I think anyone who voted Labour in the last election is complicit in murder

[Aloha]

Because you knew Tony Blair lied and lied and lied to get us into that war, and now children are being killed every day, and bodies are piling up in the streets. I think he is the most vile, wicked and contemptible man in Britain. How can he sleep at night? I feel so ashamed he is our prime minister.

Anyway I have to go

good night everyone.

All i an say is- vote with your conscience next time. I know I will.

sorry Peachy, missed your post.

Senora, of course they don't live there anymore! And I have no idea if they are respresentative of Iraqis. They are not exactly educated, middle-class types afaik if that's what you mean. Ditto the family I know who left Czechslovakia, Albania, et etc

I voted Labour in the last general election and I have blood on my hands. I don't think it would have mattered which party I voted for tbh. The US would have gone ahead regardless.

And TB facilities flights organised by GWB's cronies in the CIA to fly people to be tortured in nightmarish cellars all over the world. And the Labour government sends back victims of torture to be murdered. I want to join the waiting list to dance on the fucker's grave once his dodgy heart gives out. I hope it is soon.

IT'S NOT OUR FAULT

Depends how you voted.

i agree with you actually Aloha. he took us to war so he'd look like a 'strong' leader and so many people fell for it.

I just mean that expats in general are not representative of a population.

The US would have gone ahead anyway, but the support within the US would have faltered sooner were it not for our support. Plus if the US had been alone in the world, they may not have neen so arrogant about the whole thing.

god this world is so corrupt

I think whoever is in charge would want to be on the right side of one of the largest politcal powers in the world - namely America.

it is all of our faults...even those of us that didn't vote for him (i feel that way anyway).

somehow collectively we didn't convince TB that he HAD to stand up to the Bush administration.

We all failed.

hi ruty

blondilocks....hmmmm

at any cost it seems.

peachy - i have also met iraqi's and kurds tortured by saddam's regime and been shown wounds and scars - i have a friend whose iranian cousin got killed when saddam invaded iran - but i still OPPOSED the Iraq invasion - i oppose imperialist invasions harking back to previous centuries when we invaded people whenever it suited us

people may not believe in the UN and think it is shite, but it was set up to PREVENT such wars - it was set up to help weaker nations from the sharks

many millions of iraqi's who supported the fact that Saddam was going to be toppled by us, have now turned against us because of the civil war going on in their country - iraq has become blood bath for the world's major powers trying to defeat al quaida - and we are failing miserably

that is what they don't tell us here - it is AL QUAIDA by proxy that we are fighting in Iraq, not Iraqi insurgents

speedymama as far as i'm concerned anyone who voted Tory after the sinking of the Belgrano should have felt thoroughly ashamed.

hi sophable.
Must go to bed!

actually blondilocks, that's not true. Even Thatcher had the guts to stand up to the us when they invaded grenada. but not blair.

It was going to happen no matter who was in power.

So the million march didn't have any effect; what else can be done?

I don't think many voters are interested in international politics tbh; how best to engage them (me) is a tough one.

Many people can only think/live month to month and don't have the time, interest, etc to consider anything beyond their immediate needs.

you said that before, mwercy and it's

a) not true and
b) entirely beside the point

So, Aloha, do you feel that you are not complicit at all, because of your vote?

I don't get this. All politicians lie - all the time. As far as I'm concerned few of them are virtuous if any.

Saddam Hussein is not a mass murderer???? What about the mass killings he ordered on the people of Basra? He and his government buried people alive with bulldozers, to name just one atrocity!

I am not saying that I supported the war. But it sounds as if you are saying that we should all vote according to whether or not we agreed with Iraq. I think it's fair to say that although a government's foreign policy has some effect on how people vote, they also vote according to how that vote will directly affect them and their family. And I don't blame them.

VVV brings up an interesting point.

Abuse of children occurs not just in war-torn states but also in many areas in which children are forced to work so we can have cheap goods and food.

So our behaviour beyond voting means we collude in this abuse, which includes torture and mistreatment to the point where children die from disease/malnutrition.

Look at the new Tesco ad, with the woman riding a horse who basically gets rid of a dirty dress and buys another just like it because it's so cheap.

How do those who make those clothes live?

I also think that if the war was about oil, we all have to accept some responsibility for it, whether we voted labour or not.

Electra, Aloha didn't say Saddam was not a mass murderer, she said he wasn't a mass murderer when we went to war. which is a very different thing and which is true.

The incident you cite was several years before the war.

expatinscotland funny you should say that as that was my reaction to the ad. It made me shudder!

Aloha will you be leaving this country now ?