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News

Sir Roy Meadow to face inquiry

348 replies

musica · 18/12/2003 14:56

Here's the story

OP posts:
angelinaballerina · 25/02/2004 16:15

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suedonim · 25/02/2004 16:21

I've been following your story, Bunglie, and wishing you all the best. Your MP seems sympathetic so I wonder if you can now go and see him so he can put a face to the name etc and maybe really get to work on your case? Our MP has regular 'surgeries' and you just phone for an appt.

I'd like to write to M Hodge as well. Is it okay to pinch stuff from posts and letters here or is that copyright?

I'm appalled that some of you who've written to you MP's have had no reply. I emailed my MP last Tuesday about pensions and benefits and received a long, comprehensive reply, and a copy of Hansard, on the Friday morning. Pity not all MP's are as assiduous in their work.

Bunglie · 25/02/2004 20:05

You are all very wonderful people and I am so very touched. Thank you so much for the sugestion of a whip-round - wow! no one has ever sugested anything so kind for me, thank you. I must tell you though that I have been informed that if I need to instruct a solicitor, (for more than just sending a letter) for a legal action I will be entittled to legal aid. The problem is that unless I know that my case is going to be reviewed and there is something that I want altered in the final judgment, I have no reason to hire a solicitor. Out of interest, not because I had ever contemplated it I was told that if the Judgment is found to have been wrong then I will have a right to sue the social services concerned and each of my children will also be able to sue them. What for I am not certain or anymore details as I was not really concentrating on that bit. I am not interested in suing the ss as nothing could give me back what I have lost. I also feel that it would open a lot of old wounds and I want this to end. No more courts for me I have never got over the criminal trial or the final wardship hearing. The thought of voluntarily going back to court for it all to be raked up again sends a shudder down my spine. Let's be honest the only people who win out of an action like that is the lawyers. I want to get to know my children, be able to cuddle them (although my ds might feel a bit'off' about that!!) and for them to know the truth.
I think if anyone deserves your support it must be Cheeseball (I do hope that even if she is not adding to this thread that she is at least following it and knows that she has support here.)
Tried phoning at 2pm right up until 5pm but they were engaged. I will keep trying.
Just think my sons letter should turn up on his doorstep tomorrow. (I did mention his sister in the letter, just saying that I had always loved them BOTH etc as I thought that he might show it to her).
Do you think I should tell him that I was at one point given the opportunity to have him back, but I decided that they should stay together and believed that I would win and get them both back. Or do think that that is something that it is better that I keep to myself. Personally I am hoping to give him a simple version and expand as and when he asks or the initial shock has worn off. Oh dear I am rather jumping ahead here, he has to answer yet.
A question for you all though. I felt at the time I was right to keep them together, over the years I have realised that he has had problems with his ap's and I wonder should I have split them up? Would you have seperated your children ? I am sometimes haunted by the thought that I turned down the one chance to have kept him, although if I am honest I am sure they still would have taken him too. I think the offer was made to guage my reaction, but as to how serious they were I do not know.
I am almost starting to feel a bit sorry for Mrs Hodge...but not that sorry, yes please bombard her with letters/emails, not for me for ALL of the affected families and children .
Final thought Mumsnet is very educational I have in the last month added three new words to my vocabulary. Mysogyny,assiduous and b**d!
Oh Bugger (not a new word but 20p in the swear box!) I forgot to put the photo in with the letter, should I send it seperately now or wait and see if he replies? How could I have forgotten....Hits head on wall out of frustration.....I can't believe I forgot to put it in, do you think it will matter?
I am really tired so I am going to try and sleep tonight-I listen to talking books, they help get me to sleep at the moment am listening to Ulrika Jonson reading 'Honesty', her autobiography. I feel positivly normal compared to her!!! but it is a good cure for insomnia - sorry Ulrika just MO.

Janh · 25/02/2004 20:17

Oh, I am so sorry you haven't got through today. Did you look at the Links page on the website? It has links to loads of other helpful sites - maybe you could try one or two of those tomorrow as well.

I don't think you should tell him yet of the choice you made to leave him with his sister - maybe one day but not now. Obviously if you had known what the outcome would be your decision would have been different but you need to have talked a lot about other things before you try to explain what you did and why. (I have an 18-yr-old DD and communicating with her can be very difficult if the barriers have gone up about something. She has to be feeling very happy and self-confident to discuss touchy subjects!)

Not sure what to do about the photo - maybe wait and see how he responds to the letter. If he doesn't get in touch straight away then it's a good reason to write again!

aloha · 25/02/2004 20:36

I completely agree with the very wise JanH. I wouldn't tell him that you could have kept him now - I really think that would be too confusing at the moment. Bunglie, I think you are the sweetest, nicest person I 'know' I just feel sad that I think nice people get so taken advantage of in this world by the wicked ones

SofiaAmes · 25/02/2004 21:26

Yes I agree. It's too much for him to handle at the moment, if ever. I'm not sure that someone who has not yet had children could understand that particular dilemma and why you chose the action you did. As a mother, I can completely understand, but I remember seeing Sophie's Choice when it first came out when I was much younger and although I don't really remember too much about the movie I do remember that I did not really understand her anguish over having to choose between her children.

By the way, on a lighter note, I just realized that I suggested a "whipup" instead of a "whip around." I have to blame my mother for that one. She is Italian and has taught me all the idioms totally wrong and I am forever "casting an ear" on things and "twisting up my knickers." I look forward to the day Bunglie when you will be able to share a giggle like that with your children. And I think you will find that they share many of your traits (hopefully only the good ones) despite not having lived with you.

SofiaAmes · 25/02/2004 21:31

Also, if it helps anyone to formulate their own letter (I found it really useful when Aloha posted hers to her mp), this is the letter I wrote to Margaret Hodge:

Dear Mrs. Hodge,

I am writing to urge you to request that social services look into ALL the cases that involved testimony by Roy Meadows. Although it may not be in the best interests of the children that have been adopted many years ago to be returned to their biological parents, it certainly is in their best interests to know that their mothers were not murderers or evil. These children and their mothers (and fathers) should be given the opportunity to at least make contact and right the lies of the past. This should not negate the parenting of the new families. All of these people are victims of the grossly irresponsible testimony of Roy Meadows.

I am attaching parts of a thread that appeared recently on an internet site for mothers. It includes the stories of two mothers who had their children stolen from them as the result of the testimony of Roy Meadows despite conflicting testimony from other experts. The children of both these women were put up for adoption. These injustices must be revisited so that these mothers and their children can find peace.

Again, I urge you to have all the Roy Meadows cases reviewed promptly.

Sincerely,

Sofia Ames

And then I attached, Bunglie's original post and second one with more detail and Cheeseball's original post. I think Aloha was right about not directly identifying Mumsnet for the time being.

stace · 26/02/2004 10:26

Bunglie, keeping up with the thread and have to say that you have definetly done the right thing sending the letter. and there is an old cliche that keeps ringing in my ear that i think applies really deeply to your situation
"Fight the good fight" and IMO no matter how or when you doubt yourself you must always remember that there so many people here that support you and beleive that if ever there was one.......
Yours is the good fight!!!! Big love to you and sending all my love and support to help you !
through the wait. Oh and on the point of whether you were right to make certain your children were kept together, IMO without any shred of doubt you did the harderst thing that any decent, human, selfless, loving would have done and you were so so so right to keep them together albeit without you!!! You have my complete admiration on so many counts, I wish we could all arrange a really posh dinner to meet you were you could wear you beautiful green dress!!!

Janh · 26/02/2004 10:45

Oooh, aloha, have just seen your post and am blushing! Bunglie, hope to hear later that you have been able to speak to somebody helpful today.

stace, wouldn't it be nice to have a mumsnetters get-together with Bunglie one day?

sofiaames, LOL at "twisting up my knickers"!

Janh · 26/02/2004 11:20

Darn it - had just logged off in order to go out when the post came and I have a letter from my MP (I actually only finally emailed him last week because I forgot before) so here I am again!

He says "Thank you for your recent letter relating to Mothers being falsely accused of murdering their children after having been diagnosed with Munchhausen's Syndrome." (Obv I didn't say murdering - I used a combination of aloha's letter and Bunglie's first 2 posts so it was a bit long though.)

"I have written with your concerns to the Rt Hon Baroness Scotland of Asthal QC, Minister of State for Criminal Justice and Law Reform and as soon as I receive a reply I shall be in contact". (He will, too, I wrote to him about recycling and he referred it to Michael Meacher and many many months later MM replied and he forwarded it to me.)

The above is typed, there is a handwritten PS "clearly there is a huge problem here" - so he does know we're talking about the adoptions.

Don't know why it's gone to her and not La Hodge (maybe he thinks she's useless too) but I've just googled her and she is not at all what I expected from the name (see here ) (hands up who else assumed she would be an aristocratic looking elderly woman!) (I must stop thinking in stereotypes) and she's one of 3 Ministers of State at the Home Office under Blunko - all women - the other 2 are MPs.

luchar · 26/02/2004 11:22

Thanks SofiaAmes - I will write today. Bunglie - I hope and pray that your son will get in touch soon. You are such a brave person - I really admire your strength in dealing with all this. Hugs Luchar xx

Bunglie · 26/02/2004 15:24

Been on phone most of day, lots to tell you but had better phone the next one before they close.

As for knickers ....anyone need a giggle.....well I have to lie on my bed to get dressed and I was in a bit of a rush this morning so I have my leg through the waistband, and the gusset is on my hip!!! Does that count as twisting your knickers? This is honestly true but as I have a catheter I have no need to recify the situation until bedtime. What I want to know is HOW can those thongy stringy things be comfortable I like to feel supported, and be able to pull them up and tuck them in my bra!!! Sorry I lost the thread/plot here, back to the phone.
I have had some very useful information but nothing direct yet, will post later.

Oh and thank you for reassurance re not to tell ds about deciding not to seperate them. It is greatly appreciated as I know that is one th8ing that has always haunted me.

Today has been a goo day so far and I slept until 9-15am, hence the rush with the knickers!!!!

SofiaAmes · 26/02/2004 23:47

Bunglie, LOL on the knickers in the bra. I don't understand the concept of those thong things either. I spend 20 years trying to find knickers that don't go up my butt and then they come out with ones that DO on purpose AND charge twice the price for them. Doesn't it make you feel old....looking at what the youth of today wear.

I'm trying hard not to take it personally that none of my elected officials (well they don't know that I'm American and can't vote for them) haven't bothered to answer any of my emails. Think I'll email to complain!

chocbox · 27/02/2004 09:01

Quick! Listen to LBC Now.

Twinkie · 27/02/2004 10:13

I have this morning sent an email to Melanie McFadyean - she is a journalist (writing mostly for the Guardian) and lecturer and in 2001 won an Amnesty International Media Award - she has a piece in the April Issue of Marie Claire entitled - 'Why were these women accused of killing their babies' - including Trupti Patel, Angela Cannings and Sally Clark - she also talks about Sir Roy Meadows.

I thought maybe she would be interested and be able to help you guys in some way - even if she just knows someone who will take an interest in your cases and get some kind of justice for you - although anything now would be too little, too late.

Update us on your calls yesterday?? - And wear some sensible knickers

GillW · 27/02/2004 12:42

Bunglie - I don't think this has already been mentioned - but have a look here . The link is to a piece written by a partner in a law firm who specialise in group actions (so it wouldn't be just you facing a court, which I know you've said you don't want) who is currently focussing on cases like yours. There are contact details there for her: Bozena Michalowska Howells ([email protected]) or phone 020 7650 1238. It might be worth you trying to contact them to see if there is any way that they might be able to help.

willow2 · 27/02/2004 13:20

Can I just say that Leigh Day - the law firm you have just mentioned - have done incredible work for a number of high profile cases around the world. Get in contact with them - they are brilliant.

postsue · 27/02/2004 13:42

New to this? Just found the website via links on M.A.M.A.s
After reading the experiences of a couple of members i know exactly how you feel. I was arrested, charged, child taken away, humillated, pressured into submission with my child dangled in front of me. This is all 13 years ago but i remember every detail and still feel the pain.
Finding things very hard at the moment, but always keep fighting,
YOU WILL WIN IN THE END

eddm · 27/02/2004 13:59

Bunglie, I've been offline for a while so have just caught up and wanted to say WELL DONE for sending the letter to your son, I know it's something that's caused you sleepless nights. Haven't heard from my MP yet but will chase. All the best.

aloha · 27/02/2004 14:04

Postsue, I am so sorry. Do you ever see your child now?

Bunglie · 27/02/2004 14:07

Ok, Got my knickers on straight today, must admit they are more comfortable around this way!!

Right I can't wait to tell you the GOOD NEWS, but you will have to wait ....

I shall start at the beginning or I will forget something - oh Twinkie, I can't get LBC here what did they say??

O.K. I called After Adoption action line (the other number was for adoptees under the age of 26). I spoke to a really nice guy called Jarrard (sp?) and he told me that they had expected 'hundreds of calls that referred to Meadows and to the best of his knowledge I was the First. As an organization they do not themselves offer anything but advice on who to contact in your area. He was aware of the 'gagging order' and assured me that my details were kept confidential. He told me that had I not asked him about it he would have sugested a liason worker who could provide support for me and my son. With regard to my dd I can do nothing without the consent of the ap's and so I have to bide my time. He asked who the adoption agency was and I told him and it turns out that they do not have a very good reputation in the world of adoption. He was surprised at the age of the ap's and could not work out how thay had been allowed to adopt seeing as they are now in their 50's. That had never crossed my mind before. He said the most important thing I can and must do is 'keep the door open' so that my ds feels able to contact me. He assured me that everything that I had done up until this point has been correct and it is very sad and in his opinion unusual for ap's not to respond to the letter I sent them. (I read it to him on the phone and he said that it should have reassured them and made it clear that I did not want to do anything to harm the childrens relationship with them but that I only wanted them to know the truth about the circustances of their adoption.) He had NEVER heard of 'A Letter for Life' which the adoption agency had told me was common practice. He said that my ds had probably not taken in fully the contents of that letter as that in itself must have been a shock to his system. We talked at length about the affect that this 'new' knowledge could have on him and he said that it would probably help him in clearing the picture a bit, especially if it has been a taboo subject in his ap's home which he suspects, otherwise why are the ap's not receptive to my letter.
He gave me the name of two agencies which should both be able to provide the kind of support that I would like available for my ds, should he need it. One was based near where I live and is called CLAIR (Channel Link on Adoption Identity Reunion and Experience) and the other cover the whole of the south east and west of England and are based in London and are simply called the Post Adoption Centre. Finally he gage me the telephone number of BAFA (British agency of Fostering and Adoption), who will help with the legal side of things however their helpline is only open mon-fri 10am-1pm and I had missed it.
Firstly I do realise that from the details I have given you you will be able to place what part of the British Isles I am in! But it makes little odds now.
Ahg! This is turning into a 'monster' of a posting - I am sorry, go and get yourselves a cup of tea!
Next I spoke to someone at BAFA, they are calling me back with some info. They were very helpful and said that I MUST contact the ss resposible for taking my children and read to me Margaret Hodge's directive. It seems that they have and obligation not only to me but also to my children to provide (and pay) for after care and counselling. I was told that they are the ones who must under the circumstances stop the ap's from giving my dd the letter she is due to receive on her 18th birthday.
The thing they said to me that I found really interesting is that ten years ago in an msbp case it was VERY unusual for the birth parents to get an 'open' adoption and that the judge for whatever reason must have had some reservation as to his judgment. In fact they were quite 'staggerred' that I had been permitted this 'open' adoption and that as medicine has moved on it is important that I make my medical diagnosis, which at the time was rejected, known to them. So, I now have to work out how and what I am to write to the social services dept. Any help in this area would very much be appreciated. What the hell am I suposed to write without it sounding like a 'threat'. Help needed!

Yesterday I received a telephone call from my step-monster - 1st in 10 years, it seems that the ap's must have given her my number (as I had moved and not told her) and secondly she seemed to be aware that I was considering telling my ds the truth. She pleaded with me not to, she said he is too young to understand. If I went ahead I would destroy the relationships that he has built up in the last 10 years (I think she was talking about her relationship with him, because she must be worried that I will tell him that it was her who spoke and lied to Meadows) I have no interest in telling him who was to blame for what, apportioning blame is not constructive in my eyes and IF he has a good relationship with her then I do not want to destroy that I only want to get to know him, love him and tell him the truth. She did not apologise for saying some of the things that she did to Meadows but asked me to understand that she was being told things by the ss and the hospital and she did at the time what she thought was best for the children. I really do think that she is frightened but she was also very angry with me. She made me feel as if I was putting myself first without any consideration for the feelings of my ds or dd. I did not want her to poison my ds's mind against me now, so I told her that I was going to tell him when I had got to know him as a person and was going to do nothing for several months in anycase.
Now maybe I am jumping the gun here but do you think that the ap's silence and lack of cooperation could in anyway be linked to her. She is obviously desperate that the truth does not come out and the children were placed within 10 miles of her home and 200 miles away from me, and I know that although they never discuss her with me that they do have regular contact.
I feel in a way it was good that she phoned because if she is going to do anything to try and prevent me from saying anythings to my ds she will do it now and if you like get it out of the way. I think that I was very 'good' on the phone, I was obviously upset, but did not let her know, (I hope) and I stuck to my guns being that if he is old enough to hear the ss version in a letter then he is old enough for my version.
Much as I would love to tell him who it was who spoke to Meadows I do not think that it would be in his best interests to know. I think that he is going to have enough to think about without her as an added complication.

I am waiting on phone calls at the moment, will keep you updated.

NOW YOU CAN HOLD ON TO YOUR KNICKERS, THONGS OR JUST ANYTHING...................

My Son sent me a text message yesterday evening. I am the happiest person alive at the moment I keep reading it and can not believe it yet, however it is a positive start.

In my letter to him I sugested that perhaps he would like to come down and we could do something together, like we could go out on a boat (especially adapted for wheelchairs) for a day fishing or something like that. It was just a way of saying please come and see me so I can get to know you. the text I got back says,

"Yeah I would love to, though my fishing skills are a little rusty! Thanks for the pressies, hope you are well, (his name)"

This is more than I could ever have wished for. I can not arrange it until the weather is warmer and as I am going away in April it looks like it will not happen until the end of April at the earlieast, but do you think I am wrong to write back quickly and send the photo I forgot, thank him for his text and tell him I will arrange it and his fare down here if he tells me when, or do you think I should tell him when, giving him let's say the option of a couple of dates, Oh I don't know, BUT HE ANSWERED MY LETTER. Not by another letter but a text message is just as good isn't it?

I will stop now before mumsnet bans me for using up too much space.

Finally ANY thoughts on how what to write to ss dept will be greatly appreciated.
Love to you all a very happy Bunglie

GillW · 27/02/2004 14:17

A text message is great - it proably means he wanted to get in touch a.s.a.p. and didn't want it to take the extra time a letter would have taken.

Beetroot · 27/02/2004 14:19

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Beetroot · 27/02/2004 14:20

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suedonim · 27/02/2004 14:29

Oh, Bunglie...I went all goosebumpy when I read your ds's text message! I can just feel that it's all going to work out.