Drug addicts paid to be sterilised

[MarthaQuest]

In today's Guardian

I thought I was left wing, but I found myself agreeing with most of this article.

What do you all think?

it's ok I'm just enjoying feeling hard done by!

As a foster mum to a 3 month old born addicted to heroin, methadone and diazapam (sp) there is a part of me that thinks this tiny scrap wouldn't have spent her first 11 days of life in a high dependency unit being tube fed and given morphine to dull the pain of withdrawal.

There is a part of me that has spent the next 6 weeks dripping morphine into her at every feed knowing that this lethal drug will barely scratch the surface of the pain she is constantly in.

Then there is a part of me that sees how well her mum is doing now, she appears to be off heroin and is on a methadone programme and obviously loves her baby with all her heart, and hopes she can keep her act together for the sake of her baby.

I can see this from both arguments but my leanings are if it saves one more baby from the agony pay them double!

Haven't read the whole thread, or thought very carefully, but my first thought is that a drug addict is non compos mentis so can't give informed consent to be sterilized. I would not want the NHS to be paying for sterilizations in these cases (where it is being done in exchange for payment from this or another org). I am fine with the long-term birth control though.

The idea makes me uncomfortable too, but regarding the "informed consent" point that a few posters have brought up - adult drug users are not, in general, deemed to be incapable of making decisions regarding their own health/welfare, and must give consent to any treatment, including drug treatment. I dont think they can be deemed incapable of making decisions regarding contraception or even sterilisation whilst being "capable" in other areas.

I'm not talking about just this organisation withorwithout, but the general feelings that it could dispense into society. If we become used to this being OK then how long until it moves into the other areas? How long until women aren't allowed to do x,y,z and are punished for it? It just doesn't seem right at all.

Good point.

of course they can unavailable. They are being offered money to make the decision which makes it a no brainer from their point of view. It would be lovely if they chose to take responsibility for their contraception. But obviously that doesn't happen, so we bribe them with money for their next fix.

unavailable - yes they can give their consent but is their constent valid if it has been influenced by a monatory reward?

Would the doctor performing the operation still perform it if he knew this?

It's my impression that people wishing to be sterlised have to give valid reasons to have the operation on the NHS.

Exactly belgo. I's actually pretty difficult to be sterilised on the NHS believe it or not, there are age restrictions, and I know one woman who was single at the time but had to take her brother with her to an appointment to pose as her partner to show he was giving his consent

I think it's a good idea. Having worked in a maternity unit where we have the same woman returning, a couple of months after having one baby, pregnant with another.
The baby's are born addicted/ with FAS and taken straight into care, or worse they get to stay in a home where they are at risk of abuse/neglect.

It's not cynical, it's realistic. The only thing I would change is not offering an option of permanent sterilisation, but a long term one.

The problem with drugs is that people are only afraid of the the consequences until they take them. Generally they take drugs and have pretty good time on them.

Most people can take it or leave it but some develop into a full blown addiction which then rules their life and prevents them caring about anything else.

What we need to do is use the threat of sterilization as a sanction. A live birth from an accidental conception by a drug addict is just about the worse possible scenario a society can have. Financially and socially. It would be better for everybody if drug addicts dont have children.

Riven, why should the country find yet more money for peoples stupid, irresponsible behaviour? How exactly can money stop people getting addicted to drugs?

Oh come on Riven
The help is there if they want it
There are millions of pounds spent on rehab programmes
It's not as simplistic as that

It isn't money they get though is it. It is £200 worth of what they are desperately addicted to.

Winny like for like, and in pure form, heroine is actually MUCH better for you than nicotine.

It is also less addictive

Belgo, I was thinking of the capacity to consent issue in a legal rather than moral sense.

It's impossible to seperate these issues from morality and ethics, the doctors after all will not only be following the law but their own ethical standards.

They are not incredibly hard to access, that simply isn't true.
They are offered help in prison, from GP or needle exchanges, through churches etc
There is not a drug addict who wishes to break their addiction who won't find a place to go for help

Riven, why should the country find yet more money for peoples stupid, irresponsible behaviour? How exactly can money stop people getting addicted to drugs?Aloiseq Why? Because very often it was 'the country' that made them behave irresponsibly.

People with aspirations and hope, and a good education are much much less likely to become addicted to drugs.

Haven;t read the whole thread but there was a huge thread about this recently I will try to find it.

I also saw in the news the other day that some people had been arrested in teh UK for approaching women and offering them sterilisation. They were randomly approaching women, one was interviewed and was really pissed off as she was just out with her kids and they said all this stuff in front of them.

Will try to find that too.

Not all addicts come from shit homes. How many public schoolboys get kicked put of their schools for drug use every week? Actually I don't know the answer to that, however drug use/abuse/addiction is not confined to abusive or negligent homes.

recent thread

there are links to the womans website on there as well