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Soldiers Beating up teenagers in Iraq...

231 replies

MrsBigD · 12/02/2006 08:23

News of the World

Sky News

Just saw this on Sky News and am once again slightly amazed at the general population...

I can possibly understand the attitudes that the News of the World shouldn't have published the video footage due to maybe putting other soldiers in Iraq under thread of attack - though I don't agree.

However when they showed the result of the opinion poll whether soldiers accused of abuse should be prosecuted I just was amazed... a high percentage said 'NO'... I was just flabbergasted ... so if one is a soldier and happily goes along abusing the people of the country who they are supposed to protect it's ok to abuse them???? surely not.

OP posts:
sharklet · 14/02/2006 11:52

Kittyfish give it up. You've already accepted that you made an unfair coment, and now you seem to be defending it and trying to justify it.

Why would no-one on MN be seen dead with a private? I dated a private for a long time, he still is a private in the paras. He's certainly not stupid, and has access to more than a gun, because he is a highly trained man working in a field where stupid means dead.

Please understand why people would be offended by your comment, stereotyping is never big and clever. I'm afraid thats what you are doing and with your scant knowledge of the forces you simply showing yourself up as stupid.

Give it up.

Blandmum · 14/02/2006 11:53

katyfish....and as for the stupid boys line....the army doesn want 'em as they are often lackign self dicipline and motivation. Most of the lowest attinment boys I teach don't go into the army, they go onto the dole.

And why that happens is a whole different thread

sharklet · 14/02/2006 12:06

I agree with MB, the Army and other services don't just accept anyone. There are many applicants who are rejected for a variety of resons including intelligence.

kittyfish · 14/02/2006 12:49

Where on this thread have I said that everyone in the armed forces is thick? I haven't but there are thick squaddies. Stereotypes become so for a reason.

I have no idea what ac1 or ac2 means and have no idea where this 'I'm more intelligent than you' thing is coming from. I don't care either being of sufficient intelligence to realise that anyone can be any thing on an open forum.

I also haven't personally insulted anyone on this thread, but as army wives seems like you all have carte blanche to do so. You also seem incapable of taking the true meaning from my comments and just seem to want to twist what I have said to suit yourselves. I reverted to defending my first comment due to the completely over the top attacks from you all and I am withdrawing my apology for that reason.

Blu · 14/02/2006 12:54

"We have the most professional, effective peace keeping force in the world and all we do is bitch about them. Makes me mad and sad."

I am simply concerned that no force can be effective, professional or peace keeping if they take the law into their own hands and beat people up. So for the sake of the ongoing reputation of 'our boys' this needs investigating and dealing with - fast!

I also don't think they should be there - but that's no criticism of armed force members themselves - that's a criticism of Mr Tony Blair.

Blandmum · 14/02/2006 12:56

When Have I said I was more intelligent than you? To memory I haven't said anything about how intelligent I am at all?

I haven't insulted you, I think you are talking abut htings that you know very little about, but that is a different thing totaly.

AC1 is the eqivalent to a Private in the army, AC2 a little higher, must not as high p as a Corporal.

And in my experience steriotypes becoame so, because people say so, not because they are always based in fact,

Sure there are below average IQ people in the armed forces, but that is true of just about everywhere

This is, as you say an open forum, and you are entitled to your oppinion. Just as I am entitled to say that it seems to be based on a very shallow understanding of te modern armed forces. And since I have 18+ years experience I know that I know what I am talking about.

As for withdrawing your applogy, I'm crying bitter tears.

Blandmum · 14/02/2006 12:57

Blu, FWIW I totaly agree that this behaviour is out of order and needs to be sorted now. We have a right to expect our armed forces to keep to the Geneva Caonvention And these are also the views of DH

sharklet · 14/02/2006 13:11

Neither myself nor MB are Army wives. Who are you referring to?

I don't feel we have carte blanche to insult you nor are we trying to. I have simply defended my freinds and my freind's families and tried to point out to you how people could be and are very offended by your comments. You have insulted many of my freinds with your comments, and I reserve the right to comment on them.

I understand exactly what you meant and I know you think that you are being very supportive to the army which on one hand you are, but you are also being insulting and making sweeping generalisations. I do not think you have really given the matter any great thought otherwise you would undertand why you comment how ever amusingly meant was insulting. I've already explained why army wives such as marmalade may feel particularly prickly with regard to that type of comment. I am sure if you actually thought the matter over you would realise how offence can be taken at that kind of comment.

No one has said they are more intelligent than you, we have simply called you out on some sweeping generalisations you have made which we find insulting. Althoughy ou have taken great pains to explain to us how you think that anyone under the rank of NCO is stupid perhaps you don't realise that in many areas "squaddie" can mean a variety of different things, anyone in the army, anyone who is an enlisted man, anyone of the rank of private or below. Whatever it means to you making a sweeping generalisation is foolish and insulting. Of course some enlisted men (and officers) will have higher IQ's than others or be considered more intelligent, but they are not all "thick".

I note you are not saying only some squaddies are thick - so perhaps you are realising that stereotypes do not neccessarily ring true.

sharklet · 14/02/2006 13:15

And yes Blu I agree this kind of behaviour is awful, and should be dealt with quickly and effectively. All combatants should behave in accordance with the Geneva Convention, its shameful that this has happened, and however difficult the circumstances the actions occured in I cannot condone them, My Dh also feels the same.

shimmy21 · 14/02/2006 13:24

Whether squaddies are thick or not is hardly the point. Hopefully we'd all agree that whoever made these tapes whether real or fake is thick to the point of moronic.

Seeing those sickening tapes makes me truly ashamed to be British and then reading some comments on here that almost seem like a justfication makes me even more so.

Rhubarb · 14/02/2006 13:25

I take offence at the word "Jesus Christ" being used inappropriately on this thread.

Blandmum · 14/02/2006 13:35

Rhubarb did you ever listen to the tune for Vatican Rag btw? It is very funny

Rhubarb · 14/02/2006 13:38

I did yeah! Very funny it was too! I sent it on to my sister!

kittyfish · 14/02/2006 14:19

You are both so uptight about this, take a chill pill ffs. Assumed you were army wives cos of your 'how DARE you call squaddies thick' reactions. If all your army friends are going to be offended by such a pussy comment how on earth do they cope with people who might actually want to kill them?

Blandmum · 14/02/2006 14:22

I live with that every day dh is on active service. Just because I have to put up with that I doesb't mean I have to listen to someone comeing out will ill thought out comments from someone who doesn't know the situation as well as I do.

If you can't take part in a debate, I sugest you don't try. If yo make a comment on a discussion group, expect to have to support it.

'pussy' LMAO. Is that the best you can come up with? I've been through more grief and worry than most people, trust me.

kittyfish · 14/02/2006 14:26

I have supported every comment I have made on hear. Pussy = silly in this context or are you deliberately being obtuse again?

Rhubarb · 14/02/2006 14:28

My bro used to serve in Northern Ireland mb. It ruined him. He found one of his mates hanging by a rope on Christmas Eve, saw another get gunned down at a checkpoint, and witnessed 2 policemen get blown to pieces by a bomb that his dog had failed to sniff out (he trained sniffer dogs). In the last incident, workers at a nearby factory leaned out of the windows and clapped and cheered when the bomb went off.

He suffered pst for a long time and only now is he slowly beginning to find his feet again, a good 20 years later.

It's tough and I know what they are going through in Iraq. I hope the video is a fake so that Britain can clear its name, but if it's not, then those soldiers are slurring the names of their comrades and putting more soldiers lives at risk in an already hostile situation. In fact, even if it's a fake that is exactly what they are doing already - why would someone want to do that?

I hope the matter is sorted once and for all. It's a war that should never have been fought and now it just seems to be breeding every more hostility towards the West.

Blandmum · 14/02/2006 14:29

Well, where I live it is a slag term for a woman's genitals.

And I can't be deliberalty obtuse again since I haven't been obtuse at all yet.

Yes, you know so much about the armed forces and the people in them......I'll retire now, since I have nothing else to say to you, and feel rather ill, as are all my kids.

kittyfish · 14/02/2006 14:29

BTW glad you're laughing - I really thought you'd had your sense of humour removed at birth.

Blandmum · 14/02/2006 14:30

Rhubarb, I have a mate who trod on an anti personel mine, and heared it 'click' but thank god it never went off. Thankfully dh never got sent to NI, but it must have been hell on earth.

Blandmum · 14/02/2006 14:31

I'll thank you not be be offensive.

I have been polite to you, and you are abusing me, I have no idea why, but would prefer it if you stop.

Rhubarb · 14/02/2006 14:31

keep talking mb, she's being very rude and will go away soon. How are you coping with your dh being out there so much?

Blandmum · 14/02/2006 14:34

TBH he isn't 'out there' atm. He did the last war, but nothing since, he was promoted on return and got to fly a desk for a while. He is back on a squadron and is in the states for a little while.

He will be away more now he is back on the 'front line'

But I don't have anything like the grief that army wives have Thay have a lot more crap to put up with.

sharklet · 14/02/2006 14:35

My DH is in the airforce. Sweeping generalisations like the ones you made affect all forces families. If you post a comment - like MB says you should be prepared to defend it or back down.

You've already admitted you were unfair - so why on earth your trying to defend it now I've no idea. You seem to be trying to make us look pathetic for standing up for our freinds, husbands, brothers etc.

Because someone has to face life or death situations as a part of their job does that also mean they have to be subjected to taunts from narrow minded people like you?

Rhubarb · 14/02/2006 14:35

I bet incidents like this one don't help at all do they? What are his thoughts on it?