To support the no fly zone in Ukraine

[ThisIsGroundControl]

I get why we haven't but when the Ukrainian president begs for it I think about how I'd feel, if it was my country.
We are surely just delaying the inevitable, we are consoling ourselves that trucks full of supplies is enough when in reality we are showing weakness.

@ThisIsGroundControl

itsnotover Zelenskyy begged today for a no fly zone.

So it's not happening to us so all A OK?

If a no fly zone was put in place it would affect us all including all of the Ukrainian people

@Ionsion

Look up how many nuclear warheads Russia has OP. Then think what would happen if they launched them all. Putin has already moved his family to an underground facility.

I agree it is terrifying the power he has and the weapons he possesses

Things need to move forward now. Zelensky needs to surrender and the world needs to support him and every one of his citizens. It’s not right but we can’t risk Putin using his nuclear weapons

No, it’s madness to think of doing anything that would provoke an attack on our shores.

If we haven’t sacrificed ourselves for the other people in the world who are suffering at the hands of governments then I don’t understand why we’d consider doing it now against someone with nuclear power.

@cornflakedreams

It could stop by Zelensky putting up the white flag. Which I know seems awful but maybe it’s time his head ruled his heart? The world could then carry on with serious sanctions against Russia and maybe have negotiated a Russian withdrawal at some point down the line. Putin needs to be offered a way out to save face. At the minute he’s a cornered rat and that’s dangerous. The situation needs de escalation not escalating. Short term loss might mean a better long term situation?

You're naive if you think that Ukraine surrendering its freedom and democracy in order to be ruled by a dictatorship would bring an end to this.

The reason this is even happening is because we kept rolling over in the past when Putin has done this elsewhere.

Putin will move on to the next country. Georgia or Moldova. Maybe the Baltic states. Finland.

Putin is not going to stop. He has very similar ideological beliefs to Hitler around his perceived humiliation of Russia and loss of what he considers the motherland. He will keep going until he has "taken back" everything he wants.

I think it is appalling to condemn people in Ukraine for trying to fight to preserve freedoms you arrogantly assume will never be stolen from you like this.

Sadly (and yes it’s morally wrong) but smaller losses are preferable to the destruction of the whole planet and all of humanity. That’s the unpleasant truth we are going to be facing I fear.

Unless someone can get rid of Putin we will have to put up with a situation of picking the lesser of two evils

@pucelleauxblanchesmains

We can't have NATO shooting down Russian planes. It wouldn't help the Ukrainians if the entire continent is vapourised. Thankfully Biden seems to realise this.

Basically this.

It's as though some people think they're in a Hollywood films and if we all stand up to Putin using whatever means necessary that he'll back down and say 'fair cop'.

No.

It's horrific what's happening in Ukraine, I dream of hearing that Putin has been pushed out a window. But the suffering would be many times multiplied if the West started shooting down Russian aircraft.

This isn't Call of Duty.

The reality of living in a world with nuclear weapons is that sometimes awful stuff happens but we are heavily constrained by the risk of annihilation. Now personally while I understand the theory that they have prevented millions of deaths in conventional war, I wish they had never invented the buggers. But here we are.

Putin will move on to the next country. Georgia or Moldova. Maybe the Baltic states. Finland.

I don't agree with this. Because Russia will never 'win' the war in Ukraine. They may occupy it and claim a victory but the Ukrainians are never going to accept it quietly. It will require a permanent large scale military occupation. And considering the size of Ukraine that would take up a massive portion of the Russian army.

Russia's economy is tanking, their military's weaknesses have been badly exposed in the past week. They just do not have the money or man-power to move this out of Ukraine.

@TwentyTOoo I totally agree.

@MissHavishamsMouldyOldCake you make excellent points as well

Look, eventually, Russian are going to win this war. We support Ukraine by sanctions but we cannot escalate this. Best case, but still terrible, Ukraine falls and Russian leaves the rest of Europe alone. Worst case - full on War between NATO states and Russia involving nuclear and no one comes out well. Sadly there aren't really any 'good' outcomes to this, just a resolution to downscale the risks.

Also that's not my opinion- it was what a BBC interviewee said. He was an expert in military history I think.

I actually think that now after seeing the sanctions,etc he would stop at Ukraine. I suspect he wouldn’t have done this if he’d realised how bad it would be for Russia

The only issue is we’ve been down playing the risk Putin is for a while now …it hasn’t really worked?

@MissHavishamsMouldyOldCake

Putin will move on to the next country. Georgia or Moldova. Maybe the Baltic states. Finland.

I don't agree with this. Because Russia will never 'win' the war in Ukraine. They may occupy it and claim a victory but the Ukrainians are never going to accept it quietly. It will require a permanent large scale military occupation. And considering the size of Ukraine that would take up a massive portion of the Russian army.

Russia's economy is tanking, their military's weaknesses have been badly exposed in the past week. They just do not have the money or man-power to move this out of Ukraine.

I agree with this and previous post

@Change123today

The only issue is we’ve been down playing the risk Putin is for a while now …it hasn’t really worked?

So Putin has announced today that he will take any announcement of a no fly zone as a declaration of war. So there you go, we either don’t do it, or Do it and have ww3 and possibly nuclear destruction. 🤷‍♀️

@CovidCorvid

I actually think that now after seeing the sanctions,etc he would stop at Ukraine. I suspect he wouldn’t have done this if he’d realised how bad it would be for Russia

I do wonder this, but I don't agree with things people saying this Sadly (and yes it’s morally wrong) but smaller losses are preferable even if we agree what is small, sacrifice Europe for the rest of the world?

I don't need the patronising comments but those that have posted them, at what point would you get involved? Would you allow Poland to be invaded?

Putin has said today that he considers the sanctions an act of war.

I think it is appalling to condemn people in Ukraine for trying to fight to preserve freedoms you arrogantly assume will never be stolen from you like this.

So do I.

@ThisIsGroundControl there is just no talking to you is there? It has been made crystal clear today - a No Fly Zone is absolutely not an option.

[quote RoseRedRoseBlue]@ThisIsGroundControl there is just no talking to you is there? It has been made crystal clear today - a No Fly Zone is absolutely not an option.[/quote]
Exactly . He couldn’t make it any clearer

And what constitutes a small loss? Or what happens if he tries his luck with another country. Well so be it because anything is better than nuclear war.

The world is dealing with a furious, paranoid psychopath who sees not having already dealt with Ukraine in a day or two and having most of the world condemning his actions there as utterly humiliating. There is no telling how far he might go . Maybe he won’t press the big red button but on the other hand he might. We are poised on a knife edge with someone who is deluded and apoplectic with rage. Go one step too far and the whole continent (and perhaps others) will be wiped off the face of the earth.

www.aljazeera.com/news/2022/3/5/thats-poland-now-walk-arab-students-plight-out-of-ukraine

This is disgusting behaviour. Not everything is at it seems unfortunately, as ‘heroic’ as we think the Ukrainians are it would seem a large proportion are equally as racist.

An interesting watch. Always good to hear a non western perspective.

[quote RoseRedRoseBlue]@ThisIsGroundControl there is just no talking to you is there? It has been made crystal clear today - a No Fly Zone is absolutely not an option.[/quote]
Sorry do I have Wrong Think? Can we not discuss and agree to disagree? Is debate a skill that is lost?

Agree with Furry but anything could set him off.

He has said today that Russian SANCTIONS are akin to a declaration of war, so do we remove sanctions?

OnTheBlink it is interesting to see how other countries report it and to remember that

“There are three sides to every story – yours, mine, and the truth.” R. Evans

@Ontheblink Al Jazeera is part funded by the government of Qatar who certainly know plenty about racism given how they treat South Asian migrant workers.

"It was not possible for Al Jazeera to confirm their claims." Or disprove them. So maybe true, maybe exaggerated, maybe underplayed, maybe untrue.