Grenfell Tower fire- thread three

[RhythmAndStealth]

Seventeen tragic deaths confirmed so far, six victims provisionally identified.
Number of those who perished feared to rise into triple figures as search proceeds
Search for remaining victims expected to take weeks, sadly it’s considered unlikely that it will be possible to identify all the victims
Names of those still missing start to emerge
Nearly 80 victims being treated across six hospitals, with 15 still in critical care
Hundreds of people displaced and dispossessed, concerned about when and where they will be rehoused

Public inquiry ordered.
Criminal investigation launched.
Serious questions being asked about fire safety regulations, management of social housing, austerity and inequality.
Fire Brigade search of building expected to take weeks due to complexity of building, extent of fire damage and the necessity of undertaking a painstaking fingertip search.

“There must be arrests after this monstrous crime” David Lammy MP

‘Families rehoused last night been left clueless about where to spend next nights. No word from #kccouncil. Chaos.” Emily Maitlis, BBC

“We have to act as if it was our friends, our family in that block” Nick Hurd MP, Policing and Fire Minister

“Someone needs to be held accountable. These deaths could have been prevented.” Local resident to Sadiq Khan

Thread 2
Thread 1

peace Well I guess if they didn't want her there, they'd soon let her know.

Queenie and Wills
Yeah, Queenie and wills, given em a cuddly nickname and they feel just like us really don't they

dowswer I thought it was her mum she mentioned. Sister and three daughters. Just awful that she has no information.

30 people are known to have died now.

Heartbreaking. None of this needed to happen.

Very sadly, most of the bodies won't be identified. I hope that doesn't mean that they get to keep the death toll lower as a result. Not that I want the death toll to be higher. It's just maths, sadly.

In the same way as if someone dies in the hospital after, it's not recorded as a 'fire death' - and therefore fire deaths are down.

Is there any way we can stop the public enquiry and demand an inquest instead?

30 confirmed dead now. 1 of whom had been taken to hospital. 12 are brought to morgue, remainder remain in the building.

It's fucking infuriating! That poor woman! They've identified everyone in hospital, I find it highly unlikely anyone who lived there but wasn't there doesn't know about it and hasn't told people they're safe or that if they got out they haven't told anyone and just gone to a friend's who also hasn't told anyone. They need to be realistic with people.

peace I bet people felt the same back in the great fire of london......twas ever thus and will ever be.

in this day and age however there is simply no excuse for fire risk like that, so many awful errors, one stair case ? cladding, no sprinklers????

As I said in my own three bed terrace with font and back doors I am having issues getting one new window due to strict fire laws!

remainder remain in the building.

I know I sound incredibly naive but why are they still in the building? It just seems so wrong.

Not sure why. He said they're trying to remove bodies quickly and with dignity.

He has also mentioned the intensity of the fire, so draw your own conclusions really.

They can't get to much of the building. There 's no' wrong' about it, it simply isn't safe.

Trust in normal circumstances it is many times more dangerous for everyone to evacuate on such a scale than it is for people to remain in situ unless in immediate reach of the fire.

The problem here is that the safety systems to ensure such a process worked were undermined. The problem in 9/11 was that the advice given was for a bomb or office fire, not entire jet planes.

It may be that it's not safe to remove them

Also mentioned a criminal investigation.

As the building is very unsafe in parts. Has to be made safe before many areas can be accessed. What is the point of more people getting hurt? Sure fire serive are working as quickly as possible.

As said above, the fire was huge and intense. Obviously the building needs to be safe but it is clear why some will remain in the tower.

No evidence that fire was started on purpose. But if any evidence of criminality, police are investigating.

You get the impression that they very much feel this event was criminal.

RedToothBrush

The conflict of interest is dreadful. How can you represent the interest of tenants if you are on the board of the body that tenants have a problem with?

I've nc so that I can comment on this, Red. I was a city councillor for many years and I was amazed at the organisations who requested that councillors sit on their boards and management committees. Often this was written into the organisations' constitutions.

These 'outside bodies' as they were called included residents' associations, tenants' groups, charities (who relied on the Council for funding) and many others. You are so right that it's a tradition riven with conflicts. I ended up on the board of a charity that my political group were looking at closely in terms of reducing funding, effectively closing it down. It was completely inappropriate - the charity saw me as their 'champion', but my political group weren't listening to what they saw as my 'special pleading' and 'bleeding stumps' arguments.

The political group in control would 'divvy out' the positions via its Cabinet. Games could be and were played with that. Keep the good ones, give the 'troublesome' ones to the opposition ...

Councillors are also appointed to Police panels and Fire Authorities.

You end up with one vote, a significant amount of responsibility, but very limited power. In many councils, I think, unless an individual councillor has the ear of the Leader, they get very little done. Even MPs get shut out sometimes - especially if they've previously been a councillor and there's 'history'.

They've been using drones and sniffer dogs - it's possible that the bodies have been located but are in areas where it isn't safe for at least two firefighters to stand.

I still can not believe a sprinkler system was in place

London has some of the most advanced buildings and to find the disparity in buildings so stark when it comes to lives mattering.

Those poor people

I think the queen coming was good

I think the conservatives are over - really over.

It seems likely that we will never know how many were in the building, there will be undocumented people, also people with no one to report them as missing, I think the true figure will be 100 to 150

The Queen showing up is a huge FU to TM. If there is ever a moment to be thankful for having a monarch this is it. Her visit was political in terms of sending a clear signal that she doesn't agree with the way the politicians are handling this.

You get the impression that they very much feel this event was criminal

I think he is referring to health and safety/ fire regulations that if found they have not being adeared to.

That's what I mean Witch. He was unequivocal that the start of the fire wasn't deliberate but also quite adamant about a criminal investigation.