Pro-paedophilia campaigner locked up - too blinking right!!!

[tigerschick]

here

Sick

thats the problem with these cases though especially if years have passed. a conviction is almost impossible. as most times the only two people who know about it are the child and their abuser, and if anyone else knows the fact that they didn't report it does not bode well for them to come forward in court.
so you end up with a case where it is one persons word against the other as most witnesses and pretty much all evidence is gone. and as anyone who has been through the courts know these cases are almost impossible to get a criminal conviction "beyond a reasonable doubt". it's unfortunate but i do not know of any better system.

whiskeyand beer - I agree with you. These cases are so difficult and it would be unfair to put someone through a trial if there is no hope of it suceeding.It is a sad fact that some cases are made up (again not saying that is the case with Iamasurvivor cos as you said no need to lie on here)and it is those people that make it so difficult for the real victims.

i understand that its one persons word against another, what i found hardest to come to terms with is that the CPS are playing the lottery with peoples lives. i have recently read of 2 historical cases where it seems those women had no more evidence than i did, yet their abusers were convicted.

it took an enormous amount of courage to report the abuse but the love of my husband and daughter got me through it. sadly half of my family turned against me, believing that he wouldnt be capable of such a thing and the lack of conviction did nothing to change their minds.

i had an enormous amount of support from other MNers on my OP and will always be grateful for their words of kindness.

what I was saying before is that it is indeed unfair that we, as a society should pay for rehabilitation of criminals and not into a mutual compensation fund to help victims heal their traumas.
I was further asking: how do we, as a civilised society, constituted in a law abiding group that democratically surrendered force into the hands of elected representatives, deal with these morally challenging issues?
I mean surely we can not get back to an eye for an eye?

It is not because I and others adopt this view that we are less understanding/sensitive/revolted by this issue (among others)

i dont know what the answer is to be honest, and maybe i am still to emotionally raw to have a logical opinion, but i will never feel that anyone who gets sexual gratification from a child (whether through porn, abuse etc) has the right to be treated with a 'there, there its all in your head' approach. bloody hell next they will be saying 'the voices in my head made me do it'

"pan,you strike me as somebody who's read too many text books and spent very little time in the real world. ".....oh well.

Yes, the interderminate sentence is a new/flexible way of dealing with high risk offenders, though now that some of them are up for consideration for release, the Prison Service are coming under pressure to demonstrate they had the opportunity to self-improve. Provision in most prisons are very modest.

The other thing about not locking away 'forever' is the reaction of many victims, esp. little ones. For those I have come across, the first thing they want is for it not to happen to anyone else. But the nasty way guilt can play on tender minds is to 'blame themselves' for whatever punishment is handed out to the abuser, esp. if it is a family member. So they 'suffer' twice over.

There are perpetrators out there, and inside, that have an absence of moral feeling, or just assume they have sexual rights over women and children. I and a few others round here have met them. >. They are such a danger they do need to be locked away, possibly for ever, and some are.

BUT, that is nothing like the magority, and intensive CBT input, wit haccents on victim awareness, attiudes, self-awareness of motivation to offend, whole life-style management, and heavy focus on 'how' they offend, rather than 'why', IS a very effective way of reducing the risk.

And would I live next door to a paedophile?? I am probably living no more than 100 yards from a man who finds children 'attractive'. You are too.

divasstrop..maybe should read more books??

iamasurvivor you say I am too raw to have logical opinion.
And that is exactly why we can not tolerate an eye for an eye in our societies.
However, I strongly believe taht justice can not be rendered without listening to the victims too.
The criminal system should definitely slam the door on rehabilitation in these cases.
I mean the empathic all encompassing mental illness approach is an insult towards victims. Most offenses are repeat.

thought a link to this may be appropriate

Please notice that whilst there is a human right to security of eprson (ie someone who abuses you is in breach of your human rights) there is no provision- as many think- for TV's in prison / allowing offefenders to get away with it etc

All that is asked is a right of appeal and a fair trial.

FWIW I was sexually assaulted at 16,, victim of violent abuse in my childhood and raped by a partner at 19 so i do ahve some idea, Survivor, although |iI am so fortuante nott o ahve experienced what you have.

exactly, due process of law is the common ground that protects us ALL.
(or it should be, new terrorism world order tells us otherwise but that's another debate)

peachy i am very sorry for what you have also eperienced, please dont think that its any less horrific that what i experienced.

so i take it there is no evidence to suggest that paedos have a 'mental
illness'?

i understand there are different types of offences,and that an 18 year old who slept with his 15 year old girlfriend could be convicted and end up on the sex offenders register.however,i think there is a difference between somebody like that and somebody who abuses young children or dowloads child porn,and i doubt very much those type of paedos could be 'helped'.

if a victim feels guilty about a family member being imprisoned for abusing them,then money should be spent on therapy for the victim,to deal with those issues and understand they were in no way to blame.

pan-i assume that you and roykeane are one and the same?

tumopurs and paedophilia

Thre's mopre out there but tbh I doubt any of it is widely applying, more answering specific cases, as the above one does

FWIW the eprson who physically abused me was severely depressed, and I am sure thats what caused that eprson to overstep the barriers; the man who assaulted had SN and a very low IQ

I don't think Paedophilia is a mental illness, its a crime. But I thnk there are probably occasiona wheere mental illness is a contributory factor to apedophilia being expressed, iyswim?

I think that, if you take into account that most abusers have been abused, then the 'mental illness' is the fact that these mens' first experience of sexuality were as children ( at whatever age it was that they were abused.) So if regular sexual activity as a child was the 'norm' that they grew up with, that is a lot of 'unlearning' that these men often have to do.

This is why most paedophiles cannot see anything abnormal about their thoughts/actions.

This is why most paedophiles cannot see anything abnormal about their thoughts/actions.

This is just not true. IME, most know that sexual thoughts and behaviours they exhbit are 'wrong'. A very, very small proportion have no victim empathy whatsoever.

i'm glad that this thread has turned into a more intelligent, thoughtful debate.

hate and rage do not help.

The only direct case I was involved with (supporting a friend through the courts), it ws her Dad and he definitely knew- so much so after she came to ask for help, he handed himself in to the Police

Pan. I was very struck by a recent report on child soldiers and how long it takes to rehabilitate these young boys. Although most of them knew that their previous actions had been wrong, it still took a long time for them to 'un-learn' the behaviour. And these are boys usually taken at post-toddler age.

bubble, ds is 3 (.9) and obsessed with swords and guns (guns thanks so an 11 y o friend of mine's son) and i HATE it for that very reason - the whole terrible child soldier thing. dh seems to think it is all good fun though.

How many of you advocates for castration fully understand paedophilia and what makes someone become a paedophile?

none of the above newlife. imo

i thought that the 'most abusers have been abused' thing was a load of codswallop?and that maybe they claim to have been abused to try and justify their actions but in reality it doesnt follow that an abused person will go on to abuse.

isnt it a fact that the majority of paedophiles are men whilst the majority of victims are girls?or is that another myth?

pan- i can see where you are coming from now with the different types of abusers.

but if somebody wants to be 'helped' and the therapy/drugs dont work,then surely they are still a danger to children,and then you will get the ones who claim they want to be helped,and go through the motions hoping for early release so they can re-offend.its far too much of a risk IMO,and we should be protecting the children from these monsters,whether they have raped 50 children or downloaded 5 pictures from the net.they are all scum.

Paedophilia and abuse are not intrinsically linked afaik

newlife-i have asked if anybody knows?