Oscar Pistorius trial part 4

[Pennies]

Here you go.

*were

BMW I agree, I don't think the alarm was ever set, I think he has lied on this, reason because it would show he can't be that fearful of intruders, if he didn't even set the alarm.

I agree that the alarm was never set. I'm not even sure he ever took his legs off. He managed to do a hell of a lot of things on stumps in the pitch dark, according to him.

Place marking.

I think they were up later, ate later not sure why this matters but just don't believe the 10pm sleep bit.

I think he'll be found not guilty of murder too - there's nothing incontrovertible from the prosecution so far. As someone said upthread, he just repeats he thought it was an intruder and he feared for his life - so it's impossible, without that incontrovertible evidence, for Nel to prove that wasn't what OP believed.

But if he's found not guilty of murder what other options are open to the Judge?

SirChenjin if you look at Lookingthroughthefogs post at 17.07 it shows the different degrees of murder/ch in SA, it looks as though OP will probably be found guilty of the second, if not that then CH.

"I just wish that the jail sentence didn't involve likely beatings, rape, spread of illness etc because every time someone says 'he needs to go to jail' that's what I think of. I don't really disagree about a jail sentence, but the sentencing is so much more than being locked away to serve time and I don't think that is justice being served as it should be."

of course, no prisoner deserves this kind of treatment in prison but, if it's common knowledge this happens the perhaps OP should have considered that before he murdered smene (allegedly)?

I really do thin the there's sme misplaced sympathy here, andi just can't get my head round why it is. Is it because he's famouse and some people thn he is handsome etc?

I mean, he's going to go down for something, even if not murder, he will go to prison for some stretch of time. He reall should have considered that before doing wha he did.
It doesn't matter who was behind the door, he used excessive force. It is inevitable he will spend some time in prison with other people who have also broken the law.

And does anyone else find it odd, that in all his assertions that his prime concern was to protect Reeva - he claims to speak to hear at least twice before he shoots, yet got no response from her at all ??

He can't see her, she doesn't respond to his urgings to call the police, and yet he goes on to get the gun and do his thing anyway ???

I'm sure that if I was "in terror" as he claims, I'd want to hear a human voice IYSWIM. Especially if the person I was trying to protect was not responding.

Pooh terrible typos, stupid iPad.

Interesting article about the Judge

www.sbs.com.au/news/article/2014/04/14/judge-pistorius-trial-breaks-new-ground

Nerf What I have just thought is that if OP actually meant to kill Reeva, why didn't he take a moment to clear the crime scene of anything obvious? Take the phone back to the bed? Unlock the toilet door?

I think it's too much for him to think about changing things drastically. If he is lying, the less he has to change the better, far easier to change the story to fit the facts as they are than to change the whole scene around to fit a story.

Agree with Stack about sympathy for him. He's killed someone's precious DD.

I do find that odd BMW6 - I also find it odd that he wanted her to call the police - who he has no respect for and didn't call himself. He called the security guard (?) . Surely that's who he would have called so he had immediate help within the gated complex?

I wonder if Reeva's Mother and Father will get to have their say in the Civil Lawsuit - I hope so, for their sake.

I seriously doubt that Barry Roux will be willing to represent him in that Action, as OP has pretty much trashed his own defence team in his testimony.

LondonRocks Nel asked Pistorius about that, Oscar said the door must have shut and locked at the same time, which Nel said was implausible. I agree.

Sauce Surely that's who he would have called so he had immediate help within the gated complex?
To be fair, if he was whispering/whatever this to Reeva in a panic, she probably wouldn't have known the number for security whereas she would know the generic police number to call.

Does anyone else remember that he said at the beginning of his testomytthat he is very unsteady on his stumps. Yet managed to move fans, was ready to go and confront attackers

BMW I seriously doubt that Barry Roux will be willing to represent him in that Action, as OP has pretty much trashed his own defence team in his testimony.

Do you think so? I think this has been overplayed by the press.

Civil lawsuit?

"That was me that said that Bonnie, I still feel that, I think she got up and went into the bathroom, opened the window, then OP heard window, told Reeva to get down and call police, he then grabbed his gun, started out at top of passage and shouted to intruders/Reeva at this point Reeva toke refugee in toilet, this is where OP heard the door slam.

My only question is, is why did she go to the bathroom in the first place, with her phone.

I don't think she was in the toilet to start with."

See, I read stuff like this and I think, what if it is just as simple as that and she took her phone as a light and OP was turned away at that point. It all seems so plausible.

But then you have the reports of shouting and screaming.

Then I think, what if it was just a terrible series of coincidental events. Mabe they did argue but not so badly that it led her death. Wha if they argued then made up then slept then the whole trouser thing happened.

I am so n the fence about this.

Those reading this thread should remember that he is not just being judged according to whether he killed Reeva intentionally or not. Of course that part of the trial makes for the most 'compelling' viewing, but actually he is on trial for murder, along with other minor charges. Nel has not just been seeking to prove that he knew that Reeva was behind that door. He can be found guilty without the judge believing that to be the case.

Stack - I sit on the fence regularly too. But it is just so crazy that he didn't see her, didn't hear her, that she didn't respond ONCE to anything in the time it took him to fear an intruder and shoot that person to death, not knowing the location of Reeva.

He deserves to go to prison just for being reckless in the extreme.

"London - when he moved fans etc wasn't the balcony doors/curtains open? So light from outside probably coming in? "

Notmif you believe today's evidence from the defence witness. If there was notmenoughlight for Stipp to see the OP house then there presumably wasn't enough light to illuminate the inside of his house either?

OneStep - thanks for that link, really interesting

ArGh, it posted 'trouser thing' when I meant 'intruder thing'.