Shamima begum allowed to return to UK

[mummabear1967]

Surely I’ve got this wrong? She’s actually allowed back to the UK after joining a terrorist group abroad?

Anyone just a tiny bit worried about what might happen if she does return?

@mediciempire You’ve seen Irish residents calling for Begum to be hung? Interesting. I suppose it depends on the demographics of your social media.

Thankfully, public opinion barely factors into decisions made by security services. So regardless of the outcry or not, they have advised the government as per the risk posed. Irish authorities did the same, and worked hard with our government to ensure she could not leave.

In fairness, the stance taken by the government has incredibly forced embassies to reduce their intervention in cases of British criminality abroad. Their job is to ensure a fair trial is given.

Kurdish authorities are willing to try and sentence Begum, but that comes with conditions that the government must decide if they’re willing to pay. Begum is, in essence, a pawn of international relations. If we recognise Kurdistan, these people permanently go away, but that puts us in opposition to Turkey in particular.

Everyone saying 15yr olds “know what they’re doing” or whatever has clearly never met a 15yr old or has forgotten what it was to be one. She’s a British citizen and therefore our problem: she should be tried and probably detained by our justice system, but we can’t just say she’s not our problem to manage because her parent(s) are immigrants and she’s brown.

As others have said grooming is grooming, whether it be by terrorists or for sex. As someone who was groomed at a similar age by a paedophile, I can say with utter conviction that I was totally in his thrall and would have done anything he told me to (and did, including lying and immoral acts). That’s how grooming works!

@AllTheWhoresOfMalta

Everyone saying 15yr olds “know what they’re doing” or whatever has clearly never met a 15yr old or has forgotten what it was to be one. She’s a British citizen and therefore our problem: she should be tried and probably detained by our justice system, but we can’t just say she’s not our problem to manage because her parent(s) are immigrants and she’s brown.

As others have said grooming is grooming, whether it be by terrorists or for sex. As someone who was groomed at a similar age by a paedophile, I can say with utter conviction that I was totally in his thrall and would have done anything he told me to (and did, including lying and immoral acts). That’s how grooming works!

Yep this

She might have been 15 when she left but she spent 5 years there seeing horrific actions against innocent people. This women will be irreversibly changed.

She could be a danger for the rest of her life. What are they actually going to do with her when she gets here? Lock her up for life? Or will the do gooders start campaigning to free her? Because In some people’s eyes they still see her as a 15 year old child. She’s not - she is a 20 year old woman.

She would have to have intense psychotherapy costing thousands, if she was ever to be released she would have to be under surveillance for the rest of her life costing yet more hundreds of thousands.

If the government committed to making sure this women never left prison it wouldn’t bother me she is coming back but just by going off this thread people are climbing over themselves to say ‘she was a child!!’ and this some how absolves her of what she has done.

SB will absolutely be going for release and she will have support in that. And that worries me. Because we know that released terrorists can go on to murder.

I have a Dd of similar age.
When she saw this on the news her reaction was they are all going to end up dead or have a really shitty lives. She couldn’t understand why anyone whether they were 15 or 50 would choose to go to a war zone to live.

[quote sergeilavrov]@mediciempire You’ve seen Irish residents calling for Begum to be hung? Interesting. I suppose it depends on the demographics of your social media.

Thankfully, public opinion barely factors into decisions made by security services. So regardless of the outcry or not, they have advised the government as per the risk posed. Irish authorities did the same, and worked hard with our government to ensure she could not leave.

In fairness, the stance taken by the government has incredibly forced embassies to reduce their intervention in cases of British criminality abroad. Their job is to ensure a fair trial is given.

Kurdish authorities are willing to try and sentence Begum, but that comes with conditions that the government must decide if they’re willing to pay. Begum is, in essence, a pawn of international relations. If we recognise Kurdistan, these people permanently go away, but that puts us in opposition to Turkey in particular.[/quote]
I have and it most definitely does depend on the demographics of your social media and your circle.

@Evelefteden

She might have been 15 when she left but she spent 5 years there seeing horrific actions against innocent people. This women will be irreversibly changed.

She could be a danger for the rest of her life. What are they actually going to do with her when she gets here? Lock her up for life? Or will the do gooders start campaigning to free her? Because In some people’s eyes they still see her as a 15 year old child. She’s not - she is a 20 year old woman.

She would have to have intense psychotherapy costing thousands, if she was ever to be released she would have to be under surveillance for the rest of her life costing yet more hundreds of thousands.

If the government committed to making sure this women never left prison it wouldn’t bother me she is coming back but just by going off this thread people are climbing over themselves to say ‘she was a child!!’ and this some how absolves her of what she has done.

SB will absolutely be going for release and she will have support in that. And that worries me. Because we know that released terrorists can go on to murder.

This is a genuine question, because I don’t know the answer, but what evidence is there that she herself is a risk? Yes I know she married, and so possibly supported, an Isis member. But is there evidence that she herself would be a risk of committing terrorise acts? Is there much info about what she has actually been doing while she has been there? I mean she’s birthed and lost three babies, I would have though if anything she’d be extremely traumatised rather than a risk.

I wonder if people realise how many killers and paedophiles are realeased from prison and go on to reoffend?

Why does no one put as much energy into campaigning and protesting against that?

The judges will act in the spirit of the law.

We don't want to hang on to foreign criminals and illegal immigrants - my point was that neither do other countries.**

Spot on. There are thousands of convicted murderers and paedophiles who have been let out of prison. But no one campaigns to keep these behind bars.
I’d imagine they are more of a danger to us than this girl, despite my earlier posts about her.

We’ve also had white British men go to Syria to fight Isis/ ISIL and face terrorism charges on their return to the UK.

She had the courage of her convictions when she left the UK, but appears to have conveniently changed her mindset now that she wants the UK to take her back - so, she's a hypocrite as well.

A sheltered,groomed 15 yo vs a 20 yo woman that was a child bride, married a man much older than her after a few day, has seen her babies die and many atrocities.

How dare she change her mindset?

So what are people’s views on child soldiers?

Is there any real evidence she regrets the actions of ISIS? Regrets the things her husband did? I don’t think so. She just wants to go home and have an easier life now it’s all gone wrong. I don’t think she’s ever said she made a catastrophic mistake.

A lot of comments about how much it will cost to imprison and surveil SB if her British citizenship is reinstated. You realise the courts are, quite rightly, not going to pay any attention to any of that?

The job of the courts is not to decide whether stripping Shamima Begun of her citizenship is right, their job is to decide whether or not it was legal. The rule of law, and the principle that our government must itself obey the law, has been established in Britain for centuries. It should not be thrown away because a few terrorists might commit crimes in future.

Is there any real evidence she regrets the actions of ISIS?
There is not even evidence she had any children.

This is a genuine question, because I don’t know the answer, but what evidence is there that she herself is a risk?
The biggest risk is that because of her ALL terrorists are legally required to be 'rescued' by UK forces and looked after for their entire lives by UK taxpayers.

How dare she change her mindset?

It’s not as if she was flip flopping between buying a red car or a blue one was it?

You don’t just stop being an IS supporter/activist/participant over night.

So what are people’s views on child soldiers

They should go to prison.

Have you ever been in a young offenders prison? Most of the kids in there have had dreadful upbringings. But they were still held accountable for what they did.

The biggest risk is that because of her ALL terrorists are legally required to be 'rescued' by UK forces and looked after for their entire lives by UK taxpayers

This ^^

It’s not the tax payers money that bothers me, it’s the releasing back in to society.

@ZombieFan

Is there any real evidence she regrets the actions of ISIS? There is not even evidence she had any children.

This is a genuine question, because I don’t know the answer, but what evidence is there that she herself is a risk?
The biggest risk is that because of her ALL terrorists are legally required to be 'rescued' by UK forces and looked after for their entire lives by UK taxpayers.

Why would it mean all terrorists have to be ‘rescued’. Surely it just means that people can’t have their citizenship revoked without there having been a fair legal process.

Perhaps,she could be locked up in the Tower of London

Perhaps,she could be locked up in the Tower of London
If only that were true the problem would be solved. Unfortunately she will do a few years in prison and then be put into 'protection' at our expense for the rest of her life. Almost like its encouraging people to join foreign armies killing British people, just for the perks.

It's just a joke.

@pollylocketpickedapocket Well said!!! Glad someone's got a brain!!!

How is she meant to be getting back here and who is paying for the journey and the protection she will no doubt need!

@woodhill

Perhaps,she could be locked up in the Tower of London

What crime would you incarcerate her for life for? The penalty for supporting a proscribed organisation is a maximum of ten years. I imagine there’d be consideration of extenuating circumstances.

People have committed more heinous crimes and not received nearly as much hatred.

I don't think she should have got legal aid if she doesnt even have UK citizenship how can she possibly be entitled to it. The whole thing is nuts IMHO.,

@Viviennemary

I don't think she should have got legal aid if she doesnt even have UK citizenship how can she possibly be entitled to it. The whole thing is nuts IMHO.,

Because she’s appealing citizenship having being removed from her.