AFTER THE PIT BULL THREAD ADVICE NEEDED DESPERATLY...

[kittylette]

i need advice,

BIL and SIL have a rotweiller/alsation cross, its huge,

theyve just had a baby son

weve told them the dangers (shouldnt have to really) but they sent a pic of the tiny baby lay across the front paws of the dog

i have two sons and havent visted them for 2 years because i wont allow them near the dog

in my pre-kids days the dog attacked me, tried to bite me BIL had to physically beat the dog to subdue it away from me,

its not a nice dog

im fear for the safety of my nephew

should i phone someone?

social serices?

i dont want to but how would i feel if something happened?

when you first meet the dog, you have to sit low down on the floor with your arms crossed and not give it eye contact

surely thats not right?

sjould a dog like that be near a bay?

they say is soft as anytning, its a big baby

THANKS FOR CARING SO MUCH GIRLS

THANKS FOR CARING SO MUCH GIRLS

That's alright, Kitty, we luv ya

Do let us know how the chat with DF and BIL went.

your right that SS are probably unlikely tp do anything. unless there have been reports that the dog has bitten people there is little they can do.

they can of course go round and visit and they would offer advice about keeping the dog away from teh baby, never leaving it alone in the room with him etc etc but thats all.

The RSPCA would require access to teh dog and if they had to go through the whole sit crossed legged and not look at him nonsense they could very easily describe the dog as a danger and then take steps....im no RSPCA officer but i do know they can ask you to sign the dog over to them or else get a removal order (its very similar to taking a child i think )

Basicly they are theones to call first of all as they are the animal experts.

Reading that they play with toys makes me more concerned not less. Often people play aggressive type tug of war games with their dogs. Not advisable if teh dogs is stronger than you ie it wins against you or if you have children. Our dogs have toys we throw for them and they play tug together. If they take something we want back off them we give them a treat in exchange for it. That way they associate having something taken off them as a good thing and have never had to defend something against us.

What happens when this child takes a toy from the dog or plays with the dogs toys. They have not brought it up to be around children. It is not safe.

Sorry but I find it a little bizarre that you are best friends with someone but you have not taken your kids round to their houes in 2 years. I respect my friends and if a best friend had to do this with me it would make me question myself as I respected that friend's judgement especially wth something that is life threatening.

I could never be best friends with a heavy smoker who had kids. Imagine it. I would never take my kids to her house as I would not want to expose them to the smoke. But at the same time I am saying the smoker is choosing to smoke with their own kids. How could a friendship like that work without some sort of resentment from one side?

However, the smoke isnt going to rip the kids to pieces.

Horrible decision for you but sometimes we have to make them. Noone else seems too concerned about the baby and I would find that hard to stomach. To some extent I would think was i really losing so much by losing those sort of people.

and I love dogs.

i have the same thoughts Nothercules.

I couldn't be friends with someone how was so completly irresponsible.
I was also alarmed at teh tug of war games...its just an accident waiting to happen.....no actually its not, this would be no accident. the parents have done all they could to MAKE the dog violant.

I'm sure the parents do love and care for their baby, but are failing to see the possible dangers here. Dare I say it, but perhaps ignorance plays a part. The parents of the baby don't know enough about dog behaviour etc. Tug of war games are generally never advised, as northercules mentioned. These sort of games can lead to aggression.

Hope it's going okay with your DF and BIL talking things through, Kitty. Will look out for an update.

she not just my best friend shes my SIL-its not that easy to break contact and i DONT WANT TO, i love her

shes a fabulous mummy, she just loves her dog so vey much shes failing to see what i do,

my DF isnt well today, he didnt go to work so couldnt go to his BILs

this is getting me down too much,

i want to protect my nephew, but hes not mine - hes theirs and i cant tell them how to raise their son

ive voiced my concerns, ive emailed her, DF is going to talk to his BIL, but thats all im going to do

i just hope they make the right descision, but i doubt they will

Kitty I have emailed you. Hope you are ok.

Did you send them the email I sent you? I could always send you another and say to you that I have been thinking about your dn and I am going to report the dog because I'm scared for your dn's safety?

Just another idea to get you out of this but also get the dog gone.

Am still trying to figure it out... don't worry we'll sort this somehow

Forgot to say, battersea emailed me back today and said that basically it's down to the owners to ring their training line etc. So that wasn't much help

How about copying and pasting this thread into word, deleting your stuff and some of the ruder things about them, and then showing it them? Don't tell them it's from Mumsnet, tell them it's from another site.

I think a drip drip drip approach might work.

I wonder if the kennel club has a forum?

I thought he was your DF's brother, not BIL?

Why did you start the thread if you were going to back out when it came to reporting the dog?

Not getting at you in any way as I understand you are in an awkward position here, but can you call her & ask if she has been checking her emails as she may not have got yours yet?

What I'm thinking the best thing is, whilst I understand that it is something that is better done sooner rather than later, Kitty doesn't mention it again. Let's them forget and then I will report it - say I've seen the dog in the street or something and am unsure of the breed. Ring the police, ask them to check it out, giving my name so that's nothing to do with Kitty. The police check it out, go to the house, have to do the no eye contact, crossed arms thing - which in itself will set alarm bells ringing.

Ok so it's not ideal to wait in an ideal world but if Kitty hadn't started this thread it would have been left anyway so a couple of weeks is better than nothing...?

it does.

I also think that showing them this thread would be good. it would show them the depth of feeling there is about this.

your taking this all personally and you shouldn't. we are all just really worried about your nephew and indeed your BIL/SIL. We know your doing what you can for now and just doing something is better than just ignoring this.

Do you live near them Zephyr?

Your last post sounded like a good idea, let it die down & then 'someone else' report it.

Kitty I hope your SIL doesn't know you post on here or she might be reading the thread...

I'm not sure where they are to be honest. It's the best thing I can think of though to get Kitty out of it but still do something. If not me then anyone who leaves close...

Good luck kittylette, Just read the thread and wanted to let you know I think you're fantastic for having the guts to try and do something about it.

Kittylette howsabout - you post the pic again (under a new name), saying how PROUD you are of this gorgeous wee babe (in arms of dog), giving us enough info in that post so that we can contact the local newspaper to download the photo and shame them into sorting themselves out. Meanwhile ask mn to delete this thread and ask them nicely if they'll allow local papers to pinch the photo. It won't be your fault - you were just posting a pic of a gorgeous babe!
Alternatively - give us the necessary info on this thread first - nearest local town.
We can then 'denounce YOU on that thread and the local paper has it's story. Just a thought. Must admit I've hardly been able to sleep since I saw the photo.
p.s. let us know the title of the new thread beforehand - e.g. look at my gorgeous nephew in the arms of this lovely dog who once had a go at me but now seems to be a reformed character.

hugs kitty........you are having a tough old time.x

Good idea cab

But isn't it a bit much for the papers to run a story??? I mean, Kitty will still be in trouble then for posting a pic on an internet forum!

fireflyfairy - you're probably right, and we would still need the info that the dog once 'attacked' someone. But can't see any other way round this. The rspca/ police probably wouldn't do anything anyway, kittylette's already saisd her piece and been ignored, so the only way I could see these folk taking action is if they were mortified into doing so by the local paper/ local folk. It would certainly make them think twice again before putting Travis (I think his name is) in the arms of the dog again. And they couldn't really blame kitty for posting a pic of her new nephew as a proud aunt - who under a lot of questioning admitted that the dog had once attacked her. The local paper of course might not be interested unless we really do have a story for them - and get mn's agreement to pinch the pic. Mmmm I don't know.

id really rather you didnt

ok

I still think that the whole 'report it' thing is a dead end though. The big difference with this dog and a pit bull is that pit bulls are illegal. Rotty cross German shepherds are not however dangerous unless they can be shown to be dangerous. There are thousands of homes with big dogs like this with small children. Nobody, not the RSPCA, police or anybody can march in and remove this dog unless it can be proved to be dangerous with reported injuries or attacks.

I think we need to be cleverer about this and think of ways Kitty can work on BIL and SIL without threatening legal stuff. What about finding the dog the offer of a kind experienced dog owning home with no children and suggesting this to BIL and SIL as in the best interest of the dog?; pointing out how the dog is losing out now the baby is there - not enough time to exercise it, need to keep home more hygienic, not fair on dog etc etc
These people sound as if they will respond more to arguments about what's best for the dog than what's best for the baby.