Faith schools should say homosexuality is normal..

[daftpunk]

Why can't people just leave us alone

DP: Have seen many of your threads before but none worth me giving it five minutes of my time that I would never get back.

However, feeling slightly more giving today so....

Firstly, I very much doubt your own claims to faith. As is commonly known: most catholics eventually rebel against the teachings, as adults they continue to display a catholic guilt complex (certainly not in your case), those that do return to the church as adults tend to do so in the hope that it will be much more relaxed and accepting than they remember it (often actually is found to be relaxed compared with 25yrs ago and they stay for the social "family" feel).

Also, 25 yrs ago, women were not allowed to stand on the alter unless they were either a nun or there to clean. (I was allowed to clean). Now there are actually girls allowed as alter servers.

And: I doubt very much that you really are homophobic, otherwise pity your children if they have a mother that only has love for them on condition that they stay within the confines of her own narrow view point. Unconditional love is the main teaching isn't it? So what IF your own child declared feelings for the same-sex?

But I do think that you actually are a biscuit phobic, starved of attention and real relationships. Would advise you go to a local church coffee morning & eat hob nobs!

tis not normal, tis natural but not normal

I think it is pretty normal

Although I do not agree with most of the Pope's views, and strong views on his contribution on many serious issues that ultimately affect Catholics and non-catholics alike, (Condoms and HIV, fo e.g), I agree with you, DP, that it is not acceptable to call him abusive names. Nor be personally offensive about people's religious beliefs etc.

However, the Pope has consciously formed his bliefs and opionions, he has made a decision to support the causes and policies he endorses. So taking issue and saying, courteously, what your own response to that is one thing. the difference with homosexulaity, per se, is that homosexual poeople have not consciously decided to be honosexual, they just 'are'. But this , i fear, is where you cease to listen because despite all the evidence to the contrary you believe that it is a lifestyle choice (endless threads passim).

So I will leave this thread now or we will all get dizzy going round in circles.

What's your distinction between 'natural' and 'normal'? Statistic? - thats not what most people mean in this context.

Its natural and normal in the same way as, say, being red-headed. Its a trait natural and normal to a minority of people.

DP - I think it is really nice that you say if any of your children were homosexual, you'd love and support them the same. Credit where credit is due.

I was a Catholic, went to a Catholic school, see nothing wrong with homosexuality (not goiong to trot out a some of my best friends.. line to prove this as it would be a lie, I have none) and fully intend to send my kids to a Catholic school and teach them that there's nothing wrong with homosexuality.
However I could not agree with daftpunks original sentiments more. I know what the over-arching view of homosexuality is of the powers that be in the catholic church and if I send my kids to a private faith based school then i should be prepared for that school to teach it's faith in the way it chooses.
If you choose to send kids to a faith based school then what do you expect to happen other than them to be thought other than the current standing of that faith on issues?
I certainly don't think that the government should be able to force or decide what stance a religious group takes on an issue.

i also think its time dp was banned, i'm sick of this hate spouting all the time

Squeezy;

You'd be suprised at how normal and well adjusted all my dc are....

Plus they love me.....all that matters really..

DS is in Y6 at a Catholic school and has been tought that homosexuality is normal. He even gave his 6yo brother a lecture on "how some people are just gay, and that's perfectly fine" when he used the word "gay" in a derogatory way. - All of which he'd picked up from school.

I certainly don't think that the government should be able to force or decide what stance a religious group takes on an issue.

really? That would rule out an awful lot of legislation on discrimination etc etc etc...

Sure you've thought that statement through?

mayorquimby I think the problem isn't with private faith based schools. What I object to is that government money is used to fund schools which want to retain the right to preach homophobia. To me this is unacceptable as it is clearly not in the interests of community cohesion and the society as a whole - which is the group that state funded schools should be aiming to help. I resent that my taxes are used to fund schools to teach hatred.

Is there a petition about this on the government petitions website? I'm looking now but I can't see one. Do you think there would be support for a petition to ban the teaching of intolerant views in all government funded schools and include homophobic bullying in the bullying policy of all schools? I personally would sign it but there isn't much point setting one up if I'd be the only one.

Reality is that you...?

Reality...this is a thread started in the news topic about something in the news...

I can't believe you want me banned, esp as we have met in RL....not that that matters much I know.....but you have still shocked me.

Against my better judgement but what the hell...

I don't think we should ban someone because of their breathtaking ignorance.
I do think a ban is in order though. For being an unremitting bore.

Since there seems to be some confusion on just what Catholic teaching says, just to be clear, in the Catechism it teaches that homosexuality itself isn't inherently sinful. It's acknowledged that it is natural for some people to be gay. The sin, in Catholic teaching, is any sex, straight or gay, outside a marriage, or any sex within a marriage that closes the door to conception. Oh, and being gay would be no bar to a man who wanted to become a priest, either, since Catholic priests are celibate.
Oh and fwiw, for all those who say 'well all Catholic parents are hypocrites because they must break the rules as they only have 2 kids, which is impossible without contraception', I have 2 kids and don't plan on any more, and am perfectly capable of ensuring I have no more without using artificial contraception. Catholics are allowed to use NFP.

Yes I have. TBH I don't imagine that any faith schools actively teach a "homosexuality is wrong" stance or do not have anti-homophobic bullying and in all my time in Catholic schools never heard anything that didn't state homosexuality to be normal. But it's quite clear to me that Catholicism has not been an easy bed fellow of homosexuality and that trying to force a religious group, in a school where parents have decided to send their children to learn about that faith, to teach something which goes against their religion is wrong and unworkable. And I don't think that it would affect discrimination policies as largely as you think due to the allowances which are made for freedom of religion. Otherwise surely these faith based schools would already be in breach of them as they promote one religious way of thinking over another but this does not equate to discrimination.
However I'm not familiar with UK equality legislation but I'd imagine that it has nothing to do with privately held beliefs and has everything to do with the actions of a person. As such I don't see why there is a move to compell these people to do something (saying homosexuality is normal) which they mioght not believe in rather than attempting to ban them from saying it's not normal but allowing them to stay silent on the issue?

Can I ask a serious q DP?What do your RL friends think of all your prejudices?I know most people have the odd thing they are against but you have whole sections of society almost to the point where there are not many people left who meet your criteria for acceptable

or any sex within a marriage that closes the door to conception

I do wish the Catholic church hadn't invented that particular piece of dogma. It has been responsible for so much unecessary suffering

Ermmm well I wouldn't DEFEND Catholic teaching on this matter.

The Pope HIMSELF basically said that acts of violence against gay people are inevitable because of our pro-gay society:

"When civil legislation is introduced to protect behavior to which no one has any conceivable right, neither the Church nor society at large should be surprised when other distorted notions and practices gain ground, and irrational and violent reactions increase."

Nice.

He also said that gay people, even if they are celibate, have a "tendency" towards an "intrinsic moral evil".

he describes homosexuality as a "objective disorder" and a "moral disorder".

Ratzinger is not an idiot but "homophobic" doesn't even start to cover it.

Grimma what do you mean? I'm not being deliberately obtuse but it is possible to avoid massive families, and it is against Catholic teaching to a) force a woman to have sex against her will and b) infect somebody with something that will kill them so surely if people followed those too the suffering wouldn't happen?

For the record, I wasn't suggesting DP should be banned, just pointing out that MN policy on this is fairly, er, liberal. What with us all being grown-ups and all.