I was able to get a job at home I would have much more disposable income to save!

Science - I seen that article on fb - I love seeing those stories, always gives me hope.

When I started this process I always thought I would struggle but never thought it would be this bad.

On the bright side I got a high reading today, on the very bad side dh can't even walk with a sore back - so I think this might be a wasted clomid cycle - aghh never easy in the world of trying to concieve

Of course . I had the exact same fears (ie the anaesthetic not the cutting!). Obviously I can't say you will DEFINITELY be fine as there are always risks of complications, but the risks really are so incredibly low.

I had two weeks off afterwards. TBH if I had wanted I would have been fine to go back after a few days, but emotionally I felt all over the place and needed the time to feel a bit better (not from the physical side of the surgery, but more because I had hit such a low I wanted to process everything and have the opportunity to take my foot off the gas at work). I didn't particularly get the well-reported shoulder pain, but I did feel very tired and a bit sore where they'd done a lot of rummaging around!

I seem to think my original waiting time was approx 3 months, but I managed to get seen privately (thanks to the work PMI, although I was made to feel like a criminal by the insurers in the process...) so was seen in 5 weeks.

Do they have an idea of what it may be? Eg Endometriosis?

I hear you about living in the cheapest part of the country and having to work elsewhere. Hmm... I wonder if we're in the same general area?! I have to commute for approx 4 hours a day just to get to work (although that's more due to the fact DH and I can't move from our respective jobs but such jobs are over 100 miles apart! Eek!).

Flatwhite huge hugs for the christening - I had a very similar experience at a friend's baby naming ceremony in August. I apologised to her saying I was sorry but I just needed to not be there any more, and fled as soon as the ceremony was over, so no one would see the tears I was fighting to hold back. Being extra volatile from Clomid def didn't help that day! And know how bloody draining long hours are. I work in a very long hours culture industry - healthy lifestyle goes out the window when I don't get in from work till really late and can't be arsed to have anything to eat, just want to roll into bed!

IVF is quite a minefield - no reason you should know about the ins and outs of it unless you're going through it - which hopefully you won't ever need to do!

It's even more of a kicker that where I live is one of the best trusts in London for IVF funding - most only fund 1, where I live actually funds two cycles. Unfortunately we aren't and won't ever be eligible for funding Just doing this FET on top of our fresh cycle is costing us another £4k on top of the fresh cycle! (£2500 for the FET, £500 for the drugs and £1k for the freezing charge). It's so much money and as it takes an average of 3 cycles to work, without any NHS funding, infertility is really really bloody expensive!

I'm doing OK though, thanks for asking. Just want to get the FET done so we can get this first cycle over and done with before Xmas. Obv I would love to get a BFP before Xmas but I can't dare to think it could ever work for us ever - let alone first time - so I'm just focusing on trying to get the BFN out the way so we can come back in the new year ready to start all over afresh...

Re: your oestrodial - obv I am not a doctor so I would listen to them rather than me

However can only tell you what I was told for mine. Just had a look at a couple of recent and past day 3 bloods results, for the reference ranges for day 3:

Normal range (follicular phase): 98-571 pmol/l

Mine was 87, so 'low' but consultant said at day 3 being slightly low was out of the reference range but not problematic - was if it was too high at day 2-4 that there could be issues.

Checked results from a few years ago, and the normal range was actually 46-607, so even lower was considered normal. Obv don't know what your tests are, but just to say that I was told on the low side was much better than on the high side.

I was able to get all my blood test results emailed to me (or printed out for me for a small charge). They're your results so they should be able to give you these, it's not on for them to just worry you like that and leave you hanging!

Newleaf good luck with the aligners! I had a removable invisible brace (inman aligner) that wasn't the most comfortable few months but it was so so worth it in the end. Am sure your gnashers will be stunning! [Smile]

birchygoo hope they get to the bottom of it - wishing you tonnes of luck.

science I LOVE the gifts! So so adorable. Hoping you feel better soon and that all is progressing nicely

Big hugs to you all ladies xx

Morning

I have managed to dtd on my 2 peak days which was yesterday and Tuesday. Plus once on night and today is also high so might just finish my oh off and do it tonight too. Now it's the dreaded 2ww with symptom spotting and hoping it's worked this month.

When I had my lap and dye I didn't realise he was going to do that too! I had the lap to remove the fibroid I had then whilst he was down there he decided to do the dye and flush the tubes. I had the endometriosis removed too. I am weird in that I don't mind going under a GA but what I don't like is coming round. I did get very painful shoulders and chest from being blown up and my stomach was quite tender and sore and bloated which is understandable. I drank peppermint tea which I had read could help ease the bloated feeling. I took a week off. I probably could also had gone back after a day or so but as flat said it was nice to relax at home and get my head round everything that happened. My hormones went a bit dolally after and I ended up bleeding for around a month and I had to take progesterone tablets to help my cycle regulate.

The cost of IVF scares me so much I just hope I manage to get there without. I just don't think we can afford it. We don't qualify for any free rounds as my husband has a child from a previous relationship.

Banana - I'm so sorry to hear about the baby naming ceremony. Was your friend ok with you? Does she know you're TTC?

I'm so sorry you're not eligible for funding. That's awful. There's no justice that some people get all of this for free without having to try and often don't appreciate just how lucky they are, then some people want it so badly and have to go through so much then get punished further by the extortionate costs.

I have my fingers crossed for you but really understand the need not to get your hopes up.

Badleg - I'm so sorry you don't qualify for funding. I really hope things improve for you soon.

I'm afraid I'm still all doom and gloom . Had the conference on Thursday and there were 2 pregnant women on my row. I was sat next to one who spent the whole day stroking her belly. URGHHHH. I then went out last night and got a baby bomb (thankfully the friend wasn't actually there, just mutual friends were talking about it) then I've just been for lunch with an ex-colleague who also dropped a baby bomb (not her, but this guy we worked with who hasn't been with his gf all that long). On top of that, DH chased the GP as he still hadn't had his SA results back. The receptionist basically said that there's a note on his file saying results shouldnt be posted to him as the GP wants him to come in and discuss it. I'm really struggling to stay positive right now x

Hugs for flatwhite

It's not doom and gloom forever ... Just keep that thought somewhere buried down... but thinking of you.

I am 12 dp"o" if it happened. Bfn... Of course. DH is being annoying and I am so busy and stressed I know that AF is around the corner to top it off. But this next cycle I plan on taking my clomid so at least more of a chance I guess.

Less so in that I am going for a week to America on Sunday yippeeee!

However much like you mentioned because I want a week off life and everything else is insanely busy and stressful... Husband, study, dentist, fertility, LIFE, friends, family visits, work ... It's all happening at once and I feel like everyone wants something from me yet no one is happy and I'm not doing anything particularly well. gah.....!!

How's everyone else and anyone else due to test soon?

Nice work on trying to catch that egg Badleg. The postcode lottery of IVF is so horrible. The trust where I live doesn’t have any restrictions about children from previous relationships, so it’s so unfair that you’d be eligible for funding if you lived here, but not where you are

Flatwhite it’s gutting about the funding. In fairness, the first part is quite understandable - we have to have been TTC for 2 years, and we can’t fudge that one as the GP has my prescriptions for the contraceptive pill that would indicate otherwise!

However even if we had been, there’s a cut off for FSH levels above which most trusts won’t offer funding. My FSH was 17.6 which would count me out - although it bounced down to 9.5 the following month, so I don’t know how it works when it can vary so much depending on when you have the test!

If we were to wait till we’d been trying 2 years, my FSH is likely to be through the roof, and my chances of IVF success next to non existent .

It makes me so bitter when I see skanky mums with 17 kids they’re screaming at on the bus, waddling around with a fag in their mouth and a massive baby bump - all they have to do is have a shag and they get pregnant! I try to take comfort with the thought that any child of ours will know just how very deeply wanted they were, and how much Mummy and Daddy wanted them to be a family.

My friend was wonderfully understanding about me making my excuses, thankfully, she just gave me a big hug and thanked me so much for coming. We’d actually been out for a walk in the park with the baby a couple of weeks prior, and were discussing my fertility woes, and she’d actually said how amazing she thought it was that I was able to be so happy with her and the baby, which really meant a lot. I have to say, that having decided to be very open with friends about our infertility, and that we were going through IVF, everyone has been incredibly supportive and understanding.

Newleaf have a fabulous holiday! Whereabouts are you off to in the US?

xx

NewLeaf - I know. You're so right. I just need a bit of a break from it all (TTC, work etc) but that's not going to happen anytime soon.

Oh no! I'm sorry to hear that! And I'm sorry DH is being annoying . Hope he's started behaving!

Are you going to America for work or for fun? Have an amazing time! We all need those 'weeks off life'. I can certainly relate to you feeling that everyone wants something from you but they're never happy with what you give them. I think people assume that THEIR particular thing should be YOUR priority (e.g. work will expect that you should be on call for them 24/7 because surely your priority should be progressing your career, when actually that week you may need to get home to DTD or your gran may be sick or YOU may be sick and you need to leave earlyish to stop yourself getting poorly...but they won't stop and think about this as they'll just see THEIR issue).

What the hell does your dentist want from you? Definitely don't get stressed by everything they're telling you! At the end of the day, the fact you even go to your dentist means you're doing better than 50% of the country, ha ha!

Anyway, I hope America is relaxing. Can you properly switch off and get away from your blackberry (if you have one), Facebook (because it's awful) and texts and emails and stuff?

Banana - I am so so sorry. Is there anything they can do to improve your FSH? Life really is so unfair. Just remember that however you become a mum (because you WILL become a mum) you will be the best mother ever!

I completely understand the annoyance at bad mums. This has always annoyed me, but it annoys me even more now it looks as though we can't have kids. Loads of my family members, including DH, work in jobs which mean that they come into contact with abused or neglected kids all the time. It's shocking just how common it is! My mum used to get annoyed by the parents who were neglecting their children and not feeding them/washing them etc as they "had no money" but they'd be wearing the latest Nike Air Max (back in the day when this was cool!) and have Sky TV. I too am getting very bitter when I think God (or whoever it is who decides these things!) doesn't think DH and I should have kids, but s/he/it/the Universe thinks that someone who'll spend 9 months drinking and smoking fags, not be bothered to even wash or feed their child (but still drink and smoke fags) and sometimes even smack their kids around should be a parent.

Grrrr......

Anyway, in other news, if I were to go off Facebook, how long do you think I could last? He he.

Hi Lovely Ladies!

Apologies for my absence. I've been away exploring temping, generally feeling sorry for myself and stressing about ovulation.

banana I'm loving the sound of your breaking bad style lab set up you have! Are you doing it all in your motor home parked in the desert? With the costs of this IVF you may need to set up shop with some blue meth to fund it all . I haven't ventured to buy that book just yet but gave been doing a lot of research online about temping and it appears that i have in fact ovulated, if temping is an accurate method? I'm not 100% convinced because the opk's which I thought were super reliable didn't tell me I did this month with only a third as dark line as the control?

*skanky mums with 17 kids" snort

P.s. All those who commented on the temping, the dip at ovulation is an actual thing and then after ov your temp rises higher than the earlier part of the month! Will post my chart later. It seems a fairly textbook chart. But I'm so confused why the opk's didn't confirm ov? I have be an emotional mess this weekend, I have cried at Jeremy Kyle, adverts, casualty, in fact, you name it and I've cried! What a joke! In real life if you knew me I am such a rock and never show my own emotions! Not cure what's going on? fingers crossed this is a good sign

science how are you getting on with your sickness? Is it still just as bad? When is your next scan? I just read back to hearing about your sil getting upset when you told her about your bfp. Was she upset in a good way or upset in a "I'm dealing with infertility but am doing my best to be happy for you" way?

birch you must be in your fertile window now? How has the dtd been going? Did you manage to dtd with your bad back? Hope you are managing to get plenty in! P.s. With the whole wedding thing, don't even think about it, get down to business and if you are lucky enough to get caught then I'm sure your friend will be over the moon for you and will have no problem with you being either heavily pregnant or unable to attend! Nothing is stopping me from trying any month at all! In fact all holidays which involve air travel have been herewith cancelled, after hearing rumours (totally unsubstantiated by any medical grounds) about mc after air travel has scared me massively and so dp now has to find ways of holidays here in the uk with the somewhat inclement weather until we are lucky, or perhaps later... When do you hear about this lap and dye? Will it be fairly soon after this cycle is over? Best of luck with it! I've not had one myself and didn't realise it was so invasive to mean you will need days if not weeks off work. Hope it all goes well for you when you have it. Hopefully you will be lucky this month and not need it

badleg how are you feeling about your dtd efforts? Do you think you timed it all well and managed to take advantage of the days?

newleaf have you tested again? You must be about 14 dpo now? Are you in America now it is that next week? If so, have fun

flat how are you getting on with your Xmas deadlines? I love that you have a client Xmas party! Do you go too? Sounds like it could go either way

1. Brilliant fun with loads of booze
2. Loads of stress worrying that everything is going to plan and that everyone is having s good time

Which is it? Or a combination of the 2? Did you get your peak in the end? Did you manage to dtd at the right times? Is there any other way of you finding out which hospitals they cover on your policy? It is madness that they won't tell you! I'd make a complaint or phone up again and ask to speak with the boss, then their boss then their boss until you get an answer! Ha, when I read about your teeth whitening comment before it reminded me about my need to do this! I have all of the stuff and have paid for it all, I just need to do the bloody thing. I even have the super strong serum which only needs 30 mins per day to work but you can't use it when pregnant. So because of this haven't used it. And in the week or 2 before ov I'm generally feeling pretty low or am generally just busy that I don't get chance. So my work colleague who got me the stuff (his wife is a dentist) asked me if I'm using it the other night when we were out drinking. It was very late at night (or morning) and had consumed copious amounts of booze and I told him the reason why. We haven't discussed it since even though we talk daily on the phone. He won't being it up and I'm scared to. He won't say a word to any of the powers that be so no issues there but in a way I feel better for open ending up to him. I think I mentioned him before me the couple who said that they were going to start trying a month or 2 ago. Well they aren't pregnant yet either. She came off the pill and as we were talking our other colleagues returned from fag stops/the loo etc so we ended the conversation very quickly. I feel horrible for saying that I was happy it wasn't just me who couldn't do it. But at the same time was very sad for them as even though they are only in their 2nd or 3rd month of trying I wouldn't wish this on anyone. He was only the 2nd person out of 4 who have come back with the correct response of "I'm really sorry to hear that, that's really sad" - or at least that's the right response to me! The mad thing is that out of the 4 people who know 2 X female & 2 X male, the 2 X males were the best at understanding and comforting. The women were shit! Who would have thought it? So sorry to hear your christening was so tough! Lovely to hear you gave such understanding family! How nice P.s. I hate the sound of the belly stroking woman! Has your dp received his results yet? I wouldn't worry too much, try to keep positive! It took is best part of a month to get my dp's and he passed with flying colours!

This John Legend thing is great and I hope that more celebs come out and talk about this because Pete don't understand and certainly don't know how to react. So, it was the day last week where you light a candle for lost babies at 7pm which is done all over the world, I had candles lit, and a work colleague who I heard I the grape vine had a mc had liked the group. I think half of the reason ladies who suffer this awful thing don't publicise it are probably in my position where it isn't that I'm scared to talk about it, I'm scared for my job, if my work found out I was trying I think any reason they couple possibly find to get rid of me would be sought! Perhaps I'm just very synical? Also the blame aspect is another difficult side to it which is why I haven't told my family, I can't cope with them talking behind my back about how it was my fault because I like a drink or used to love my Diet Coke or maybe don't eat my 5 a day every day. It's just horrible! So, anyway, I told a lady who is a client of mine who I am very friendly with (she has been following my story of infertility) about the mc on Wednesday. She felt she had dealt with infertility because it took her 11 months to conceive her only child (only child though choice) and so felt she inderstands what it's like, well, clearly she doesn't! If she did she would not speak like she does. So, I told her about the mc and she responded "well, I'm not being funny but at least you know that now you can get pregnant" - it's a bloody good job she is a customer and I didn't face her any sooner as if she had said that a couple of weeks ago I think I would have fled the building in tears! I know she means well and in fairness, I have made the same comment myself, "at least I know I can get pregnant" although I think for people in this position to say that kind of thing it's ok as they understand the heart ache but I think it's a bit much for her to come out with that! Little did I know that this "at least I can get pregnant" thought could be f**ked up so much by a mc!

so back to the acupuncture point! I never quite made it to calling them as was away most of that week, home last week and now away again all of this week and so it is just too bloody difficult to do. I don't even have time to eat at home let alone have an hours relaxation session!

So, I don't know if any of you watch casualty but it is one of my favourite programmes for a Sunday morning. Anyway, Dixie was refused when it came to the adoption process last week and it was replayed this week. This has me really worried because we will adopt if we can't do it ourselves and if we manage one but not a second then we will certainly adopt no 2. I'm not too precious about having my own child just that I want one (or ideally 2) in my life and from what I've witnessed with the love I have for my niece I know I could be a brilliant mum for an adopted child. I'm so worried that when this process is eventually over they will see us as such damaged goods from the turmoil of all of this shit that we may be declined!

Apologies for the massive post but been away for a while! So when is everyone testing? I will be using a frer on Friday afternoon with fmu which I will be saving in the bathroom until the evening incase spotting starts during the day as it did last month, so not to waste a frer at about £8 a pop

Flatwhite - I came off facebook for that reason - well I deleted the app from my phone so I can't constantly check it but have to log into my computer to get on. Then it makes me think more about what I am possibly going to see. I downloaded twitter and it is much better for not getting baby bombed - and I am not missing fb that much on my phone.

Vap0 - fingers crossed these emotions are a good sign! How many DPO are you now? I think temping is supposed to be accurate as progesterone is what causes your temp to rise and we don't release progesterone unless we ovulate ... that's my understanding anyway. I have to see my doctor right at the end of this cycle - so not too long a wait at all. I'm also hoping I wont have a massive wait on the lap and dye either. Although it is coming up to Winter and with working in the NHS I often see non emergency surgery's getting postponed due to the pressures on the system. I am not getting too anxious though - I do have a firm belief everything happens for a reason, so maybe I just haven't been sent a baby yet as it is not the right time for me just yet. (thats what I tell myself anyway). We dtd d11, d13 and d14. with peak reading on d14. So fingers crossed it has worked this month.

Welcome back Vap Long time no speak! Sounds like you have been busy! I am so sorry if you're having a bit of a rubbish time and feeling a bit crappy.

Good luck POAS. That made me laugh about saving your urine. Very sensible though. It's amazing how gross we get though isn't it?! If you had told me a few years ago that for half a month I would be pissing into a pot, dipping a stick in it then leaving it there while I shower and brush me teeth I would have been HORRIFIED!

The Christmas parties will be hell. I've got to organise two - the one for clients and the one for our team (there are about 20 of us in my team). The client one is going to be sht because I've been given a minuscule budget but the bosses are expecting something amazing. All they do is complain about what I've come up with, but then won't give any direction for what they actually want. Similarly, I had made plans for the team one (based upon what people said they'd like to do, then loads of people started emailing me saying "can we do X instead" or "can we do Y instead". How about you all just fcking shut up and come along and have a good night?

To be honest, I've started thinking about leaving my job... not because of the Christmas parties , but because the stress and pressure I'm under 24/7 (including the fact they still give me work when I'm on holiday/sick leave after my operation) means I am never going to get better from a mental health point of view.

I did get a peak on the clearblue dual hormone, although I never got close to a second line on the ICs. We DTD loads around that time, but I just don't hold much hope due to my egg problems, hormone problems and DH's sperm problems. We will get the results of his test in approx 2 weeks, but I don't think it will be good as there were a few problems about 3 years ago. I'm kicking myself now that we didn't start trying earlier, but at the time it would have been fatal for my career (or so I thought) and he had a second test which was slightly more normal, so we thought it was maybe just a blip.

Funny you should say about getting fired if the powers that be found out you were TTC. It's exactly the same where I am. I can think of 3 people in my team who are more senior than me (and I'm v junior) who would be happy for me. The bosses would certainly find a way to fire me, probably by making work so unbearable that I'd have to leave. In my industry, there is A LOT of that and consequently there are hardly any women at the top with children. Isn't it awful that when we're going through this living hell and need all the support and understanding we can get, we have to worry about our career and whether we'll be ostracised on top!

I'm really pleased you told someone. You'll probably feel a little bit better now that he knows. He's maybe just waiting for the right moment (i.e. a private moment) where he can bring it up with you. Or he may be waiting for you to bring it up and is worried that you're regretting telling him. I can completely understand why you're pleased they haven't conceived yet. We would never wish this on anyway, but it makes our struggle so much harder when other people get it so easily. I think I posted here a few months ago about my friend who got married in June telling everyone at the wedding she wanted a honeymoon baby. As of a month ago she still wasn't pregnant and was complaining about it. While I don't want her to suffer, I was pleased that I didn't have to suffer another "easy" BFP.

I'm really sorry your female friends were so shit. What did they say? Idiots! I'm also so sorry about what your client said. She was probably doing what 95% of people do and was trying to give you hope. I could maybe see why that would help if you'd been trying for 2-3 months then had an early miscarriage, but when it takes 2 years to get a BFP and then it's snatched away from you the last thing you will be feeling is "oh look how lucky I am, I CAN get a BFP". I hope you don't have to see her anytime soon!

So are you properly looking into adoption then? Do you know much about it? I think it's mad the hurdles people have to go through to get an adopted child, when it takes SO MUCH for children in neglected/abusive circumstances to be removed from their biological parents. If you're not that fussed about the biological connection, then this is maybe a route to seriously consider?

Flatwhite thanks so much for such lovely support, it really means a lot. Unfortunately anything I could do to bring down my FSH would just be artificial - essentially high FSH is like having to rev the engine harder and harder when the gas tank is low. My gas tank is low on eggs so my brain has to rev harder and harder, trying more and more FSH to get me to ovulate. It does bounce up and down - in Aug my FSH was a horrific 17.6 (under 10 is normal, 10-15 is diminished reserves, over 15 is really very bad news), yet in Sept it had gone down to 9.5! It didn’t mean I’d grown more eggs, but it did mean my body was more likely to respond to stimulation, which seemed to be the case when I started the FSH injections a few weeks later. It is possible to bring it down by taking oestrogen - but Drs look at the two together. So if my oestrodial was high it would show the FSH was being artificially suppressed, and together with my low AMH shows that I have severely diminished ovarian reserve. Many high FSH / low AMH women simply don’t respond to stimulation drugs at all, hence why the NHS have a cut off. And in fact several clinics have a cut off - they don’t want to take high FSH women in case we bugger their stats! Thankfully I have a consultant who says he treats patients, not numbers - and he got the protocol right, and maybe all the supplements I’ve been taking to support egg quality will have helped too.

Your comment about pissing into a pot made me laugh, as I have thought the same on many occasions! I now have a stack of plastic cups in the bathroom, so if I wake up at 5am busting for a wee, I can save my FMU for my CBFM when I get up a couple of hours later - so there’s usually a little pot of my wee on the windowsill!!! It gets even worse when it’s approaching ov time, as my surge doesn’t last very long, so for a few days around expected Ov time, I end up with a load of plastic cups in my handbag, so I can dip a cheapy OPK in the loo at work, and then throw the cup away in the sanitary bin. Madness! Similarly when it’s baby making DTD time, I have to tell DH to stay away until I give him the OK, as I don’t want him walking in while I’m shoving a Pre-Seed applicator up my foof - as if the whole baby making shagging thing wasn’t so overly planned enough!!

We do have to laugh about it all. Afterwards, DH helps me shuffle round so I can lie with my legs up the wall - even though the consultant said it doesn’t make any difference, DH said ‘in my head it does!’ as we reckon giving gravity a helping hand can’t hurt. And after seeing my Fertility Friend app, he now hands my my phone and says ‘BD!’ so I can add it to my chart, haha. Yes, this is what TTC has done to us. But you have to laugh about it all really…!

Vap love the Walter White analogy! When DH was mixing up the vials of powders and syringes it did feel quite Breaking Bad haha. And yes, I could certainly do with the cash from some blue meth, that’s for damn sure!!

Yay for ov! The temp dip is often a thing - it certainly is for me - but it doesn’t always happen for everyone, and so
a) it’s not always a great indication that you’re about to ov
b) don’t worry if you don’t have a dip!

Temping is pretty failsafe - if your temp goes up and stays up for at least 3 days, and if your chart follows a biphasic pattern, you can pinpoint when Ov happened really clearly.

As the book - and the charting tutorials on FertilityFriend.com - shows, temping isn’t any good for telling you when Ov is approaching, but it’s great for confirming if and when you did (and helping to understand the patterns of your cycles). For me, as I don’t get anything remotely approaching EWCM, the only way I can tell if I’m gearing up to ov is by the CBFM and OPKs - and then temping confirms if I did or didn’t.

Depending on how often you’re POAS with OPKs, it is possible to miss the surge. My surge lasts less than 24h so when I’m approaching O time (based on my previous cycles, as shown by my temp chart) I have to POAS a couple of times a day, so I don’t miss it.

I’m totally with you on the emotional mess. I was in a PMT meltdown - v possibly exacerbated by having been on a shitload of artificial hormones until 2 weeks ago - which is so so unlike me. I find it so unnerving to feel like I’m so totally not myself - like I’m a slave to my hormones, and even though I know I’m feeling totally irrational, I just can’t control it. F*cking hormones!!!

I’m so so sorry your colleagues have been so completely shit. I have to say, that I’ve been really open about our infertility woes, but I appreciate it’s a very personal thing. For me personally, it was for a few reasons.

Firstly, it’s stressful enough going through treatment without having to try and keep it a secret, and come up with excuses for this and that.

Secondly, I really welcome the support from friends and family - I feel very fortunate that I’ve not had a single snarky comment, and everyone has been completely brilliant. It made such a difference, for example, at my friend’s baby naming, that I could say why I was very sorry but I needed to leave after the ceremony, and that she knew why I was finding it difficult, and was completely understanding and supportive. If I hadn’t been open with her, I personally would have found it even more stressful trying to come up with an excuse and then leaving her wondering why I was bailing on her.

Thirdly, infertility and miscarriage are actually really really common, but we feel so alone and isolated because we think we’re the only ones going through it, while everyone else only has to look at their partners and they get knocked up. In talking about it with friends, I’ve discovered that actually lots of them have had loads of issues getting or staying pregnant - and we’ve all found it really cathartic to know we aren’t alone in having problems. One friend has a 3 y.o daughter, but it turned out that she’d had months of Clomid, ovarian drilling, and had just been referred for IVF when she fell pregnant. She revealed they’re having to go down the IVF route for a sibling, and that she’d had a miscarriage just the previous week. Another friend, a former colleague, has a 3 y.o. boy, and turns out she has had 4 miscarriages, including 3 in the last 11 months. I only saw their happy children, and had no idea of the pain they had been through. Similarly, another friend and former colleague, has a 2 y.o daughter, and it turns out she was conceived via IVF. And a boss at work had Clomid for both her sons. So I’ve become a bit militant about being open, as I feel that if I can talk about it and show it’s nothing to be ashamed of, that it might help someone else in a similar situation. Bit like how we’ve found John Legend (and Tyra Banks, and Harry from McFly) being open about their troubles conceiving. Mark Zuckerberg from FB, when he announced that he and his wife were expecting a baby, prefaced it by saying that they had experienced 3 miscarriages, and so ‘came out’ about their issues - i.e. it hadn’t been a walk in the park for them, as it may have first appeared.

I also have found that those who haven’t struggled with infertility are genuinely very interested to understand more, as they freely admit they have no idea what’s involved in Clomid, or IVF, or actually how common miscarriage is - and they’re pretty amazed when I explain some of it. So for me personally, if I can educate others, then maybe they won’t accidentally come out with crass comments born out of ignorance about infertility, rather than necessarily malice - if that makes sense?

I’d also say that work wise, any attempts to discriminate for anything at all to do with pregnancy related issues would be grounds for constructive dismissal, and whilst bosses may not be very understanding about these issues (possibly because they don’t understand, as above, possibly because they’re arseholes), any boss worth their salt won’t expose themselves to a tribunal.

I may be very very lucky that I’ve not had a single crass comment from anyone at all about TTC or infertility, but I do wonder if the fact I’ve been very open about it has helped. It’s a completely personal decision and there’s no right or wrong answer. And next time around (assuming this cycle fails and we have to do another one) I may feel very differently about telling people we’re going through IVF! But for now, I feel a massive relief that I don’t have to worry about keeping it secret, on top of worrying about everything to do with TTC.

birchy hope your back is feeling better! I have chronic back pain from a spinal injury (broke my back when I was younger) so I know how completely rubbish it can make you feel. Big hugs.

I too have had to limit my FB access - the new baby announcements of about one a week were just too much.

AFM, my post IVF AF arrived, and so I’m just really hoping that my cycle isn’t too messed up so we’re not waiting forever for my next AF to arrive, so we can start our FET cycle. Obv I would love a surprise BFP - I’ve been taking shitloads of supplements for egg quality, but as lining is my issue, I’m not optimistic. The high dose vitamin E, the acupuncture, none of that made any bloody difference

It’s actually ridiculous that I’m even contemplating doing a very bad thing. After my egg collection, if we hadn’t had the issue with DH’s sample on the day, the consultant was going to see if taking oestrogen pills would help to build up my lining between then and a potential transfer. I have the pills here, and I’m contemplating doing the very very bad thing of trying to self medicate, and take the pills for 5 days after ov as I would have done in the IVF cycle, in case it helps to boost my lining. I know I really really shouldn’t self medicate, but you guys can understand, I’m sure, how desperate I am - and so the desperate voice in my head says ’it was prescribed for you to take after collection (i.e. ovulation day) and the Dr prescribed them to you for a reason, and what harm can it do?’. The fact is it there’s very little harm it could do, and is likely only to help, but that’s no reason to self medicate - yet this is what my desperate ‘what if this could be your month, and the only reason you can’t conceive naturally is because of your crappy lining’ voice is telling me! The TTC crazies have officially set in

Phew! Sorry about epic mammoth post. Big love to you all xx

Morning Banana (and everyone else!)

No problem at all. We all know how utterly horrible this TTC business is. I really do hope there is a happy ending for you (well, for all of us!).

Ha ha - I'm exactly the same re: POAS. I've got a small tupperware which I keep in my handbag around ovulation containing ICs and one of those small plastic shot glasses. I also go to the work loo and then bin them in the bin/sanitary bin. I am just as gross as you.

I quite like temping as, by the time you've had 3 consecutive higher temperatures, you know ovulation has happened and you can relax on the obsessive BD front.

I think it's great that you've been so open with your colleagues and that they've been good about it. They should be! It must be great to have that sort of support and have one less thing to worry about. Theoretically I completely agree that we should be open and honest about our struggles. When this is all over, for better or worse, I'll probably be a bit more open. Unfortunately my bosses and organisation I work for are very clued up on employment law. They would be smart enough to do the bad stuff (which would be to find a way to make it unbearable to come to work; they're too smart to start off fire me) but they would never do or say anything publicly, or send any incriminating emails, so I would never be able to prove anything. They would also easily twist everything, so instead of talking about the good things I have done at work or where my talents lie, they would bring up the time I cried hysterically at work (although not mention that this was after 8 weeks of working 8am - 2am, including weekends) or say that I'm too 'soft' to do the job, because I'm quieter and more reserved than the rest of them. I have heard of women being made to leave jobs like mine when they have children and being paid off (poorly) and being told that as part of the settlement they need to give a statement saying they "couldn't cope with the job once they had kids". HORRIFIC. At the start of this TTC hell I worried about what I'd do, as I would not be allowed to work part time (certainly not on a vaguely permanent basis) and DH and my parents work insane hours. I'd been really worried about how I'd afford childcare so that I could keep me job and not lose my career. Now I would give anything to be put in that difficult situation .

As for the pills, please be very careful (you knew aunty Flat would tell you that!). I TOTALLY understand why you're thinking about it - I would be! TTC makes you do crazy things though. Are you sure it won't be harmful? What if you need to take more in a few weeks/months? What if your doctor tells you to take them at a later stage and assumes you kept the original tablets s/he gave you? Could you call the doctor now and ask him/her whether you can take them? Just be careful x

Morning all
birch how are you getting on? Any more baby bombs? Sounds like a good idea deleting the app but I don't think I could cope...
Tidy is 7dpo, any symptoms I may have thought I could feel have long gone and I'm just sat waiting for Friday at 10dpo to test, I have ordered frer from Amazon and hope they arrive in time. If not I'll get to boots. It will be positive at 10dpo if I am pregnant and if not then makes me feel better about drinking. We off next week
Sorry to hear you may not get your procedure over the winter due to strain on the nhs, how crap! What day are you testing?

flat my work would be the same as yours! They wouldn't fire you for being pregnant or even trying but they would as you say pick holes in everything I do until they had enough of a case to get rid of me. They wouldn't leave themselves open for any come back and I would have no proof. Just the way it is. My female colleagues 1. "Oh well, it was early" 2. "Well at least you know you can get pregnant"
These may well be things you would think about a person in this position but why the hell would you say it? Argh! So the 1st one keeps asking me how I'm getting on, just through noseyness than actually giving a shit and I told her straight I didn't want to talk about it anymore. Luckily she hasn't brought it up in a couple of weeks.
Adoption is something I would have a long hard think about depending on the January appointment outcome. I mentioned it to dp and he wasn't liking the idea very much. It was the 1st time I've mentioned it to him and as with everything I'm sure I could get him to come around eventually. Of course my own child/children would be my 1st choice but if all of this fails I wouldn't want to be childless.

banana is be all over those pills if I was you. Probably shouldn't say that and as flat says perhaps phone the dr's and ask them if it's ok. I wouldn't be surprised if they said yes if you word it carefully. If I had access to clomid that had been prescribed to me previously j could have taken it this month. As I mentioned I am thinking of going privately to get a prescription. Basically privately they will just say yes unless they have any good reason to say no and they don't use the reason of saving money to say no which is what my nhs dr's are doing.

I'm looking at things now that by the time af comes we will be near enough in November. Still need to get this jan appointment actually booked. Even though 3 months any other time of year seems like a lifetime over Xmas for some reason it doesn't. It just seems to fly by. Or so Ill keep telling myself I'm the hope I'll believe it. I was just reading through a post about people ttc after mc, I read all 6 pages of it hoping they were all pregnant already as a lot of them had mc on the same day or very close to me. Out of maybe 15 ladies only 1 is pregnant again. Bad times. I was hoping for good news reading that.

Wishing the week away and just can't wait for Friday to test!

When is everyone else testing?

Omg so many lovely baby/family/child pictures on FB this evening!

Will send a proper reply as soon as I can, but for now:

STEP AWAY FROM FACEBOOK. IT IS EVIL!!!!

Flat love that you also have the tupperware and shot glass! once upon a time those would have been for something more exciting - now they literally take the piss!! And yes, am with you on the temping. I would have no idea when AF was due if I didn’t know when I had ovulated (if indeed at all).

It’s so shitty that bosses and workplaces make it so difficult for anyone to lead any kind of normal life. I work in a very long hours culture, and it’s basically the case that there are very few senior women. When it’s (frequently) late nights in the office it’s usually the case that anyone senior who’s around is a bloke, with a wife or partner at home with the kids - and anyone else is childless. The MD at my old agency was a Mum of two, but her husband was in an equally senior role, and they were always having heated telephone calls about who needed to go home to relieve the nanny. I ended up going freelance primarily because I have a number of health issues and the workload was getting unsustainable, and it allows me to flex between full time and part time projects, but I genuinely don’t see how my industry can expect to address the gender gap when our culture is so ridiculously family unfriendly.

Aunty flat I absolutely did expect you to say that, and that’s why I mentioned it, so you ladies could give me a (nicely worded) bollocking and talk some sense into me - and I thank you sincerely for humouring my TTC crazy flip out.

The fact that I’m reluctant to call the Dr’s secretary (because I know he’ll think I’m absolutely loony, and tell me not to bugger around, we don’t know if I need it, and leave it be for this resting cycle) tells me all I really need to know about why it’s obviously not a sensible idea

But we’re not always sensible people when TTC madness sets in…!

I think I’m still reeling from the rollercoaster of getting my horrific FSH and AMH (and the lining issues being a kick in the teeth). Given my fertility has plummeted so drastically in just 5 years (and there isn’t much further to fall), it feels like every egg is precious and could be my last.

When we thought I was still PCOS we thought the issue was trying to get me to ovulate. And that if we could sort that, I’d have as good a chance of conceiving as anyone else! And that at 33 I still had time. It was utterly devastating to discover how low the stocks are running - and I don’t know when the shop will close for business. The fact it’s my birthday next week is making everything feel so stark. I’m nearly 34 but my ovaries think I’m 44.

But as long as I am ovulating, in theory there could be as much chance as anyone else my age. So it feels like the lining is stopping me from even having a chance of a natural BFP.

Realistically, he’s unlikely to remember exactly how many tablets he prescribed, as it was done so quickly on-site @ the clinic and issued by the clinic’s pharmacy, so he may not even have the exact details on file at his office (as he only uses the clinic as a satellite for EC & ET) If I were to take the Progynova (oestrogen tablets) before ovulation, it could interfere with ovulation, but after ovulation there’s a small window when it can help build the lining before any potential implantation could take place. Thereafter it’s unlikely to do any harm, but isn’t likely to have much incremental benefit, so I wouldn’t take it beyond the window he’d suggested in my IVF cycle.

I realise I’m being batty, and I thank you ladies for talking sense. And I thank you vap for also getting totally the crazy place this thinking comes from. Whereas Clomid un-monitored could lead to multiple follicles, and the risk of multiples, there isn’t really any equivalent kind of risk for taking luteal Progynova. That’s not to say I wouldn’t be thinking exactly the same as you in the situation you describe.

Desperation sure as hell sets in, doesn’t it?

vap I really hope you get the Clomid and some useful advice and support when you get your appointment. I can only imagine how disheartening that thread may feel, but it hasn’t been very long, and in fact many people are told by their Drs to leave it a couple of cycles before trying again, so that being the case, it’s not too surprising there haven’t necessarily been (m)any pregnancies. Doesn’t mean there won’t be - or that you won’t be one of them!

Excited for you to test! Honestly, I haven’t ever actually ever POAS to test yet. Well, not properly. After my Clomid trigger shot, I tried an IC strip to test out what a BFP might look like, sort of as a practice run - so I’d know what I should be looking for! Haven’t ever actually tested otherwise, which means the first time I test will probably be after my IVF transfer (if we get that far) - as the progesterone pessaries can keep AF away, so you’re given an official test date. Not sure if they will ask me to come in for a blood test, or if I just POAS at home and only come in if it’s a +ve. So maybe I should just do it this month, just so I can get used to seeing a -ve on a proper FRER or something. Practice run for a BFN I guess!

Hope you ladies are all well, big hugs to newleaf, science, birchy and badleg

xx

Hello everyone. Happy weds hump day the weekend is back in sight! Hope your all coping ok as it Seems like the roller coaster of TTC is hitting us all quite hard.

Facebook is a mare. The baby bomb was dropped recently by a friend. It took her longer than her life plan to get pregnant but was pregnant before her first anniversary lucky thing. We now get regular updates on the size of it in comparison to vegetables we have had beetroot and avocado so far. Then random posts that only pregnant people care about and Pinterest posts about nurseries and breastfeeding clothes. Argh.

So I am on day 23 of my cycle having ovulated according to my cbfm on day 15 and my last cycle was only 26 days. I feel I could test now???? But don't want to as not sure I can cope with the news that might come with it but another part just wants to know. I constantly symptom spot and it gets a bit tiring! Boob check, spots, had a bit of heartburn yesterday all coincidental I am sure!

That's where I am at. Really trying to hold off testing until Friday morning.

vap just realised Friday is also your testing date. Eeeeeek

It would be nice if everyone of us got there without too much more crap thrown at us. I think I have 1 or 2 months left of clomid I will then take a break till new year and decide what route to go next.

Hey all,

so I was baby bombed twice yesterday - opened fb and first post was dh friend with his new baby - I have to say I didnt even know that his wife was pregnant (we live out of country and he is not a close close friend) so at least I havent had the posts the whole way through the pregnancy. Then my work colleague announced that she had her baby a few days ago. But I am so so happy for her. Just disheartning as I feel that should be me as well, we started trying at the same time.

FB is evil!

Good luck to those testing on Friday - I am due to test next weekend. Not looking forward to it. Friend I am bridemsaid for txt me thismorning asing how it is all going and she hasnt mentioned about having a potential baby the month of her wedding. We are ordering our bridesmaid dresses in December though - so I dont know what to do! Aghh, would be so much easier if I knew I was pregnant at that stage

Omg
Totally unexpected baby bomb this evening!
From a friend who wasn't trying and was just caught out!
4th child!
Had a total meltdown with lots of tears and snot
So I'm in a hotel tonight and there is a boots pharmacy over the road so I'm going to buy a frer in the morning and poas and then I'm going to have a bloody good go at drowning my sorrows tomorrow when I finally go home for the 1st time since Monday morning
Bad times here!
Please can we have another bfp to lift spirits again!!! Anyone???

I promise I will send a proper reply, but for now, I am so so sorry Vap (and others who have been bombed). How utterly shit. Her 4th? Just fuck off. Are you feeling any better now?

If it's any consolation, I'm also in a hotel (but a shit run down budget hotel where the TV doesn't work and there are drunk guests running up and down the corridor) and have also just had the mother of all meltdowns thanks to infertility and insomnia. I also have to give a presentation (which I hate at the best of times) in just under 6 hours. FML.