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Soldiers Beating up teenagers in Iraq...

231 replies

MrsBigD · 12/02/2006 08:23

News of the World

Sky News

Just saw this on Sky News and am once again slightly amazed at the general population...

I can possibly understand the attitudes that the News of the World shouldn't have published the video footage due to maybe putting other soldiers in Iraq under thread of attack - though I don't agree.

However when they showed the result of the opinion poll whether soldiers accused of abuse should be prosecuted I just was amazed... a high percentage said 'NO'... I was just flabbergasted ... so if one is a soldier and happily goes along abusing the people of the country who they are supposed to protect it's ok to abuse them???? surely not.

OP posts:
Blandmum · 14/02/2006 15:20

Oh, I just remembered, Dh has had to take an equal ops training course that covered racial awareness etc

All his collegues did.

peacedove · 14/02/2006 15:21

tiredemm if there were an outright question if you were racist, that would certify the army to be made of stupid people.

There are ppersonality tests, psychological tests, interviews that give one away.

doormat · 14/02/2006 15:21

certify it hey, hmm

peacedove · 14/02/2006 15:22

well doormat, English isn't my mothertongue, but I still don't think my post could mean that.

sharklet · 14/02/2006 15:22

I know theres a screening to check for racism, extremism etc in the police but I'm not sure about current recruitment in the army. I would assume so. But lets be honest they still get in to the police force as seen on that programme about the police training.

Looking at the circumstances of the riot and the repeated bombimgs shooting etc at the time I can understand how someone might reach breaking point, it doesn't even need to be motivated by an evil underlying hatred of muslims, its far more likely to be absolute frustration at being bombed day in day out. It doesn't change the factt hat no matter how frustrates or angry they shouldn't have behaved that way, and should be court martialled - which is the procedure they are lookig into now.

kittyfish · 14/02/2006 15:24

Yes, a misplaced attempt at levity gone horribly wrong again Sharklet. Obviously my tone of voice means all 'cos I can't remember the last time I upset someone by accident during a spoken conversation.

MB that is not saying your friends can't cope, but that they face far worse and that my comment wouldn't bother them at all. Clear?

peacedove · 14/02/2006 15:24

MB your dh a, many of his colleagues (particularly in the RAF) would be aware, but not the whole of the army.

Go and look at the BNP sites. You think there aren't any BNP supporters in the armed forces.

sharklet · 14/02/2006 15:25

One of DH's collegues is an Iraqi and a muslim, they have muslim services regularly for muslim servicemembers. I've never come across anti-muslim feeling among Dh's colleagues.

doormat · 14/02/2006 15:26

I apologise if I seem picky peacedove but that is not my intention
I am just sick of hearing how our service personnal are rubbished by either the media or the likes of some on this board

they are being used as political pawns for a war,invasion or whatever it is that no-one wants

kittyfish · 14/02/2006 15:26

I think that there is as much racism in the forces as there is in the country as a whole - not alot.

tiredemma · 14/02/2006 15:28

peacedove, my comment was intended to be tongue in cheek, i am not that stupid that i would expect the army to ask as an outright question.

sharklet · 14/02/2006 15:28

Of course there willbe BNP members in tearmed forces. Blessedly few however from what I have witnessed.

Blandmum · 14/02/2006 15:32

peacedove, there are vile people everywhere, dare I say it, even in some mosques.

Personaly I have never met any BNP members the RAF, and I'm not bullshitting.

kittyfish · 14/02/2006 15:36

But isn't being in the BNP a bit like being gay was afew years ago? ie you stay in the closet unless you are pretty sure of who you're talking to? And no, I am not suggesting that all or even afew RAF personell are closet BNP.

Blandmum · 14/02/2006 15:42

You can be gay in the forces

Blu · 14/02/2006 15:42

To my mind it is precisely because you can't accurately assess what is in someone's mind (re race o any other prejudices), that how they ACT is of paramount importance. Hence the crucial-ness of observing the Geneva Convention. Troops are hardly going to be sent to areas where everyone behaves with impeccable peaceful united citizenship, so no, the context doesn't mitigate their behaviour AT ALL. The context is exactly why they are supposed to be there.

Blandmum · 14/02/2006 15:43

quite

sharklet · 14/02/2006 15:44

I'm sure they would be pretty closet about it. There will be minorities who have beleifs we find shocking and unacceptable in many areas.

I have never witnessed it in the armed services. Thats not to say it isn't there. But I don't feel these attacks were neccessarily fuelled by racial hatred or religious discrimination. Stupid and unacceptable as they were.

sharklet · 14/02/2006 15:48

British Forces are a lot better about gay servicemen - in the US its Dont Ask, Don't Tell....

Rhubarb · 15/02/2006 12:37

Oh the whole I think the British Forces are a lot less 'gung-ho' than their American counterparts. I think there is a different mentality between the two countries, especially in Iraq.

These tapes, faked or not, discredit the British army and will lead to serious repurcussions. If they are found to be fake, the Iraqis will never believe it. That's what is important here, the Iraqis believe all the stories about torturing and killing, they are used to it remember, it's what they expect. So it has already put our soldiers lives in grave danger and made the situation in Iraq even worse. Soldiers are being attacked because the Iraqis believe that they are just murderers (given their past experiences I can hardly blame them), though of course some Iraqis attack because they want Saddam back. Tapes like this just serve to reinforce this notion.

I agree that you get racists everywhere, and you get tossers everywhere. It's unfair to say that there are any more of them in the army than anywhere else.

Blu · 15/02/2006 12:40

If these tapes are found to be faked, the perpetrators (including the publishers)should definitley be done for incitement or something.

satine · 15/02/2006 13:07

I am not condoning, excusing or praising what appears to have been happening on the tape BUT it makes me want to cry that our soldiers in Iraq are being shot at, mortared, stoned, spat at and blown up every single day but that almost never gets into the press. They are trying to cope with almost intolerable living conditions (temperatures of 50 degrees, sand storms, little or no privacy) and are trying to carry out a role that is unclear and thankless. You might say, well, that's their job but the situation in Iraq is particularly bad and there is no mention of compensation for the soldiers who have been killed or injured by Iraqis, or action taken against those responsible. Our media sometimes seems a little one-sided.

jessicaandrebeccasmummy · 15/02/2006 13:09

well sais satine. DH is army so im having to refrain from typing what i REALLY want to say.

Rhubarb · 15/02/2006 13:11

Yes, the press is one-sided and yes they are coping with extremely hard conditions. But all tapes like this do is to endanger their lives even further. If it is real, then those soldiers have put their comrades in mortal danger. This sounds crass, but we are British, we don't do this kind of thing - do we?

satine · 15/02/2006 13:14

I'm also censoring my strength of feeling on this subject. As my DH has said, unless you've been there, you can't imagine what it's like.