Infertility meltdown

[HappyAmbler]

Hello ladies

I'm a long time lurker and very occasional poster.

This is really just a rant as I'm feeling so utterly shit this evening - hence the title (was crying when I started writing this ). My DH is asleep upstairs as he has to work tomorrow.

This is my third cycle of clomid and AF has just arrived. We have been ttc #1 for 19 months although in that time I've had 22 cycles.

I'm just feeling totally lost as I was only prescribed three months of clomid, and my next appointment at the NHS fertility clinic isn't until mid Feb - so I'm basically going to have two wasted cycles in between.

We still don't really know what the problem is. DH and I are both 31, his SA was normal, my blood tests and ultrasound were normal, my cycles are pretty regular and I'm fairly certain I ovulate every month (temp rise). The only possible factor is my post ovulation (day 21) progesterone levels are 'borderline'. i.e. they indicate ovulation has occurred but not high enough to sustain pregnancy.

I really thought the clomid would 'fix' this seemingly minor problem. And it has in the sense that my post ovulation progesterone levels have been higher, and my luteal phase has been longer, but I'm still not bloody well up the duff

Apparently the next step is HSG - feeling stupid for not insisting this was done before I started the clomid, but I was so convinced the clomid would work...

I guess I'm just starting to panic now. If we don't know what the problem is, how the hell can it be fixed??

Thanks very much if you've got this far. I'm not sure why I'm posting, just needed to get this off my chest I guess. I don't know anyone in RL who's going through this, so it's just helpful to know there are others out there.

Shell Hello again. We are not closer unfortunately. We had to postpone as I lost my job unexpectedly before Christmas then DH got transferred to the middle of nowhere. We have found out that another cheap clinic is opening in Bundaberg (five hours drive) and there is a super cheap 100% bulk bill clinic in Brisbane. I'm going to investigate them both. DHhas applied for his long service to be paid out too. He wrote a long emotional letter and included copies of the receipts for all the treatment so far. It was approved today!!!
Hopefully yours is paid out and the next cycle works out. The miscarriage thing sounds like it could have been a true thing.

DIY IUI? I have the worlds tiniest cervix. Pap smears hurt like buggery. Hmm maybe I'll leave that to you brave ones.

Hi Ruby the unexplained thing is frustrating. It would be nice to have something to blame this all on.

Vic Hi to you too. I too know the trials of the holiday hooked with a pregnancy in mind. When I didn't end up pregnant I just got drunk a lot.

I hope you find a good clinic soon Grin - 5 hours is a long drive on a regular basis but if they're good and look after you then that's the main thing!

EC went well today, they collected 22, won't know till tomorrow though how many of them were mature and then fertilised. I have to return on Friday morning for a scan (as I'm at higher risk of OHSS) and then hopefully egg transfer at the weekend. I'm a bit 'ouchy' still so off back to bed for a nap!

Goodness that's a lot of eggs ruby! Fingers crossed you get some good ones out of that lot. Hope you feel better soon x

I am so happy for you Gin that your hubby's long service leave was approved. So is that enough to cover one cycle? Do you know the reason why you produced just two eggs last cycle? Did your day 2 scan show not many follicles to begin with or do you think it was the clinics protocol? I went to a cheap clinic for my first few cycles and now that I decided it might cost less to have a successful cycle at a more expensive clinic, I can really see the difference. The first cycle I got one measly egg. My last IVF cycle I had several mature follicles. What a difference (although lots was due to my research too). The cheaper clinic didn't even have the good quality embryo growing medium and that is why they did a day two transfer as opposed to my current clinic which can grow them to day 5. Just wanted to give you a heads up, but I totally get money being a factor.

Ruby, 22 eggs!!!! Certainly no fertility problems on your end!!!! I still can't believe it. You sound pretty calm, cool and collected about the whole thing. Can't wait for your next update.

I agree with you about the cheap clinic, Shell! All the staff at our clinic are lovely BUT if I was paying for it, I wouldn't be entirely happy - they're not exactly great on the admin side. We paid for the Embryoscope yesterday before we left the clinic (£400!!) and the bookings team told us fine, all done, nothing more to worry about. Later we had a call from the embryologist saying had we decided whether to go ahead with it or not?! FFS….. I would hope that a more expensive clinic would be super duper on the admin and facilities side, after all, you're paying over the odds for it.

From our 22 little eggs, 17 were mature enough to use, and 13 have fertilised embryo transfer will probably be on day 5 (Sunday) to give them chance to work out the best ones, but if a couple are head and shoulders (so to speak!) ahead by Friday, they'll transfer them then. We're back in the clinic Friday morning anyway to check I haven't developed OHSS - which they were a bit worried about as I had so many eggs - but thankfully no symptoms so far. I've asked for Friday off as I can see that sod's law, we'll have the scan and get home, then have a phone call asking us to return for the transfer…..!

Any news from you Victoria? x

We went with the expensive clinic the first time. I had six follicles on the scan but only two eggs were collected. Neither fertilised.
We can go a couple of rounds with the cheap clinic for East the expensive clinic cost. As there are no medical issues for my infertility we might as well go the cheap one.

Oh dear grin, only 2 eggs? Do they know why such low numbers? Do you think it can be improved by different drug doses?

I've been keeping quiet ruby because I have absolutely nothing to contribute at the moment. Just finished the dtd week and I to the 2ww of what will probably be another failed natural cycle. Dtd this month has been forced and crap, even more so than usual. He just seems so reluctant and it just feels like I practically rape him. His hand doesn't move from the same part of my body as I try to press mine against his and force his lips into a kiss. And he audibly sighs as he heaves his body on top of mine. Luckily he never lasts long and its over in minutes and he can get to sleep, which is all he ever wants to do. Last Friday I knew we needed to dtd but I was going out for a leaving meal and would be back late, so I decided to seduce him before I went! Clambered on top of him and tried to be seductive, tugging at his shirt, his belt etc and he just lay there. Ended up just stripping his lower half and bouncing on him with barely a response back. Hate going on top coz of the gravity aspect but no choice this time as he wasn't budgeing. Sigh. Why can't I just get preg and never have to have sex with this man again! Sorry, tmi maybe? Just feel so down.

I've said before maybe there is a correlation between his poor sperm and not getting horny? As if his body is thinking there is no point to sex if I can't use it to reproduce. But he is a completely lazy git who will get out of doing anything that resembles exercise. I'm also worried about the length of his penis, that maybe its too short to reach high enough to my cervix. Is that possible too? Hence the looking into possibly AI.

Enough of my ranting. Looking forward to following your embies ruby. Hope you don't develop OHSS. One of my clinic forum buddies had 23 eggs collected yesterday and was told that she was high risk and her embies had to be frozen for later use. She was egg sharing and got to keep 11, and the recipient 12 (no fair, I thought she would get the odd). She was gutted as she's worried frozen ones wouldn't survive the thaw and it all be a waste of money and time.

Egg sharing? Never heard of that.

I have no idea why the count was so low. My AMH is a bit low but nothing scary.

Maybe its just a UK thing? Its available to the under 35's after plenty of counselling! You only pay a fraction of the cost of ivf, I think my friend paid £750 instead of £3,500. But then you have to give up half your eggs to another couple and you get to know if they got preg from your eggs. Not for me thanks very much. I couldn't bear the thought of it. I think you must be either very strong or very desperate. The ethics are mind boggling...

Had a conversation with a friend the other day about donors. Dh didn't want to use donor sperm as the baby wouldn't be his and wouldn't look like him. My friend said 'has he got a brother'! Well yes he has. A single brother. Imagine how weird that would be knowing that family secret if we asked him for a sample! But a friend of a friend had a baby from her sister's eggs. Same thing. But knowing your niece/nephew was really your son/daughter... And you you ever tell that child where it came from?! Oh its so messed up!

Grin, were all six follicles mature size?

I had that same issue with my IVF 7. I had several mature follicles yet they only got 1 mature egg. The problem was that I injected the trigger on an angle and ended with a hard lump and the medication didn't get into my system. If the eggs are still immature, they remain stuck to the follicle wall and do not come free when aspirated. Did you have trigger injection issues? If not, perhaps a different trigger next time would suit your body more.

victoria, we don't have the egg sharing here in Aus but I have heard of you guys doing it. I bet that even though they only charge the patient a fraction of the cost, the clinic then stands to make a good profit from the desperate couple that the eggs are being sold to!! Very ethical.

You are more than entitle to complain on here victoria. Makes me feel not so alone with our effort of sex being alongside yours. My husband laziness is also parallel. Last time I asked him to come for a walk, I got the response 'are you trying to f...ing punish me!'

Ruby, 13 little version of you growing in a lab! It just feels certain that there has to be AT LEAST one winner in there and a BFP is inevitable!

We didn't get offered the egg sharing either, although they did mention it at the private clinics I visited - not sure if we haven't been asked about it because we're NHS or because of my age (37). The private clinics did say it brought down the cost of IVF a lot for the people who donated and also the people using a donor egg - but I didn't get any costs so can't confirm that either way!

Ah Victoria, we've all been there, thinking we SHOULD DTD even when we don't want to/ feel like it….. before OH's diagnosis of rubbish swimmers I was really convinced that if we just managed it at that magic moment, everything would happen. Pah! Why is your OH so reluctant? Feel free to give us TMI, that's the point of anonymous internet forums, you can say what you might not want to to friends in RL…..

Another scan and blood test this morning for us; scan looked fine, waiting on the blood test results now to confirm we can go ahead with ET on Sunday. The embyrologists said they'd call before 10am this morning if they wanted to do ET today and no call, so it's looking like day 5 (Sunday) for us. No update yet on how many of the 13 are still looking good - OH offered his mum a photo of the future grandchildren (as apparently we get one at ET time) but I did point out they wouldn't be exactly photogenic at this stage!!

OH has taken the day off work, not to spend some quality time with me, but to watch Breaking Bad - he's addicted! He's parked on the sofa now we're back from the hospital, although he tells me that later we're going window shopping. That's shopping for actual windows unfortunately, not having a nice walk down the high street looking at pretty things…..

Blood tests all ok, we are on for ET Sunday

I honestly can't remember exactly. I think they were all mature. I had no injection or medication issues either. I'm just special I think.
I'll see what happens next time round.

Yay Ruby

Victoria I'd be happy to do egg sharing but couldn't have treatment at the same time as the recipient. I'd feel jealous of the person if their cycle worked and mine failed.

Now I'd be quite happy to never dtd again. No libido whatsoever.

You seem very relaxed about the whole thing Grin. You haven't obsessively remembered the details from your last IVF and are happy to 'see what happens' next round. I have every detail from each of my IVF's written down, and I was always researching after my first couple of failed IVF's to work on improving my outcome. Or perhaps rather than you being relaxed, I am just too obsessed!

Ditto for you Ruby. I got an update every day with my embryo's progress. When they didn't call me, I called them. I only had 2 last IVF and 1 embryo the day before. So I guess you can be a bit more relaxed with a lot more to play with. Will keep checking for updates!

I internalise everything so I'll probably have a breakdown soon . Plus this has been the worst two years of my life and I know there is nothing I can do about the infertility so I'm just not stressing anymore.

I'm sorry to hear that the last two years have been the worst. You are right that this infertility is out of our hands and stressing isn't going to help - doesn't stop me doing it from time to time though! I hope you find a clinic you like and now that you hand the LSL pay out, you can get the ball rolling and have some hope for the future.

Grin, I have asked for my LSL payout and was told I will get a response by Wednesday. I then went online to try to find information to back up my case as show that this is a legal thing - only to find every website telling me this is illegal. Did you have any research showing it is legal and that this can be done that I can show to my employer, or did you just get lucky that your hubby's company didn't know this was illegal and paid it out for you?

What is illegal? The payout? DH is a public servant so he got a response pretty quickly considering the election and government caretaker mode.
He filled in a form, wrote a letter and submitted it.

Yeah, apparently it's illegal to get my long service leave cashed out to me - I have to actually take leave or quit my job.

Hi everyone - just back from the hospital and having a bit of a rest. ET went well, we have two hopefully growing now would you believe that after having 13 fertilise, we only had 1 at blastocyst stage 4 and 1 at stage 1! (Our hospital grades from 6 best to 1 just developed, by the way).

Anyhow, we opted to have them both put back in - I'm 37 which is right on their borderline - they did make us aware of the risks with twins, I guess I just couldn't leave one on its own

They'll phone me tomorrow to let me know how many of the others have (finally!) made it to blastocyst stage and therefore are suitable for freezing.

Till then, I have to finish my antibiotics tomorrow, keep going with the estradiol tablets (fine) and keep going with the progesterone injections (OUCH) - test date is the 19th!!

Wooooo go ruby with your 2 embies on board! Hope to 2ww goes nice and fast for you :-) I'm in my 'natural' 2ww, due on Feb 18th so I'm counting down with you x

Thanks Victoria we've been out for lunch, been for a little walk round a garden centre and I'm now having the enforced bed rest known as the lodger's daughter being over and monopolising the living room. Sigh...

Ruby, congratulations on getting that far. I've followed lots of IVF journeys on here as I've been through my own, and not many women make it to where you are to have 2 blasts on day 5 available for transfer.

Can I ask, have you been given antibiotics for a particular reason or does your clinic make you take them as part of their standard IVF protocol?

Also, I've never taken estradiol tablets during the luteal phase of my IVF cycle before. I've read some studies on it and asked my Dr about it for my upcoming IVF but she is not familiar with it and just said she's happy for me to try it if it's something I want to do. So can I ask you;
What dose do you take?

When did you start them?

As I need to learn about this before I have to decide for my own IVF cycle.

Thanks Shell, that's really helpful I wasn't sure whether that was a good success rate, given that we started out with 22! The hospital phoned today and we have 3 which are suitable for freezing, which is good news.

The antibiotics are standard (for my hospital) after EC, it's a week's course to reduce the risk of infection, or so they tell me - I finish those tomorrow.

I started the estradiol straight after EC as well, I take 2mg twice a day. Again these are standard for my hospital - well, they're on all the literature and not as a 'you may be taking these' but as a 'you will be taking them'. I would say they're worth a try for you, assuming they're not incredibly expensive? As I understand it, those and the progesterone injections are to mimic what your body would be producing anyway if it was a 'normal' pregnancy.

Had a really horrible, stressful evening; all I wanted to was wash my hair, cook some dinner, potter round for a bit and have an early night, as I have an early start tomorrow. Ended up in tears at OH's work as the bloody builders were here till 8.30pm, they were so noisy and disruptive I couldn't stand to be in the same house. I've told OH we are NOT using his friend for any more work - why would he think it's acceptable to work late into the evening at people's homes without any warning?!? I am so fed up and feel like I've let my 'kids' down already

Oh Rubes, you haven't let your kids down. You're just setting the standard and letting your kids know from the start that Mum's the boss around here and not Dad! Try to take a deep breath and don't be so tough on yourself because now you're getting yourself upset about having been upset. You've been through so much and you're totally allowed to be on edge right now. And 5 blastocysts is absolutely amazing. I am totally jealous!

As for the estradiol, my understanding is that our follicles produce this as they are maturing and hence this happens in the first part of the cycle. Once the follicle ruptures, it produces progesterone and of all the IVF cycles I have watched on Mumsnet, other women only take progesterone post transfer to mimic what your body would be producing in a normal cycle. So it doesn't seem to be what our body naturally produces at this stage, but that being said, I have read some studies showing taking it post EC significantly improves preg rate.

It's stressful for me that my doctor left it to me to decide for myself. I wish she had of given me a convincing argument one way or the other. If you get a positive outcome, then maybe that will help me decide to give it a try.