Shamima begum allowed to return to UK

[mummabear1967]

Surely I’ve got this wrong? She’s actually allowed back to the UK after joining a terrorist group abroad?

Anyone just a tiny bit worried about what might happen if she does return?

You apparently can't deradicalize someone through education and she has expressed anti UK sentiments on incidents like the Manchester bombing so shouldn't be allowed back. I totally understand why Pakistan don't want her.

She was groomed but she was 15 and had internet access while growing up so knew that ISIS are terrorists. We can't compare her to other child victims like children who are groomed into working for County Lines.

@mummabear1967 yes you think she shouldn’t be allowed to return but where do you think she should live?

Doesn’t matter, this is a very extreme circumstance and I think in exceptional circumstances, citizenship should be removed

Are there any other extreme circumstances?

What about far right terrorists and groomers? Where should they be sent?

She should be treated the same as anyone else who goes overseas to support a foreign power in a war. According to the Independent over 900 Brits went to support Isis either by fighting or living in their state. Some of them had their British citizenship revoked. Some didn't.
I think that's the more pertinent comparison than the grooming one.

I'm guessing most posters on this thread can't name the other Brits who were stripped of citizenship or discuss what happened to the other people who returned from supporting Isis. Turning Begum into a cause celebre sits uneasily with me and I do wonder who it has benefited to do so.

If she turns up here, she should be allowed in, arrested and tried for terrorism. That's reasonable.

She should absolutely not be brought back from Syria at the taxpayers' expense.

Europol’s annual Terrorism Situation and Trend report, published on Tuesday, said one attack – in Stanwell – was carried out and three were foiled in the year.

The 50-year-old was targeting Muslims during the rampage, shouting: “All Muslims should die, white supremacists rule. I’m going to murder a Muslim.”

One of the UK plots listed by Europol is believed to be a teenage neo-Nazi’s planned attacks on synagogues and other targets in Durham.
The 17-year-old, who cannot be named for legal reasons, was jailed in January after writing a manifesto aiming to inspire other terrorists.*

Should the 17 yo be stripped of his citizenship too and sent somewhere?

I see her as a victim and welcome the news that she's allowed back. Look she left for Syria at 15 but I think it's a fair assumption that she didn't receive a phonecall one day, age 15, inviting her to leave her family and go and fight for ISIS, and, completely unaware that it wasn't a great idea, just up and go! The grooming process would have started way earlier, perhaps when she was barely into her teens. Her young impressionable mind against an organisation whose sole aim was to pounce on vulnerability and to brainwash. She didn't stand a chance. She was a child when she was captured and turned into a monster. Now she deserves help in learning to become human again.

I don’t think it is really a case of whether I want her to return to the UK- I don’t and can see many negatives. It is more a matter of whether you respect the rule of law. Nobody can be rendered stateless which is what essentially happened to her. The idea that she can be a citizen of Bangladesh is questionable. The state can’t pick and choose when to apply the law and decide there should be an exception made because the person is appealing. She should be returned to the uk then tried and sentenced for terrorism.

Appalling... she is holds no appeal clearly

Some of them had their British citizenship revoked. Some didn't.

How many had dual citizenship?
That's the main issue here. By taking her citizenship away , they have made her stateless.

It's entirely fair enough to put her on trial for terrorism (any mitigating circumstances and evidence will be discussed then), they can't leave her stateless or wash their hands of her and make her another country's problem.

She's not being allowed back permanently though is she? She's being allowed back so that the case can be heard as to whether it's lawful to strip her of citizenship. It's important that she's allowed a proper hearing - that's a fundamental cornerstone of living in a country with an independent legal system. If you start to say that 'so in so' doesn't deserve a hearing, where do you draw the line?

Has anyone explained where she should be deported to given she is British

She doesn’t need deporting she did that bit by herself.

Now things aren’t going so well she wants to come back to a country she clearly hates and to be surrounded by people she appears to hate.

The question is why

She can have Pakistani citizenship however they don't want her her husband is Dutch? So surely she can claim via him? Except they don't want her either

Basically no one wants her

I'm not surprised

She is an unsympathetic "victim" when asked she said people should feel sorry for her there is nothing there she is vacant

She can have Pakistani citizenship however they don't want her her husband is Dutch? So surely she can claim via him? Except they don't want her either

I’m not sure on what basis she would qualify for Pakistani or Dutch citizenship?

She shouldn’t be allowed back,she professes to hate the west so much but actually quite likes the soft life she had here. She will comply slip back into her old life of praying at the East London Mosque where she was radicalised and she will probably become some sort of celebrity of the mosque. One of the fathers of the one of the other girls who went with her attended a rally where they all burnt the American flag, also the killer of lee rigby was there too. Didn’t she view lots of videos of people being beheaded before she went out there?

One of the fathers of the one of the other girls who went with her attended a rally where they all burnt the American flag, also the killer of lee rigby was there too. Didn’t she view lots of videos of people being beheaded before she went out there?

Elvis and Tupac showed up as well

Whats wrong with burning a piece of cloth? To show the brutality your country has had inflicted on it by western powers

Does America vanish when that happens or does a redneck die every time you burn a flag akin to faries and saying you dont believe in them?

^How many had dual citizenship?
That's the main issue here. By taking her citizenship away , they have made her stateless^
My understanding is that they did make some British people stateless who joined Isis or went to live in the caliphate. What I find interesting is that none of that was debated but everyone is up in arms about Begum.
Either we think our country should be able to strip people of citizenship or we don't - it's an important debate to have.
Framing it all around one female sits uncomfortably with me. imo the issue isn't about whether she was was groomed or not. The issue is about whether people who go to support a terrorist group or to fight in a foreign war can be made stateless or/and how you deal with them if they return.

@AnneOfQueenSables I thought countries weren't allowed to make people stateless?

Haven’t read all 8 pages but I’d imagine this will be a lengthy legal battle between the Home Officer and ECHR.
The trouble is she is British so essentially is our problem. Whatever the result of this, the poor tax payers will probably be paying millions for this case.
With regards to monitoring her, again expensive and resource draining.

She should be treated the same as anyone else who goes overseas to support a foreign power in a war.

She left the UK when she was a minor. This can justifiably mean treating her differently to if she had left when she was an adult. That's for the courts to decide. In a fair hearing. Which cannot happen if the defendant is locked out of the country.

She is an unsympathetic "victim" when asked she said people should feel sorry for her there is nothing there she is vacant

I think I would be a bit vacant if I had witnessed and been forced to do the things she has. I can't imagine anyone's mental health would be too top after that.

I thought countries weren't allowed to make people stateless?

They aren't.

I wish our government would be the same as an other sensible government. The Pakistani or Dutch government won't have her. But silly old England as usual will take her.
This government needs to liven up we are well know for taking anything and everything know matter what.
They will Give her a nice new big house and new identity and as much money as she needs.
Sod the rest of us who have always been law abiding and never taken anything only ever worked hard and paid into the country.
None of our children will get a house unless they buy them. X