Conservative Carswell defects to UKIP

[Isitmebut]

Modernizer Carwell won the new Clacton seat in 2010 with a large majority, heavily influenced by Ukip deciding not to stand a candidate themselves – so he has found a natural home with those that have a totally anti EU stance, but seems to forget that Ukip without a parliamentary majority cannot change British law to bring us out.

Claig …… after all your rants about right wing ‘modernizers’, you now own another one – so time for you to ‘jump’ the other way? lol

P.S. His defection was hardly cold, but by 1.30pm Wikipedia had been changed to reflect his defection. Who do you think was in a hurry to reflect his move, Ukip or the Conservatives? lol

Roger Lord has tweeted: "I challenge you @DouglasCarswell to a duel. I will have satisfaction at this outrage you and Nigel have schemed like thieves in the night."

I didn't read this claig when I posted. I was joking just now but that's almost exactly as he was coming over on TV. He just didn't use those words. How funny. His earpiece kept falling out too and he was barking. At the presenter. Probably barking in other ways.

BTW I'm from Essex too. Not as far east as it sounds you are. I agree with you that Carswell might win. As I said, I wouldn't vote for him as a Conservative or a UKIP candidate. But he sounds like a good constituency MP and someone of principles, even though I wouldn't agree with his politics.

And I am enjoying the show

Isitmebut

Im frankly amazed that you find my statement that Ukip could not take the UK out of the EU so relavatory.

Anyone with a remote interest in politics knows that the PM in the UK does not act by Presidential decree and therefore in order to hold a referendum legislation has to be put before Parliament and the vote carried. The only way that can happen is a) the Governing party initiates such a proposal or b) it could be initiated via a private members bill.

So youre saying Vote Conservative as they are the only party that will give you a referendum. In effect that is the Conservatives Unique Selling Point (USP). I wonder what would happen to that USP if Labour decided to also offer a referendum?

But thats an aside.

So in order to get this referendum Dave has to achieve an outright majority very unlikely.

Lets suppose he does. The new Parlimanet will sit from May 15 the proposed referendum is in 2017. 2 years to persuade the EU to grant the UK .

But lets suspend reality and actually belief that Dave can persuade our EU partners to agree the changes he requires. Some of those changes will require ratification by the other menbers Parliaments, especially if the change that Dave wants is quite radical (and I hope it is radical). So from the end of negoaitions with the EU to actually getting those changes agree will probably take another 2 or so years based on past treaty amendments as the other menbers Parliaments are not just sitting there waiting to rubber-stamp whatever Dave wants.

So the referendum in 2017 will be asking the UK electorate to decide IN / OUT based on woolley proises from Dave that hes secured agreement to a shed load of EU changes that the other EU members are under no legal obligation to deliver (as the changes are still waiting ratification by their domestic Parliamnets).

What then delay the referendum until all EU members have ratified those changes? Say until 2019? Hes got a good excuse to do that.

Or hold the referendum in 2017 based on woolly promises that he cant deliver but that doesnt really matter because by the time the electorate wake up to the fact that the other EU members wont grant us Daves amendments its now 2019 and guess what its General Election time again folks.

So Dave has managed to keep a lid on the whole EU debacle for yet another Parliamentary term

Probably long enough for the EU to have done even more damage to our country and by which time, based on current net immigration figures, we will have built another 5 cities the size of Southampton to accommodate all the incomers.

So you can see that a vote for the Conservatives is actually a vote for the status quo. Nothing will happen. No action will be taken.

A vote for UKIP is a conviction vote. They are not going to win the next GE. They will not hold the balance of power. They will be very lucky to get even 1 MP elected. But they exist, they are growing, people are waking up to the EU issue and Nigel is no longer considered a loon by the mainstream media.

The Tories / Lab / Lib can continue to call it a protest vote but all that will do is further infuriate those who really do think that a major change in our relationship with Europe is long overdue. But when even Daves own MPs dont believe that the Conservatives can effect that change there is no point in voting Conservative.

Boundary changes were denied to the Conservatives by their Liberal coalition. Yet another of the Lib promises that they reneged on. If Cameron really had balls he would have made this a resigning point and watched scardy Claggy poop his pants at the thought of an early election if Lib failed to agree. But he didnt so hes automatically entering the next election with lower prospects than he could have expected had those boundary changes taken place. And all that Claggy managed to achieve over that was to save his weedy little neck for a further year or so until the next election.

I have been very disappointed at the way that Dave has let the Liberals walk all over him.

WetAugust ..... clearly a lot of 'gloop', to turn the page on the FACTS on the other side you don't want to face, so I'll prepare a Ukip Fact Sheet to remind everyone every now and then what a wasted vote Ukip is.

a quick scan shows that you are STILL having problems working out a very clear Conservative policy on the EU, which is the ONLY way 'the people' will have a say on the EU.

Firstly, politicians do not decide Referendums, the people do, and it's important you understand that, as clueless Farage would promise a SHED LOAD of them, rather than lead and make a decision.

“UKIP backs direct democracy and use of referendums”
www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-27973093

"Nigel Farage has said UKIP wants to give people direct democracy - with referendums to decide some policy."

Secondly, there is nothing 'woolly' about offering a Referendum in a 2015 manifesto, that if did NOT happen, would guarantee to bind the UK to a stagnant, bureaucratic and uncompetitive Eurozone block, similar to the 2010 economy they inherited - with the added disadvantage of a one currency/interest rate fits all disaster, when the UK alone should think about two base rates, north and south.

Thirdly,- only with a Conservative majority, the Referendum happens, whether Cameron gains concessions or not - so with NO concessions, it is even more urgent we have the OPTION to leave._

On a vote Farage 2015, get Miliband, there is no chance of leaving the EU.

limitedperiodonly, it is going to be a very good show. The papers and the metropolitan elite's media will try all the tricks in the book to try and save Dave and fool the public, but it won't work because you and I both know Essex and we can run rings around the Bullingdon Club and all their PPEs.

'It seems that people just want to deliver a massive FUCK YOU to the main parties.'

No it is much more serious than that. People wouldn't turn out to vote just for a FUCK YOU, usually absentions are FUCK YOUs. This is the first step towards real change, to getting rid of these "game players", these "jokers", these "clowns" who con us and cheat us and don't listen to us, care for us or serve us. We all want something new, a party of normal, ordinary people who have our concerns at heart and who understand and empathise with us - not this privileged elite of luvvies who call us swivel-eyed loons.

We want people who are principled, people who have morals, people who are not puppets at the command of corporate profiteers and EU bureaucrats, people who serve the people not lobbyists and themselves.

It's a start, it's important because it affects all our lives, our health service and all our other services. The people are sovereign, the puppets serve us not EU corporate banking masters or global oil company barons. This country's parliament is our parliament, it serves us, not puppets who dance to the whim of corporations or puppet EU bureaucrats who work for banking interests.

The people have woken up because scandal and after scandal has roused them from their slumber. We want a people's party, we want our voice heard, we want a party that will change and adapt to what we want, we want a party that will grow as we grow and change as we change. We want UKIP.

And direct democracy is the thing that will implement our wishes and stop the metropolitan elite and all their chums in their tracks, because it will be the people's voice that counts, not the media's, not the luvvies' and not the PPEs'.

All of their spin can't beat common sense, and that is what the people and the people's party have in spades. Common sense will win and the common people will win and we will implement the common will. It's democracy and direct democracy will deliver it.

Look at Rotherham. What a scandal and still many people have escaped justice. How is this allowed to happen, how are they allowed to escape justice for letting down more than a thousand children and all their parents? Inquiry after inquiry and only a handful in jail.

Something is wrong.

'I'm listening to Roger Lord right now throwing down the gauntlet to Douglas Carswell. 'I'm still the candidate for Clacton. Choose your weapons, cad.'

And Roger Lord seems like a great guy. He won't win this, but he has spirit, he is independent, just like all of us, and he is no puppet, that is why he is objecting. I hope he finds somewhere else to stand. We need people like him because he is one of us and he will eventually do right by us.

UKIP is full of amateurs, ordinary people, people who actually care, not just professional spinners and PPEs. And that is why UKIP has great potential, because it is free and not easily controlled and will therefore represent the ordinary public who are the real backbone of those country.

Claig .... ha ha ha still with the 'Metropolitan Elite, please get back on Mr Wheeler, mentioned on the last page running the Ukip show.

E,g as seen on Sky this afternoon

Stuart Wheeler (born 30 January 1935) is a British businessman and politician. He made his fortune as the founder of the spread betting firm IG Index in 1974, but is best known for his political activism, being formerly a major donor to the Conservative Party and, since 2011, treasurer of the United Kingdom Independence Party.”
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stuart_Wheeler

And what does such a rich mover and shaker within UKIP, pulling all the strings OFFER THE WOMEN of Clacton?

“UKIP Treasurer Stuart Wheeler's comment 'was sexist'”
www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-23717804
“Stuart Wheeler has denied being sexist by saying women were "nowhere near as good as men" at games like chess, bridge and poker.”

“Mr Wheeler said he had been explaining why companies should not be forced to appoint more women to their boards”

How does this person 'sit' with you, having denied you had 'any'??????

*In other words, all parties hav 'em, don't be a hypocrite and pretend Ukip is any different, other than having a party of no government experience, no policies and will guarantee pro EU Miliband gets back?

Yes, Farage was a city trader, rather a pleasant change to have a party leader that's held down a proper job and understands the economy.

Farage was a city trader, speculating in commodities like the oil price, who in an F.T. interview, said he drank, smoked and gambled too much.

Mr Wheeler is another matter, as a Spread Betting man, he and Farage are running the show.

Both men of the people(?), as we DO have a drink, gambling culture - maybe we'll have twice as many betting shops on the High Street and 24-hour drinking, for populist votes?

OK, Stuart Wheeler went to Eton - so what? So did George Orwell.

That doesn't matter. What matters is who they serve? Do they serve the people or the corporates? Are they in favour of direct democracy and referenda where the power is given to the people to decide even if it goes against their beliefs or not?

Wheeler is one of those, just like working class millioanire Paul Sykes who wants power and sovereignty given to the people and not to an unelected bureaucratoc class of puppets who do what global bankers and oligarchs tell them to do.

Most UKIP voters, like most Labour voters, want the railways and the Royal Mail to be in public ownership. Labour will never do it, because they are PPE puppets, but even if Farage disagrees, there is a chance that UKIP will do it via direct democracy.

Give power back to the people, let them decide. That is what terrifies the other parties and the Bullingdon Club.

' who in an F.T. interview, said he drank, smoked and gambled too much'

So, he's an ordinary person and won't lecture us like the luvvies do. Great.

I would take a long hard look those who have been Conserbative party donors over the years before picking on Wheeler. Some of them are now criminals.

You really are having to stoop very low by attacking the party's donors.

And TBH a lot of your posts Isitmebut are totally unreadable as the font, bold and highlight that you're so fond of (i.e. the internet equivalent of the Green Ink Brigade) does not translate very well to Tablets. In fact your posts are pretty illegible on a tablet.

Claig .... please get my point, on this thread you talk about the 'elite' and 'money men' driving the other parties, which was why Ukip was different.

Mr Carswell appears to have taken Mr Wheelers 'shilling', for 'big wheel' status.

The UK only now recovering is not the time for rank novices who assume being dim will help them run the country with all the problems it has, when from 1997 to 2010 we had a mixed of PPE's and dim MPs (Prescott) that got us into the shite - with no answers in a 2010 manifesto to get us out other than the fat state policies of France.

I keep reminding you, the Bullingdon Boys were not in THAT government, they are in the one GETTING US OUT of the mess - in a party that got the economy out of the crapper in 1979, and again in 2010.

FYI this is what will be at risk

“IMF forecasts UK to be fastest-growing advanced economy in 2014”
www.ft.com/cms/s/0/5f5ba3ca-132e-11e4-8244-00144feabdc0.html

“Eurozone growth at ZERO as gemany slumps, France stagnates"
www.dw.de/eurozone-growth-at-zero-as-germany-slumps-france-stagnates/a-17854222

wetAugust ...... frankly just getting peed off with Claigs rants/lectures, which was either through ignorance or ....something else.

'Glass houses rules', please.

Mr Wheeler is fair game as your Treasurer and also appearing on the news as THE ONE having chats in Mayfair with Conservative MP's, not Farage, your glorious leader.

P.S. If unreadable on tablets, so be it, but your question marks on this site does nothing for me either.

UKIP are pro business, pro enterprise. Unlike the Tories, they will scrap all the EU socialist green regulations that hamstring business and they wil stop subsidies to inefficient windfarms by hardworking people that subsidise the estates of the landed gentry and royalty. They will cut taxes, scrap the bedroom tax and take minimum wage payers out of taxation. They will invigorate free enterprise and cut some of the councillors and climate change coordinators that are paid for by the hardworking people.

UKIP are for ordinary people anf they will implement real social mobility and meritocracy where a clever poor child will go to a grammar school and outperform the Tim Dim But Nices in the Tory Cabinet who were given a headstart due to money.

Essex voted for Thatcher and it will now vote for UKIP, because both offered opportunity, aspiration and hope to ordinary working people unlike all the PPE parties who stifled growth, held good people down and lectured them in a nanny state while siphoning off their taxpayer money to third sector charidees stuffed full of failed politicians and croneys.

Yes, I've noticed the question marks too. I think there's some sort of software problem on this site with Win 7 and IE9. It comes and goes.

Actually it's not my party or my website and Nigel is not my leader, as I am not a member of UKIP.

Which should make you worry as the real UKIP members are even more passionate about their party's policies than I am.

Scary thought. ;)

While Dave highfives Juncker, Farage will fight to scrap all the EU regulations that are a burden on ordinary people.

THAT is "scary", as they haven't really got any on major to discuss, which is why you get 'metropolitan elite', 'different', 'change', 'class' etc etc etc rollox - so I can't wait to see how long it takes for a bright Mr Carswell to 'dumb down'. lol

FYI I may be a 'member', but I'm NOT a Member of anyone, but I have 'kin concerns for the future of this country and dread what WILL happen in 2015, due to people treating politics - and the future direction of this country for us, our children, and our childrens children - as a game.

Little wheels, want to be big Wheelers, with power - and don't give a flying what the fall-out is.IMO.

Claig you do sound a little swivel-eyed as it happens. You are going round in circles with statements that don't mean anything. Direct democracy would never work, no sensible person would suggest voting on all policy. Rotherham? What would UKIP in power have done to change that? How would UKIP have prevented it? Just to add I don't think that those being named and shamed were PPE/Bullingdon/Luvvies.

What I mean by a big 'fuck you' is people wanting to stick it to the main parties. This is a motivation of some UKIP voters. I disagree that most people protest voting would abstain, my opinion is that they would be the most likely to bother to vote!

As it happens I went to Oxford and did PPE and live in London. I'm probably a bit of a luvvie too. In the interests of full discLosure;-)

Claig ..... re your last statement, which could easily have come from the Tooting Popular Front, please explain how, as if not possible with a 'stuff' of Ukip Euro MPs by now, what is his new (populist aimed/sounds good) plan - that gets it 'passed' by 28 countries so stupid they haven't done it already?????

Do you go round with your eyes shut? Don't you listen to what the public are saying? Didn't you notice that UKIP caused an earthquake in the EU elections?

Don't you realise that these clowns in power do not represent ordinary people, that a great part of the cabinet come from Eton and lots of them are millionaires? Don't you ask why UKIP are so popular and why Clacton will vote UKIP and not Tory and why they will overturn a 12000 Tory majority?

'treating politics - and the future direction of this country for us, our children, and our childrens children - as a game'

But that is why Carswell left the Tory Party, he said he wanted an end to the 'game'.

'Politics to them is about politicians like them. It is a game, a game of spin, position'

'that gets it 'passed' by 28 countries so stupid they haven't done it already'

Because UKIP are going to hold the balance of power and they will eventually challenge the EU bureaucrats, call their bluff and their masters bluff and get us out. There will be no highfiving, no ducking and diving, we will just start the process of restoring sovereignty to the people.

I understand your despondency because highfivingCameron can change nothing, but the people of Clacton will show the way, they will vote UKIP and the EU has had its day.

'As it happens I went to Oxford and did PPE and live in London. I'm probably a bit of a luvvie too. In the interests of full discLosure;-)'

That explains why you are against the People's Party

'Direct democracy would never work, no sensible person would suggest voting on all policy.'

No PPE would suggest it, but UKIP, Party of the People, have suggested and will do it.

'Rotherham? What would UKIP in power have done to change that? How would UKIP have prevented it? Just to add I don't think that those being named and shamed were PPE/Bullingdon/Luvvies.'

This is the statement of UKIP Parliamentray candidate in Rotherham. It occurred under a Labour council. What have Labour said about it?

“Speaking primarily as a mother, the details of the abuse and violence outlined in Professor Alexis Jay’s report, shocks me to my core. The very thought of the abuse these children suffered is profoundly distressing, and we owe it to the victims to take immediate action on this issue.”

“How the Chief Executive of Rotherham Council, Martin Kimber, can sit there and glibly tell the world that not one person has been sacked, nor disciplined regarding this matter is beyond me.

"We are talking about children as young as 11 being trafficked, gang raped, beaten, plied with alcohol and drugs, and even threaten with being burned alive. My outrage at these events is simply beyond words!”

“There has been three previous reports commissioned and it’s taken a fourth before anything has happened.”

“This is the same council that in 2012, persecuted and ruined the lives of a foster couple who were providing a good, stable home to foster children, simply because they were members of UKIP.

"At the same time, the very same people leading this persecution of these good and law abiding people, were harbouring and enabling Pakistani and Kashmiri paedophiles to commit the most heinous crimes against our kids. The whole situation is simply outrageous and apologies are not enough in this case!”

“I categorically call for the resignation of everyone directly and indirectly involved in this case. The Labour Council stand accused of deliberately ignoring child sex abuse victims for 16 years. The apologies we have heard are totally insincere and go nowhere near repairing the damage done.

"These resignations should include South Yorkshire’s Police and Crime Commissioner, Shaun Wright who until his election into the PPC post, held responsible positions with Rotherham council. I also call for a criminal investigation by a force not directly linked with this scandal in to all those implicated in this scandal. There is no place for these people in public life."

www.ukip.org/ukip_s_jane_collins_mep_comments_on_rotherham_child_sexual_exploitation_report