Conservative Carswell defects to UKIP

[Isitmebut]

Modernizer Carwell won the new Clacton seat in 2010 with a large majority, heavily influenced by Ukip deciding not to stand a candidate themselves – so he has found a natural home with those that have a totally anti EU stance, but seems to forget that Ukip without a parliamentary majority cannot change British law to bring us out.

Claig …… after all your rants about right wing ‘modernizers’, you now own another one – so time for you to ‘jump’ the other way? lol

P.S. His defection was hardly cold, but by 1.30pm Wikipedia had been changed to reflect his defection. Who do you think was in a hurry to reflect his move, Ukip or the Conservatives? lol

Not a joke Panda. If you guys want independence, I'm all for it :) EIP would clean up. It appears you don't need policies anymore, just a few bullet points should suffice.

Essex is amazing (I say this as a UKIP hater) so it would be a loss imo. Getting rid of the UKIP supporters, I'd be all for

Samuel Johnson actually said

"After you've been to Essex, you are tired of life"

He was known to be a bit of a joker. Friends at the time often said that his utterances when under the influence of alcohol should not be taken seriously.

Strange, no mention of Roger Lord and how feels about this on here?

As a compromise, maybe we could herd all the ukippers onto Canvey and then blow the bridge?

Roger Lord has tweeted

"I challenge you @DouglasCarswell to a duel. I will have satisfaction at this outrage you and Nigel have schemed like thieves in the night."

There is no need for that kind of talk, this is not the Conservative Party or the Bullingdon Club, this is the People's Party and disputes should be settled amicably over a pint.

Deal, ina!

Tomorrow's Daily Mail headline

'8 more Tories in UKIP talks'

I hope they are all in Essex. We'll put UKIP in.

Claig - let's see! Who are these eight nameless Tories?! Bet they won't be named....

One thing is for sure, nobody is talking about Labour.

Ed Milliband is the fall guy, they know they can't win, they are hanging about till people are fed up with the Tories again. Then they will bring back david miliband.

No they won't be named. The BBC reckon there may only be 1 in talks. I think the Mail is reporting that Farage may even be speaking to some Labour MPs. Not sure if that is true.

Ed Milliband is not the fall guy. He will win next year. Maybe in coalition. But he will win.

Sorry but NO WAY anybody defects from labour to UKIP.

And David Miliband won't come back in the next ten years at least, especially as Blair's wrongdoings become more known.

Mr Farage seems as ’onest with those in his own party, as he is with the electorate.

Is this the 'leader of men' who can tackle UK unemployment, when he can’t even bother to tackle the issue of the UKIP Clacton candidate he’d P-45ed?

“Douglas Carswell defection: Clacton’s existing Ukip candidate vows to fight on regardless”

www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/douglas-carswell-defection-clactons-existing-ukip-candidate-vows-to-fight-on-regardless-9697920.html

"While the defection of Clacton’s Tory MP was being celebrated by Ukip’s leadership in London today, there were some back in the seaside town who were less enthusiastic."

"Ukip’s current candidate for one. Roger Lord, who was preparing to take on Douglas Carswell as a Conservative in next year’s general election, is now warning that he will challenge the former MP for the right to represent Ukip in the forthcoming by-election."

“As far as I’m concerned I’m carrying on,” he told Buzzfeed, the internet news site.

Ukip Clacton won’t just split the Conservative vote, but the Ukip vote as well. lol

Personally if voting for Ukip I’d vote for Mr Lord, as everything Mr Carsewell says is now wrong with the Conservative’s policy on the EU, he has been campaigning vigorously on until recently e.g. Ukip cannot bring the UK out of the EU.

Still Claig tells us he KNEW he was going to lose his Conservative MP salary at the next election so although I don’t know Mr Lord, I’d suggest Mr Lord has more integrity in his pinkie than Mr Carswell.

the rise of UKIP and the defection to that party of A Conservative MP was the inevitable conclusion of The Tories attempts to keep the EU issue bottled up. They should know by now that they cannot stifle EU debate forever.

What interests me us why the rise in UKIP is taking place now. It can't be a public reaction to the MPs expenses scandal, as we've had a GE since then and UKIP did not do well in that election, Also, until recently all 3 major parties have managed to successfully portray UKIP supporters as fruit cakes and Nigel as Chief Loon. So, apart from the residual effect of doing well in the Euro elections, which was foreseen, why the rise in UKIP fortunes in domestic politics? Is this just another SDP moment that will fizzle out or is a sustainable change taking part in UK domestic politics and, if so, what was the exact thing that has aroused the sleeping electorate?

WetAugust ….. remembering Mr Brown signed the Lisbon Treaty that finally put us into the EU without the debate Labour used to promise before elections, far from being “bottled up”, the Conservative position could not be clearer; the 2015 Conservative manifesto will guarantee (if they get a majority) a 2017 EU Referendum, for the people to decide, AFTER Cameron with ‘the peoples mandate’, attempts to get major reforms from the EU.

Cameron said he would resign if a Conservative majority government did not manage the in/out Referendum.

And it is worth noting that a Conservative government in THIS parliament could not have legislated for an EU Referendum as thanks to Ukip votes in 2010 (on a manifesto they were to ditch as “drivel”), they cost the Conservatives a small Commons majority and put them into a coalition with an even more pro EU party than Labour.

Re the rise of UKIP, you really don’t believe that it has anything to do with the electorate believing is ‘different’ and CAN BRING THE UK OUT OF THE EU, which is a bare faced lie? Which is ‘different’, as 100% of the policy you stand on is a lie – which must be a global political record, including South America. Lol

Ukip voters need a 326 seat majority in parliament to begin to take the UK out of the EU and their immigration laws – so when would you say that might happen, 2025?

Meanwhile Ukip don’t mind, ensuring we CANNOT LEAVE THE EU, they get MEP salary of £78,000 annual salary + Daily attendance Allowance + Staff Costs + £3,500 a month allowance paid into their personal bank account whether claimed or not.

Ukip integrity DESERVES Mr Carswell, worried he'd lose his Conservative MP salary. IMO

More from Carswell

‘Parliament is supine, spineless, dominated by spivery and spivs, it doesn’t hold the Government to account,’ he said in an interview. ‘Our primary function is to provide the cheerleader chorus for the frontbench. Parliament is one giant conspiracy against the electorate.’

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2737231/The-maverick-mutineer-plotting-year-Douglas-Carswells-defection-biggest-political-surprise-years.html

This man hasn't got an ounce of spin in his bones. If he carries on like this, the people of Essex will grant him the biggest landslide in parliamentary history.

The modernisers are stunned, like rabbits in the headlights. They thought it was all in the bag, but now things are not looking so bright. They're fussing and fighting, having sleepless nights because the people of Essex have got 'em bang to rights.

Phones are ringing, texts are pinging, canaries are singing, the truth is stinging, bells of doom are ringing, it's all looking mighty minging.

The best minds from Oxbridge, Eton and Belgravia are being consulted, luvvies no longer feel exulted, what on earth can they do? They can't believe that it's all coming true, the people of Essex will vote for the many, not the few.

'Ukip integrity DESERVES Mr Carswell, worried he'd lose his Conservative MP salary.'

You cannot blame a man for reading the writing on the wall. Only a fool would keeping digging a hole. He saw which way the wind did blow, he heard the Essex people say "No", he had only one way left to go. From the praise he has received from his colleagues, the man sounds like a gem, he's not guilty and it would be wrong to condemn, he just realised if you can't beat 'em, you've got to join 'em.

UKIP has never said that they COULD bring the Uk out of the EU! All UKIP has said is that as a party it believes the UK would be better off out of the EU and is campaigning for they UK to leVe the EU. UKIP knows that can only happen if the party in power crosses to enact the legislation that permits the UK to leave the EU

So stop spreading the nonsense that UKIP is PROMISING something it cannot deliver. That is a Tory lie.

And the more the Tories lie the more desperate they seem to appear.

Dave may have promised to resign if he can't deliver an IN OU referendum

That assumes that a) his party wins the next Election and b) that Dave is their leader, as this is being portrayed as a personal commitment. The Tories may have ditched him as leader. Their next leader will not be bound by Dave's promise

Also let's be sensible. Suppose there is a hung Parliament and Dave, as leader of the largest Parliamentary party decides to struggle on as a minority GOvt. He then moves a bill for a referendum. Without. Parliamentary majority that bill fails. Dave, being a man of integrity has to tell Liz he wants to resign s PM as he cannot deliver his IN OUT referendum. Liz tells Dave to stay and run the country.

So 5 more years of Tory govt and no referendum.

A bit like the last 5 years, during which Dave has happily handed yet more power to the EU and been humiliated over the Junckers issue. Oh yes, Dave is really effective.

WetAugust …… Re your ”UKIP has never said that they COULD bring the Uk out of the EU! All UKIP has said is that as a party it believes the UK would be better off out of the EU and is campaigning for they UK to leVe the EU. UKIP knows that can only happen if the party in power crosses to enact the legislation that permits the UK to leave the EU.

Thank you for the first accurate U-kipper statement on this board, that Ukip CANNOT bring the Uk out of the EU, and therefore by definition, influence EU immigration policy, even having put at great taxpayer expense, a gaggle of Ukip non attendees MEP’s in the European parliament having a hoot.

But WHY do you think the electorate thinks Ukip can?

Surely after every Farage speech, on your website, on every one of Ukip’s electoral leaflets, Ukip issues a political health notice ‘WARNING; ‘Ukip cannot bring the UK out of the EU’ – as if not, Ukip’s rousing anti EU messages are disingenuous at best – especially as in the pursuit of naked power in Westminster, UKip takes votes away from the Conservative Party Ukip than can.

And therefore there is a Ukip integrity issue, which cannot be denied, as evidenced by Ukips recent Constituency Target List, the majority by far being Conservative – so what happened to the ‘target Labour’ campaign, which is why Farage ditched his 2010 General Election aimed at the Conservatives, once he had their votes?

Yet you have the NATIONAL FRONT to call ME a liar, KNOWING Ukip cannot deliver to the voters their ONE policy, while coming up with your ‘no Conservative EU Referendum’, which makes no sense on core UK Conservative policy grounds whatsoever?

Lets start with the Ukip damage in the General Election of 2010, where Ukip campaigned on a platform of “drivel” (Mr Farages quote) – the ONLY REASON a EU Referendum cannot be scheduled/enacted THIS parliament, is due to Ukip pretending that THEY can bring us out of the EU
www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/ukip/7693877/General-Election-2010-Ukip-challenge-cost-Tories-a-Commons-majority.html

• A Conservative General Election manifesto pledge for an EU Referendum CAN ONLY happen if there is a Conservative majority, as how else will they get it through parliament with another Lib Dem coalition – as explained above????? Duh.

• Under a 2015 Labour government (likely thanks to the electoral boundary lines and Ukip), with or without the Lib Dem’s, it will ENSURE that the UK has a pro EU administration for another 5, 10 years, possibly more, ‘the people’ will not get a ‘both sides’ debate, and THEIR say at the end of it.

Conclusion; The pro EU Labour and the Lib Dems, unlikely to change the electoral boundary lines and relying on Ukip to take Conservative votes, will remain in power for a decade or more, and Farages gob and false promises will be as useful as the last 20-years, in bringing us out of an ever federalizing EU and everything that brings.

Claig ….. Re your Mr Carswell “hasn’t got an ounce of spin in his bones”, then what HAS he got, as many are asking WHY join a Ukip with no legislative chance to influence EU/immigration, or UK domestic policies worth a flip flopping light?

I’d suggest in danger of losing his seat, Carswell has ‘taken ‘the UKIP Shilling’, and been promised all sorts by Ukip’s rich backers (you accuse other parties of having), who has promised Carswell that he will go from being ‘a little cog, in a big wheel’, to ‘a big cog, in a little wheel’ – or should I say Wheeler , who seeing Ukip have nothing to offer the Uk electorate in 2015, has gambled that gaining ONE parliamentary seat will regain Ukip momentum WITHIN THE MEDIA, to relauch a 2015 campaign.

But WHO could be that ‘gamble’ devious, WHO could finance it as you tell me Ukip has no rich backers INFLUENCING their policies, and WHO could invite several Conservative MP’s to a meal in a Mayfair restaurant for “talks” (like the new football season), Ukip is bragging about?

*I’m guessing an ex-Tory donor, in the betting business, now a ‘big Wheeler’ in UKIP. lol

“ Stuart Wheeler (born 30 January 1935) is a British businessman and politician. He made his fortune as the founder of the spread betting firm IG Index in 1974, but is best known for his political activism, being formerly a major donor to the Conservative Party and, since 2011, treasurer of the United Kingdom Independence Party.”
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stuart_Wheeler

And what does such a rich mover and shaker within UKIP, pulling all the strings OFFER THE WOMEN of Clacton?

“UKIP Treasurer Stuart Wheeler's comment 'was sexist'”
www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-23717804

“Stuart Wheeler has denied being sexist by saying women were "nowhere near as good as men" at games like chess, bridge and poker."

“Mr Wheeler said he had been explaining why companies should not be forced to appoint more women to their boards”

Claig i still can't fathom what you thinK UKIP can bring about, only that you think they are t modernisers/Etonians/Oxbridge/Bullingdon types. Nigel Farage was a city trader by the way, not quite man of the people. Hopefully labour and lib dem voters will vote tactically to minimise the chances of UKIPtakibg Clacton but I dare say they may just manage to take it. I almost hope they do. As with UKIP MEPs who were USELESS and simply enjoying the gravy train of Europe they claim to despise, it will be good for you to seeking how useless aUKIP MP is.

UKIP bang on about immigration. Immigration from the EU cannot be controlled/capped, so UKIP can't change that. Asylum/human rights claims cannot be capped and in any case the Home Office is so brutal that most claims are refused. Other immigration has been massively curtailed, such as income requirements for spouses, limiting international students' right to work in the country after completing degrees, making it much harder for employers to employ nonEU people. Apart from Tier 4/very highly skilled/very wealthy/entrepreneurs it is very difficult to stay in the UK.
SO what more would/could UKIP do?

It seems that people just want to deliver a massive FUCK YOU to the main parties. Fair enough, but let's not kid ourselves that this is about changing anything.

Sorry to intrude on private grief but hahahahhahahahahahahaha

I'm listening to Roger Lord right now throwing down the gauntlet to Douglas Carswell. 'I'm still the candidate for Clacton. Choose your weapons, cad.'

I found Carswell's stance in standing down and forcing a by election rather noble. Much more principled than Sean Woodward. I do think his principled stand puts other would-be defectors who aren't such popular constituency MPs in a bit of a bind, but that's their problem, not his.

He might win. And I have a sneaking admiration for Nigel. Wouldn't vote for him or his party in a million years but I do like the way he's sticking it to Dave.

I adored that 11am press conference yesterday. I'd have loved to have been the person who knocked on his door and said: 'Excuse me Prime Minister. You might want to stop watching re-runs of Modern Family and turn on the news. And you should take off that wetsuit now. It does you no favours.'

I'm quite sobered by the knowledge that both Douglas Carswell and Nigel Farage are younger than me.

FFS, I'd put Douglas Carswell in the same vintage as Douglas Hurd.

I must have reverse body dysmorphia. When I look in the mirror I see someone of about 23 - 24 tops and I'm sticking to it.