She deserves Prison

[shalaa]

here
Can't believe this woman just sat there rolled a fag as this man murdered her baby right in front of her. Don't care how 'scared' she said she was you would do something if this happened. Would rather it happened to me then anything happen to my little boy. She deserves to go to jail.

The only good reading in this article is at the end - Bone took ill in court during proceedings.

Nothing trivial I hope.

Andrea Bone, he added, struck him as a highly manipulative person who was prepared to tell lies to cover up the actions or inaction of herself and of McClure.

He said: "She attempted to manipulate us, the witnesses and the accused, McClure, in order to minimise her role in the shocking circumstances which led to the death of Nicole."

from one of the bbc articles.

doormat my post was aimed at you, we posted at the same time.

I don't think you can necessarily accept the court reporting as absolute truth of what happened - presumably tiredemma the bit you just mentioned was the prosecution's side of things.

Oh I'm not defending this woman - it's utterly horrific but I do think it's easy for some women to pass judgement along the lines of "I would never allow that to happen" and my point is, sorry but you just don't know what years of abuse could do to a person.

I know that katierocket
it is just so sad

I meant my post wasn't aimed at you - sorry.
It is indeed very very sad.

katie, you are right, how can anyone tell what abuse can do to someone? I would buy that argument had she been trapped in the relationship for many years, but she hadnt, she had been with him for five months and showed no signs of any mental illness previously to her daughters death.

My comments only ever referred to this case, i would never try to make a sweeping generalisation regarding women in abusive relationships.

doormat - with regards to your 5.58 post - you weren't suffering from mental health problems though we you??? How do you know what you would have done given her circumstances?

HQQ No I wasnt suffering mh issues
was depressed though and self esteem had gone

Two years ago a neighbour smothered her 7 year old daughter and then tried to commit suicide by jumping from a roadbridge (she failed.)

I'm recounting this story as it illustarates how difficult it often is to fully understand abusive relationships.

The mother who is in her twenties has schizophrenia. The daughter was autistic and the father (the mother told me) was violent. The little girl seemed to have a close and loving relationship with her mother, they were always together and off to the park, river and I'd see them sitting in the communal gardens making daisy chains in the summer. The mother told me that she no longer lived with the father as he 'upset' the daughter and was verbally and physically abusive towards her (the mother.)

A week before the little girl was killed the father came to our block and I saw him carrying his daughter towards the car, the child was kicking and screaming and the mother was crying and trying to pull her away from him. He gave up and drove off alone and then the police arrived.

When we (the neighbours) saw a bodybag being carried out of the flat, we all assumed that the father had killed either the mother or the child. We were so shocked to find out that it was the mother who had killed.

We had all been so angry that the father had tried to forcibly take the girl away, but looking back, he maybe knew, or suspected what would tragically happen.

Nothing to do with this case, of course, but illustrates how all is often not what it seems.

OK, fair enough emma, I was just trying to make the point that I know some women are treated no better than animals and their own behaviour can become unrecognisable. Perhaps that's not relevant in this case.

Also, I saw the father and daughter out together and they seemed to have a lovely relationship too.

sorry katie, i didnt mean for that to come across harshly if it did. I really didnt want you to think that i had a complete narrowmindedness about it.

sorry if it came out wrong.

Barlinnie for the bastard who killed that baby! People are working on it, believe me.

Remember the 'Vampire Killer'? The one who said he was hearing Akasha from 'The Queen of the Damned' and she told him to butcher his childhood friend to death? He tried to plead insanity, but he'd made painstaking efforts to clean up after his crime, lied about how it happened, lied to police numerous times, even dragged the body some distance into a wood and buried him. Not exactly the actions of an insane person.

So the judge sent him to Barlinnie.

He hanged himself last year.

Doormat, you'd be surprised. Studies of people in the most inhumane situations show that the instinct to protect your children can sometimes be overwhelmed by the instinct for self preservation. In the west we very rarely find ourselves in such situations by being a situation where your core sense of self is wiped out is exactly where it occurs. It is not an excuse, but a reason. And it's an extreme one at that. (So extreme I'm thinking of the Nazi camps as an example) Their is unfortunately enough evidence around to compare certain psycopathlogies and try to discern whether the person is 'mad or bad' as it were, but it's still very tricky.

but being a situation...I mean