Diane Abbott....racist comment or not?

[festi]

I think If you look and consider what she said in the context of the discussuion she was having. I believe she has a very valid point, she did make a generalised remark and by definition that was racist, but, it was in my opinion acceptable for her to generate discussion and break down the barriers that exist (the fear of counter accusations of racism) in discussuing the exposure openly.

Why oh why are posters referring to other media hungry idiots to validate their argument for this proven racist?
Don't believe a columnist or a tweet freak think for yourselves.

Boschy it has nothing to do with social media and everything to do with choosing which controversial event to pursue - be it a silly tweet or the unprovoked, racially inspired murder of an innocent man.

He's making the point that if the massive amount of interest that has been shown to DA was channelled into the justice system, the killers of Stephen Lawrence would have been brought to justice much sooner. The means in which information is transferred has changed, but not the principles of the major political players. They go for the easy target.

Massive amount of interest?
It's already off the main drag on the BBC website,it's being buried.
Why are you making excuses for her behaviour Celia? She's a racist and she's got form.
Previously, Abbott face accusations of racism suggesting that the 'blonde blue-eyed Finnish girls' working in her local hospital were unsuitable as nurses because they had 'never met a black person before'.

I for one don't want her anywhere near any form of power in this country and have complained to my MP about her.

celia and elaine I take both your points. But I think the entire social climate was completely different 18 years ago and that's why it is not a real argument to say that 'if only....'

Stephen's parents were the driving force behind the eventual 'success' in bringing 2 of his killers to justice, and along with that has come a change in approach from all parties. (I also have to say that the dreaded Daily Mail was also a force for good in this particular case).

But anyway in DA's case: she has form for making racist remarks; she is also not popular with journalists - she's shafted several along her path to political success - so now she has put her foot in her mouth again they are going for the jugular.

She'll be seen in the papers soon kissing babies for photo opportunities.
Just not babies from Sweden or the colonial classes she despises so much.

Finland (Geographyitis kicked in.

This article is brilliant imo.

" Previously, Abbott face accusations of racism suggesting that the 'blonde blue-eyed Finnish girls' working in her local hospital were unsuitable as nurses because they had 'never met a black person before "

That's a fairly astounding level of idiocy!

celia, yes it is!

After watching the Politics Show a few times I came to the view that Diane Abbott was self regarding and none too bright. Having had a reasonable amount of contact with politicos this was not surprising as many of them are.
Her tweet was idiotic and racist - whether she herself meant it to be or is herself I don't know. She should've apologised profusely and immediately.
It wouldn't be getting the same amount of press if she'd done this but somehow I don't think humility is her style.

That's a very good article, Celia. It deserves quoting:

"What this absurd flap demonstrates is the desperate longing of some privileged people to wear the rags of victimhood. Any whiff of black-on-white racism, like misandry and heterophobia, is an excuse for these delicate souls to downplay the dominant prejudice and argue that there is a level playing field of bigotry or, on the crazier fringes, that there is a ?war? on white people/men/straight people/motorists, etc. Coming so soon after the Lawrence verdict, Abbottgate is a nasty attempt to pretend that, hey, there?s racism on both sides now. A black man gets knifed to death by a white mob; a black MP writes a carelessly worded tweet about white people. It all evens out.

Predictably Abbott has felt compelled to delete the tweet, though not the rest of the conversation which produced it. But apart from the careless oversimplification ? she should have said ?white people in power? or ?certain white people? ? she was right. In her initial qualified apology she clarified that she was referring to 19th century colonialism when, to take just one example, the Belgians colonising modern-day Rwanda strategically favoured the Tutsis over the Hutus and sowed the seeds of attempted genocide a century later. But you don?t need to go back that far. The US government?s efforts to disrupt the civil rights and Black Power movements are a textbook example of divide-and-rule. It is what dominant powers do. To read her tweet as an indictment of every single white person in the world requires either paranoia or malice. Most of all it means denying that power matters."

The amount of bad faith going on about this is ridiculous.

I thought the opening paragraph was pretty powerful, too. I'd like to force every one on the 'DianNe Abbot is playing the race card' thread to read the whole lot, but IME only people who are going to agree with links, click on them!

"What this absurd flap demonstrates is the desperate longing of some privileged people to wear the rags of victimhood"

With Diane Abbott front and centre of that queue

breaking news
Diane Abbott has filed a complaint of racism against the pot.

It called the kettle black.

Ok so its silly but it made me laugh.

WhingingNinja whilst I agree, it's a silly "joke" and I don't think you meant it to be taken seriously, it underpins the inherent culture of racism in this country - to be called black is an insult.

It is a good article. It offers DA a very good defence. But I disagree with it.

No one is arguing that the racism faced by the minirities is the same, that the white majority will suffer equally.

But as a non racist I believe that every member of society should receive equal treatment. I do not wish for anyone to be judged by the colour of their skin.

I feel that ANY racist comment, originating from anyone of any race or religion, should be publicly and robustly dealt with. A message should be sent loud and clear that racism will not be tolerated. By anyone.

There are far too many people out there who really do believe that "they" are treated with less favour than their ethnic peers.
Too many daily mail headlines about immigrants stealing our country have made a great many "casual racists" and incidents like this feed them.

People like Diane abbott, darcus howel and marc wadsworth call for equality. So do most white people. We should have it.
And to day that what DA has said this time and in prior statements is anything but racist is wrong.
She should be sacked. As I would hope any white politician would be if s/he said something similarly offensive.

All.this talk of colonisation and slavery etc is all rubbish. She wasn't talking historically. She was talking about England in 2012.
I couldn't use something my ancestors did as defence for a crime. Nor sjould she

thunderbolts ..was the reference to the nurses from Finland or indeed the way Abbot called Cameron and Clegg "Two white posh boys" just her making a political statement on a social level?
Stop making excuses for this racist and condemn it as it is.

I've already said that it's not possible for a black person to be racist against a white person in this society. Racism requires structural oppressive power, which we have in the form of white supremacy, not black supremacy.

What Abbot actually does is point out the dynamics of white racism, e.g. the divide and rule tactics of colonialism, and that's why so many people get in a froth about her.

Think most people are in a froth about her because she's an ignorant racist MP.
And once more I couldn't disagree more with your personal definition of racism.

thunder, yes you have already said this, it was racist and incorrect when you first said it and it continues to be now. racism can be applied to any race by any race. Continuing with your racist bile does not make you any more right. All people like Abbott are doing is trying to divide people into them and us based on their colour. Racism does not need power or a majority. There are more straight black people than white homosexuals, does that mean a white homosexual cannot be discriminatory against a straight black person? No of course not.
Abbott has made several deep seated racist comments before she should be fired as anyone else would if she wants to be treated equally (lets face it the comment saying Finns should not be employed as nurses was both racist to Finns, but also to ethnic minorities as she assumed that they could not be considered Finnish and that all finns had blonde hair and blue eyes).
It is so sad that people are spitting on Stephen lawrences grave by not only justifying racism, but using racism itself as a means to justify it.

You are spectacularly missing the point thunderbolts and the view you hold about racism being one sided as an entitlement is outdated.
DA has attacked a race of people and has attacked individuals within that race/colour.
How's that explained in context of her privileged summation of colonialism in Britain today?
Personally my family has been blessed as a mixed race modern family and she insults my families intelligence and harms the cohesion in communities across the country.

It's not my "personal" definition, it's the definition that comes from the anti-racist and civil rights movements. You know, the people who actually fight white racism and make a difference.

This "waaah black people can be racist too" is astonishing to see. People don't appear to even understand the basic mechanics and dynamics of racism and white supremacy.

"People don't understand"? What an arrogant statement.
It's fairly obvious in this thread that there is one poster who might just be getting it wrong and is 'Not understanding' that DA is and was a racist harming racial harmony in a country that is trying to do everything to make that happen.

Why is it racist to say someone is black?

Is it not also racist to call. People white then?

Or blonde/auburn etc