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Conservative Carswell defects to UKIP

999 replies

Isitmebut · 28/08/2014 13:46

Modernizer Carwell won the new Clacton seat in 2010 with a large majority, heavily influenced by Ukip deciding not to stand a candidate themselves – so he has found a natural home with those that have a totally anti EU stance, but seems to forget that Ukip without a parliamentary majority cannot change British law to bring us out.

Claig …… after all your rants about right wing ‘modernizers’, you now own another one – so time for you to ‘jump’ the other way? lol

P.S. His defection was hardly cold, but by 1.30pm Wikipedia had been changed to reflect his defection. Who do you think was in a hurry to reflect his move, Ukip or the Conservatives? lol

OP posts:
claig · 02/10/2014 16:05

You don't understand. People don't vote because their local MP is in favour with the elite and might get some crumbs from their table, they don't vote for new roundabouts and traffic lights, they vote for change throughout the whole country, they vote for others, not just themselves. They vote to put things right, not for a new swimming pool or windfarm. They don't care what clout their MP has, they vote for the clout that the people have.

Don't believe the media spin that people are voting Carswell because he is a jolly good chap, they are voting Carswell because he is UKIP and all that that represents.

They are not voting for chums of the elite who can press the right buttons, they are voting for change. And it will be the same everywhere else and that is how change occurs, when everyone has had enough.

Isitmebut · 02/10/2014 16:20

Claig ... you clearly make your 'stuff' up as you go along, despite the facts.

Re " they are only voting for Carswell because he is Ukip and all that represents" - based on the General Election results in 2010, you could not look more stupid.

Re Clacton 2010 General Election, here were the approximate results, with Labour having totally screwed up, so can be expected to poll higher 4-years later and BENEFIT FROM A SPLIT CONSERVATIVE/VOTE.

Conservatives 21,000

Labour 11,000

Lib Dem 6,000

Ukip Zero – as a whoosy no show.

They are voting for Carswell who within a Conservative led coalition, had influence, credibility, and worked hard for his constituency - Ukip are buying the man, not his Conservative 'Westminster elite' credability - please get over it.

OP posts:
claig · 02/10/2014 16:26

I am an ordinary voter, I don't even know who my MP is and I don't care, I vote for the party that they are part of because of what that party stands for and its policies and principles. That is what most people do. Most people have never attended an MP's surgery and never will. They vote based on principle and for what they think is right.

If Carswell had stood for the Conservatives in Clacton, I think he would have lost to an unknown UKIP candidate, because people don't vote for jolly nice Carswell, they vote for parties, policies and principles, just as they did in the Euro elections when UKIP caused an earthquake.

claig · 02/10/2014 16:33

'based on the General Election results in 2010'

But everything has changed. I voted Conservative in 2010, but not anymore, and I am only doing what millions of others will also do.

'“I’ve voted Labour all my life and never, ever again,” said one angry woman. “We have been utterly deserted up here."

This is being replicated all over the country. Things have changed in a few short years, people have had enough. That is why there is an earthquake, that is why the luvvies have travelled to Clacton and that is why it will be the biggest landslide in post-war political history.

The change is seismic and it has occurred in just a few years. It is a tidal wave, the people are united, they cannot be divided by the Fabian socialists, the Bullingdon Club or the metropliatn media.

WetAugust · 02/10/2014 23:07

Question Time tonight is a disgrace They have invited the. 3 main parties and a Leftie journalist to guess why people are voting UKIP and they are making up a load of lies. Open season on UKIP with no UKIP member on the panel.
However I am delighted to see members of the audience standing up for UKIP.

If there ever was a lesson on how out of touch the professional luvvies are this is it

claig · 02/10/2014 23:13

Exactly, probably intentionally done one week before two by-elections that threaten to rock the entire cosy establishment system and even the plumber supports the Tories and quotes Cameron's line "if you go to bed with Farage, you'll wake up with Miliband".

WetAugust · 02/10/2014 23:35

Suzanne thingy the UKIP lady is tweeting from the T his Week Green Room that everyone the thinks it's a really bad idea to exclude UKIP and I agree it does seem to have backfired.

good old British public.

Surely Charlie the plumber is ripe for turning. he thinks he a a Conservative but he's actually Ukip

Why is the Labour lady wearing a blue dress and a Lib necklace.

WetAugust · 02/10/2014 23:42

UKIP have just won the Westoe council by election from Labour

claig · 02/10/2014 23:46

There's no stopping UKIP Grin
Labour are at a loss what to do. Sheer panic is their only response.

WetAugust · 02/10/2014 23:59

They need to hide Shapps away for a while. the public font like him

Claig

I was watching QT tonight thinking to myself the public in the audience would never have stood up say 20 years ago and argued with the politicians like they did tonight.
I am wondering whet her it as the expenses scandal that totally turned people off or whether the last 50 years of improved public access to media etc has finally permitted the public to form their own. the forelock tugging days are over and people are starting to question what they have been told are facts.
or have we reached such a rock bottom with pay, jobs and public services that the public just don't believe it when they are told that things are getting better. Also, how can you argue there is no money while fighting a billion pound war??

Whatever it is, people are waking up

claig · 03/10/2014 00:08

the audience would never have stood up say 20 years ago and argued with the politicians like they did tonight'

Very good point. People now know what they are all about. They have seen so many lies and wars and so much politically correct posturing that they are now sick of them and are prepared to argue with the spinners.

claig · 03/10/2014 00:16

Sun poll for Heywood and Middleton
Labour 50% (up 10%), UKIP 31% (up 28%), Tory 13% (down 14%), LibDem 4% (down 19%)

claig · 03/10/2014 00:37

19% still undecided.

I think if they decide to vote they would probably go UKIP.
Pundits think UKIP won't make it. I'm not so sure.

WetAugust · 03/10/2014 00:39

Yes. And some say as Labour often has trouble actually getting its voters into the polling station, it may be closer than the current poll suggests

claig · 03/10/2014 00:42

Yes good point. UKIP voters are very keen because they know they are part of a revolution, part of the People's Army, but Labour voters know they are voting for the same old shower.

WetAugust · 03/10/2014 00:50

I am watching Sky News Press report and want to throw things at the TV. two more young journos without a clue as to what's going on but spinning the line that Carswell and Reckless jumped ship to save their skins at the next election

how the fuck do they come up with that unless they are sucking up Tory and Lab spin?

I get so pissed off when I see empty headed idiots who are parroting what their last university PPE lecturer told them and who at half my age don't have an understanding of history or the politics of this country

Thank fuck I cancelled my Sky subscription as I would hate to be paying to watch this crap.

Am in desperate need of wineGrin

AbbieHoffmansAfro · 03/10/2014 14:07

parroting what their last university PPE lecturer told them

more likely parroting what their mates who were in the same lectures but are now young Labour or Tory researchers told them.

Media/journalism is increasingly an occupation for the privileged, drawn from the same background as politicians and business leaders. It is as difficult to name a young Northern, working class political correspondent as it is to name a young Northern, working class MP (for any party).

You don't have to be a UKIPper (and I'm not, thank God) to see the level of herd thinking, apostolic succession, homogeneity and simple narrowness of British (and especially English) public life.

WetAugust · 03/10/2014 16:31

Abbie. I totally agree with you.

There are fewer opportunities now than at any time I can remember for young people who have not had the original lodges of a private or grammar school education.

It's very depressing

Isitmebut · 04/10/2014 14:23

In essence, Ukip offers the UK electorate nothing but ant-politics propaganda and far right nationalist misinformation, pretending they are different to a ‘Westminster elite’ they tell voters are ‘all the same’ but in truth have not been so different for decades i.e. on the EU, immigration and the economy.

The United Kingdom Independence Party, as it’s core policy says on the can, WAS for the UK to leave the EU and voters (wrongly) believing Ukip could offer that core policy trusted Ukip.

NOW Ukip is just ‘for’ parliamentary seats in Westminster, so don’t care what happens to the UK economically and hypocritically staying in the EU is now secondary to the Ukip MEP’s, earning £78,000 a year and set monthly expenses allowances of £3,5000 each. So why should Farage’s Ukip care if we leave soon, when it gives them more PAID time via future elections and by-elections to get seats in Westminster?

In 2015, it is a FACT that either the Conservative or the Labour Party will form the next government and as Labour have a significant boundary advantage over the Conservatives, what would this mean?

Vote Ukip get Labour; with near open door immigration to both EU and NON EU citizens, rather than the Conservatives who brought back NON EU immigration back to 1990’s levels - but saw a trending increase in EU citizens from the more ‘mature’ EU countries, currently attracted to the UK’s new jobs recovery, as the strongest economy within Europe.

Vote Ukip get Labour; and the EU Brown signed us up to without a UK Referendum, Miliband refuses to offer, Farage obtaining has never been able to offer (and a wasted vote as never will be able to in my lifetime) - while the Conservatives that with the majority needed in 2015, are totally committed to giving the people a ‘YES/NO’ Referendum in 2017.

Vote Ukip get Labour; on Human Right Act signed up by Blair after the Conservatives left office in 1998, whose constant interference in domestic ‘rights’ is left open to UK judges interpretation, which often means ‘the wrong sort of rights’ are being protected e.g. criminals/suspected terrorists, , so we need a British Bill of Rights the Conservatives wanted for years, held back by a Coalition partner forced upon them by Ukip voters in 2010.

Vote Ukip get Labour; who say manufacturing trend down from 23% to 12% of our economy and on trade, saa no further than trading within the EU member states - instead of encouraging the private sector to grow businesses and jobs to trade with the world - which is why in 2010, we were doing more trade with Ireland, than with the 2.4 billion citizens within the ‘emerged’ nations of Brazil, Russia, India and China.

Vote Ukip get Labour; who pathetically offer apprenticeships, but still only know how to grow the government/public sector and their penal taxes to finance fat quango government/waste, rather than the Conservatives who know how to keep government ‘lean’ and use that money to stimulate the private sector that provides sustainable investment/jobs, as evidenced by over 1.8 million new jobs since 2010.

Vote Ukip get Labour; who’s education direction over 13-years did not prepare our children academically and ready for work, which is why when Brown was boasting record employment and 2.5 million new citizens came to the UK to work - in 2004 there were 580,000 unemployed 16-24 year olds, by pre crash 2007 it had risen to 711,000 unemployed, and when Labour finally passed over 921,000 unemployed to the coalition in 2010, the Coalition had a broken and unbalanced economy with an annual £157 billion deficit/overspend, to reverse that trend.

Vote Ukip get Labour; on the NHS, a ministerial budget they refused to ‘ring fence’ in 2010 when due to immigration, the birth rate, an older population, the increased DEMAND was to add many tens of millions more GP appointment requests and A&E visits onto the system. Furthermore Labour says they won’t privatize the NHS, their record on incompetent use of private companies speaks for itself e.g. Private Finance Initiatives, the total value of the NHS buildings built by Labour under the scheme was £11.4 billion but the bill with additional services will come to more than £70 billion on current projections and will not be paid off until 2049.

Vote Ukip get Labour; on Housing/Social Housing that despite 2.5 million new citizens in the UK during a tax growth ‘boom’, overall there were the lowest peace time new builds since the 1920’s. And according to Shelter, from 1998 to 2007 the number of Social Homes declined by a net 10% to 3.8 million, yet at the end of March 2008, there were 5 million people within 1.77 million households on local authority housing registers (or housing waiting lists) for the allocation of a social home - just as we were entered the economic ‘bust’.

Finally on housing, a Ukip enabled 2015 Labour win, constantly threatening the private sector with new state controls and taxes, will frighten away the prospects of new investment, not attract it – which makes any new housing figures they quote are as meaningless as their last record in government, when in the early years the private sector trusted them.

”General Election 2010: Ukip challenge 'cost Tories a Commons majority”
www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/ukip/7693877/General-Election-2010-Ukip-challenge-cost-Tories-a-Commons-majority.html

“Analysis of results shows that in at least 21 key marginal seats, Ukip’s share of the vote proved enough to allow Labour or the Lib Dems to see off strong Tory challenges.”

OP posts:
claig · 04/10/2014 14:51

' So why should Farage’s Ukip care if we leave soon, when it gives them more PAID time via future elections and by-elections to get seats in Westminster?'

Because they are not like the self-serving political class. Are they full of PPEs? Have you not heard of the term People's Army?

Isitmebut · 04/10/2014 15:00

Yada, yada, yada ... how many Conservative backers and sitting MP's with PPE's are you allowed to have BEFORE the brainless, no talented, yet highly paid Ukip MEPs -who even had trouble 'sorting out' 2 candidates at a Clacton by election - become a "self serving political class"???

OP posts:
claig · 04/10/2014 15:03

'but in truth have not been so different for decades i.e. on the EU, immigration and the economy. '

Both Labour and Conservative want to remain in the EU, both accept and have for years accepted open borders, both maintain each other's spending plans when taking over office and both are believers in the "green crap" with the Tories so dedicated to it that they even changed their torch symbol to that of a squiggly tree - a sort of five year old's scrawl.

The People's Army has torn up the cosy consensus. So much so that Fabian socialists, Bullingdon Club members and the metropolitan elite in are absolute panic mode as they realise that their common game, played on the people, is all over.

"However, a report authored by Marcus Roberts, the deputy general secretary of the left-leaning Fabian Society think tank, presents research suggesting Ukip could indirectly sway the results in hundreds of marginal seats.

The research suggests Ukip poses a “critical” threat in four seats (three of them Tory-held, including Douglas Carswell’s Clacton seat which he hopes to claim for Ukip on Thursday), a “high” risk in a further seven – four held by Labour, and a “moderate” risk in a further 25 seats."

www.theguardian.com/news/datablog/2014/oct/03/ukip-could-influence-the-result-of-more-than-200-seats-at-the-general-election

It's got so bad that hi-viz jackets have had to be dusted off as all hands are called to the deck in a last-ditch attempt to stop the People's Army

"David Cameron in last ditch visit to Ukip battleground in Clacton

Prime Minister said he takes by election "very seriously" despite polls showing it is likely to be a landslide for Ukip"

www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/david-cameron/11136975/David-Cameron-in-last-ditch-visit-to-Ukip-battleground-in-Clacton.html

claig · 04/10/2014 15:13

The metropolitan elite called UKIP "fruitcakes" and now, just one year later, UKIP have got the elite's cake and are eating it.

The People's Army is sweeping everything before them and the spinners are in a tizzy, forced to get busy while there has never been so many PPEs who are literally shaking at the knees, knowing they'll have to hand over the keys.

WetAugust · 04/10/2014 19:55

Vote Tory get Junkers!

More councillors defecting to UKIP today.

Looking forward to Thursday.

claig · 06/10/2014 19:40

"Electoral history is likely to be made on Thursday on the Essex coast"

www.ft.com/cms/s/0/c14dc200-4d64-11e4-bf60-00144feab7de.html#axzz3FOJVPi2F

Watched an old Sky Plussed Melvyn Bragg programme on Radical Lives today about John Ball. I had never heard of him. It was all about the 1381 Peasants' Revolt that started in Essex and spread to Kent when Wat Tyler joined in.

Amazing history - illustrious villages and towns all over Essex made history then and are making history now, over 600 years later.

The Financial Times is writng about it, the metropolitan elite are reading about it and the people of Clacton, Essex are doing it for themselves.