Fran Lyon has left the country

[milliec]

Message withdrawn

Thanks Scooby - I'm certainly sleeping a lot, but I'm not convinced I've any room left for eating a lot!! If Molly's kicks are anything to judge by she isn't overly impressed by it either - unless of course it's an unripe nectarine, in which case she's absolutely fine about it!

Thanks

Fran

Hi CSS,

Hope you enjoyed your brief trip back to the UK!

Fran

Bossy - you've made me smile through all of this, and continue to do so! For that you will have my eternal thanks!

Hi Fran

I did yes, although it's been an extremely long day-glad to be back now!

That sounds very sensible. I'm sure you've putSocial Service in the UK in touch with the new authority so any concerns can be dealt with and sorted out. The new authority (BTW if you're not hiding, and have merely emigrated, forgive for asking, is there any reason why can't you reveal this?) I'm sure will deal wth it under their legislation... and leave you and Molly free to enjoy a carefreee and settled Christmas, and start 2008 as a fresh new family crisp in a warm but wintery world.

Hi OST,

There isn't any particular reason other than just wanting a bit of peace and quiet now! If I were hiding I wouldn't be doing a very good job of it! I suspect anyone who really wanted to find me could do so easily - I'd just rather not advertise it to the world if I don't have to.

Thank you for your kind wishes,

Fran

Fran I've just forwarded an email on to you passed to me by a Mumsnetter

Hi Fran, just popping in to say hello and glad to hear you've had a relaxing day.

It's so lovely to hear you post about the sensible, supportive caring plans (having a supportive family assigned to you) that the new place has to help you. Finally, some real help and support .

You're doing really well.

And i can see why you'd not want to broadcast where you are officially. Enjoy the peace and take time to enjoy the whole nesting thing now you've got a safe place to do it.

i was going to say you'll make a great mummy, but actually you already are being a wonderful mum to Molly.

Thanks CSS

Hi Fran

Sounds like a good plan. And am sure a rest is what you and Molly need. Hope you're getting that.

If there is nothing to hide, as all of us on here know, what does it really matter? Who is after you? From you many posts on here SS are on a witch hunt.. so surely a new country will exonerate you, prove your case and let you and Molly get on with your lives?

Sorry, this probably sounds more sceptical than it is... but it seems that there is such a flimsy case then it would be in your and Molly's interest to put it to bed?

And whilstever you 'hide' - and this is how it looks - then surely there remains some suspicion which you can do away with?

Are Hexham SS pursuing you, or Birmingham?

Hi OST,

Hmmmm. I can see both sides of this one and don't know which way to come down to be fair. Someone wiser than me though said once "When in doubt do nothing".

Whilst I can see that it might look like "hiding", if I were to say where I was then it wouldn't be something I could take back. If I keep it to myself for the time being it's a decision I can still make sensibly and in good time. For now I like the peace of mind I have through knowing that press etc. can't find me without putting some effort in.

I am certainly not "hidden" or hiding from the authorities here, and I guess they will "put it to bed" so to speak.

So far as I know neither Hexham nor Birmingham are pursuing us. When I spoke to the SW from Birmingham it was left that she'd contact me if she needed to, and that if I felt I needed anything from her then I was just to call.

Forgive me if this seems a little blunt or rude but - you seem to have had a bit of a change of heart, could I ask why?

Thanks,

Fran

Thank you sandybeach - I only hope Molly agrees with you when she arrives!

Fran

It just seems an odd thing to say if I said where I was "I couldn't take it back" Afterall, we all saw you on an aeroplane leaving the country.

The press have reporting you variously in Europe and in Sweden.. you have posted here saying you're not 'hiding".

To say the authorites know you are there is one thing. I beleive you and think they do.

But as you posedted last night...you know Northumberland are looking for you, as was iin their press release... so well, to be blunt...have you told them where you are, or Birmingham? If not, why not?

If, as you have laways cliamed on here, Spcial Services have no case and you are hiding nothing... then why not let them pass their scurilious accusations to where you are now? Which would be thrown out?

For the "open and honest" person you have always claimed to be, you seem (excuse me) a little obtuse about wy you left the country and why you will not let the relevent authoristies in the UK pass your file to where you are. Ifd there is nothing to hide, what is the problem with that?

Sorry I am. admittedly a sceptic. But you have alwaus claimed there is no case to answer..and I justfind the fact that you won't say where you are or why you won't inform the UK authorities where youare a little...well...odd.

Hi OST,

You did all see me leave, but not where I went - otherwise you wouldn't be asking I assume. It's the knowledge of where I went that I wouldn't be able to take back - and that for the moment at least I should like to keep to myself.

I know Northumberland have asked me to get in contact. However I also know they've been told that to make such a request with any kind of implied authority is beyond their remit and jurisdiction.

I don't if I have been obtuse about why I left - I haven't intended to be. To be very clear though, I left because I was terrified of what would happen if I stayed and because I had lost all faith in reaching a sensible solution (a Mother and Baby Unit for example) by the time Molly was born.

There isn't anything to hide, which is why the midwife and the psychologist here have had all the documents from the UK. I hope you can forgive a little reticence on my part to have the UK formally involved in my life now - I'm not entirely convinced I can trust them, or their actions. Whilst I've no doubt that even if they were to turn up here and plead their case in person with the authorities that they would get nowhere; it is a worry and a stress I can do without - even if for just a few weeks.

Thanks,

Fran

Thanks Fran for that explantion that makes some sense.

As far as I know concerning SS, then you said there was to be transfer confrence when you moved to Birmigham. If that confrecne didnt happen then the legal juridictaion, as I understand it, still lies with Northumberland..is that your understanding?

If that hasn't happenend then they do have jurisdication... and really to say that the midwives there have all the documents from the UK...how could they have? You have said yourself you don;t have all the SS documents, so how could you have give them to the people involved in your care now?

I do wish you and Molly the bet. But I increasiny thing you you have fled. Early in your case you said you would go to court, a judicial review, fight it in court. you have posted on here saying that the main thing was areport due on the 7th December.... that has nit come.

I ams osrry, but I see somenone fleeing who has something to hide...so much so, that they will not even inform the UK authorities where she is.

I ask you this: If you are sure of your case then why not face it in a UK court with Bill Bache? Why not let NNC pass their file to where you are? Why not let your new authority decide when they are in possession of SS concerns?

Sorry Fran. I wish the best for both of you, but I see someone fleeing and hiding from the truth.

I very much hope I am wrong

As sure as I was of any case I may ahve, if there was even the tiniest chance I could have such a birth plan forced upon me/run the risk of losing my child, I would have done exactly what Fran has done.

And no; I don't think I'd be telling people aside from the closest of friends and family where I was.

I don't think that's necessarily having anything to hide. More, having the most precious thing in the world to protect.

CSS

Have you seen the full birth plan?

Or hae you just hearda about it?

And have you wondered what sort of mother passes her birth plan around strangers on the internet?

If you have the full birth plan, perhaps you would like to hsae it with us all?

Hi OST,

Last one before I sleep!

The jurisdiction issue, as far as I have been told, is determined by where I was resident. Birmingham had most definitely taken over, and have written to that effect.

Sorry - you're right about they documentation. I should have said the midwife and psychologist here have had all the documentation that I have from the UK.

Earlier on in my pregnancy I wasn't as terrified. I had more time, and I still had some confidence in finding a sensible way forward.

If I could have gained some agreement to not have Molly removed immediately, and by force, as per the recommendations from the psychiatrist that NCC instructed then I would have happily seen this dealt with in court in the UK. However I was not prepared to risk the trauma of that separation for Molly or me, solely in order to remain in the UK. I could have waited until the report came back on the 7th - but having seen them ignore 3 previous reports I didn't have enough confidence that it would make any difference. Also, to be fair, to stay would have required a strength of character that I just didn't have. The terror, and I'm not meaning to be hyperbolic here, that I was living with day to day was simply too much for me to manage toward the end.

I am sorry that you see my actions as those of someone who is fleeing and hiding from something. I accept that they can be seen that way. I'm reasonably sure that they can also be seen as the actions of someone who was incredibly frightened, and who now just wants some peace.

Without any disrespect - I hope that over time I can prove you, and others who may still have concerns, wrong.

Thanks,

Fran

"And have you wondered what sort of mother passes her birth plan around strangers on the internet?"

Many, many MNers on antenatal threads and "what was your birth plan" threads!

Fran, sleep well. I have been following your threads but not posted before - I do wish you and Molly all the very best in the future.

Hi OST,

I've an unnerving suspicion that I know who you are. If I'm wrong then I'm really very sorry, but for the time being I think it's probably best that we don't speak directly any further.

I hope this doesn't cause offence, and I do sincerely hope I'm just being over-cautious.

Fran

Fran

Perhaps some sleep. The jurisdrictiaon - I contradict...is not where you were resident at the time the case was brought.. and not transfered until a Case Transfer Conferenece... It look liked you popped in to John Hemmings consitituency for a week and then went to Europe.

So NCC are legally oblige to protect your child wherever you are in the world - until they can transfer it. If this IS not the case then can you say why?

So what are these thre "previous reports" that have been ignored. Are we talking the report for Stella Nwerith from 4 years ago... or the charachter reference from Dr Rex Haigh? Where is the report from anyone recent. in full, quoted?

Sorry but there isn't one.

I also have it on good authoirty that NCC were planning to put you and baby in a mother and baby unit since August, pending positive psychiatrict assestments. Can you explain why you have not given this info to the public and have instead given the impression that this option has been denied to you?

Oldstraighttrack

I think if you have some discussion to have with Fran in a professional capacity you should talk through her solicitor. This is not the place for this discussion.

I am reporting these posts to MNHQ who I trust will come to some kind of common sense view as to what is appropriate or not.

Soapbox

Absoultely fine.

I don't. Simply asked some questions.

And if Fran can't answer them straight, well tat surely is her problem. I do not have any conversation with Fran in a professional capacity.

Well suffice to say that your questions have a certain journalistic relentlessness about them...

Hi Soapbox,

I've reported mine and OST's to MN too. Sorry to have caused a problem.

Like I said, I'm pretty sure I know who OST is and I think it's probably best I just stay away now.

People can contact outwith MN if they want/need to.

Thanks,

Fran