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Original poster

Mass sexual assaults in Cologne and other European cities part III

999 replies

GeekLove · 09/01/2016 19:05

link to part 2

Keeping this in the spotlight since the mainstream media isn't.

OP posts:
hiddenhome2 · 09/01/2016 22:19

The threads are discussing the male sexual violence within the context of what has just occurred in Cologne emily

Just because we're not referring directly to all male violence doesn't mean that we don't care about that as well.

Do we need to put dozens of disclaimers at the bottom of all our posts?

I am not a racist
I am not anti-immigration
I am aware that all nationalities of men commit sexual violence
I am aware that the police didn't do enough
I celebrate cultural diversity
I love black people
I love gay people
I love people in wheelchairs
Heck, I even love marmots!

Confused
LumelaMme · 09/01/2016 22:20

except I'd add that all cultures subjugate women but some quantitatively and qualitatively worse than others
Agreed, four. I have a G&T inside me, and am somewhat angry. [calm down dear emoticon]

I'd like to point out that, for example, Victorian England was worse, in this sense, than England now. This is not a racist thing to say.

venusinscorpio · 09/01/2016 22:20

emily

It's a commonly used phrase for a reason. This is a specific incident, we are all well aware of the problem of misogyny in society, thanks but all the evidence currently available suggests that these particular men responsible for this incident share a specific cultural background where women are commonly seen as lesser beings and have fewer rights in law. Are you seriously trying to argue that's not relevant?

polentapies · 09/01/2016 22:20

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

HelpfulChap · 09/01/2016 22:22

Slightly derailing. Anyone apart from me remember seeing WAVAW graffiti in North London in the 70s?

Women Against Violence Against Women.

Did I imagine it and what happened to them?

LumelaMme · 09/01/2016 22:23

Oh, polenta, I dunno.
Mark II winds me up more. Grin

misswans · 09/01/2016 22:23

you knew these people treat women in their country as sub-human, yet you were ok letting them in anyway? Logix

Justanotherlurker · 09/01/2016 22:24

Emily, I think the term of derailing is that you are jumping on obvious posts and trying to extrapolate that to everyone. Had you actually read the full 3 threads you would see that the most obvious racists points are being ignored (hope that's not the reason I'm being ignored) not only that but your displaying the type of mentality that is a current theme within this thread that any discussion within this field is jumped on.

emilybohemia · 09/01/2016 22:26

Lumela, I didn't say it offended me. I pointed out that highlighting all areas where safety of women is violated, not just the instances where they are violated by migrants, should be stressed to mps. There has been no mention o Christianity on this thread in regard to sex attackers, or on the other threads. The sole focus has been on Muslim sex attackers.

2016 is a new year, your not being offended on by what someone said because you are an immigrant has no bearing on the point I was making which is that immigration is supposedl not the focus of the thread. I have been accused of derailing but noone posting about immigration rather than paying attention to what to do about men attacking women has been accused of that.

There is a point in stating when someone is anti immigrant,particularly when they make poorly based assumptions and generalisations. I'm not interested in winning arguments, this isn't school or a debating society.

"

LumelaMme · 09/01/2016 22:28

WAWAW, yes, Helpful.
Maybe they should be dusted off...

misswans, you're generalising wildly. Seriously, it's not helpful

onthephone100 · 09/01/2016 22:29

The sole focus of this thread has NOT been Muslim attacks. It has been the cologne attacks and the specific nationalities involved.

There has been VERY little discussion of Islam or ANY religion.

RTFT

bluebolt · 09/01/2016 22:30

The difficulty I find is for other crimes the blame lies fully with the perpetrators. We do not find justifications, when 9/11 happened it was not ok because lots of American kill each other so why just single out the jihadis. These where crimes against women by a small percentage of men from Arab and North African background. This needs to stop, women are not the consequence for some greater good. i would equally be horrified whatever the background of attackers and condone them and not justify it with whataboutery.

misswans · 09/01/2016 22:30

Ok that was silly of me. Not EVERY man treats women as subhuman in these middle eastern countries. As a whole though they have less right due to men. Men are not fighting their cause by any stretch but surely people knew this? Why let them in in the first place? Prevention is the best cure surely

emilybohemia · 09/01/2016 22:30

Justanother, I have read the three previous threads. Unfortunately, the claim that racism does not dominate each thread is wrong. It is so normaland acceptable to so many of you that you are blind to it.

I'm displaying a mentality that you don't like on a public forum. I haven't insulted you or abused you. If you believe I have, report me. It's that simple.

onthephone100 · 09/01/2016 22:32

miss and Emily why don't you go and start your own thread? Then you can argue about immigration all you like Thanks

In the meantime, I'm going to bed.

hiddenhome2 · 09/01/2016 22:32

Tell you what emily you tell us what we're supposed to think, then we can get back to discussing what the thread is about.

Or

How about you start your own thread about Generic Male Violence and How Women Should Respond instead of getting yourself all hot and bothered because the question of immigration is so close to the surface when discussing the attacks in Cologne.

polentapies · 09/01/2016 22:32

Fucking rape/sexual assault deniers, I'm just bloody sick of them. Fuck off to the Guardian where you will have company

HelpfulChap · 09/01/2016 22:32

LumelaMme

Always thought it was a clever acronymn. It has stuck with me for 40yrs. Not many adverts do that.

hiddenhome2 · 09/01/2016 22:33

Can you clarify what racism is emily?

onthephone100 · 09/01/2016 22:33

bluebolt good point.

LumelaMme · 09/01/2016 22:33

I pointed out that highlighting all areas where safety of women is violated, not just the instances where they are violated by migrants, should be stressed to mps. There has been no mention o Christianity on this thread in regard to sex attackers, or on the other threads. The sole focus has been on Muslim sex attackers.
Emily, I'd prefer not to be told what I should write to my MP. Confused I'm intelligent, educated and reasonably well-informed, so I can probably make that little decision all by myself. Please don't patronise me.

We all know that women's safety is violated. Mine has been, in the past. But you haven't answered the point I made: that this is something new, unprecedented, and seems to be linked to men from a particular cultural background. Not to ALL men from that cultural background (I know some lovely Muslim men - do I really need to say this to you? Clearly I do, you think I am an ignorant idiot who needs help with letter writing) but SOME men. And it's worrying. It's new for modern Europe, and I really don't want it to become commonplace.

As a pp said, trying to deal with all violence against women in one go is bloody impossible.

Tamponlady · 09/01/2016 22:33

My disclaimer is that I am a black person

And even I can see that their is. A culture clash this is not about race it's about culture

I think the speed and number merkal invited in was always going to end badly didn't think this however didn't think it was going to end well

misswans · 09/01/2016 22:34

Seems Emily is the only one wanting to do something about this. Her anger shows and is justified. Better than sitting here like a limo-liberal having a whine

onthephone100 · 09/01/2016 22:35

miss I'm reporting that revolting little post

Justanotherlurker · 09/01/2016 22:35

The difference being Emily, is that there isn't victim blaming when catholic priests are found out to be sexually molesting people, there may have been a media cover up but if it where to happen in today's society we would not hesitate to highlight the issues inherrent in some Catholic cultures.

That is what this thread is about, an apparent taboo of trying to shine a light into a certain culture, and unfortunetly shining that light is heavily intertwined with the immigration debate.