Please will you kindly support and advise me, as I try to help a friend sort out his home?

[EatingTheElephantInChunks]

Yesterday I started to try to help a friend sort out his home. If I tell you that it took me nearly 3 hours to clear a space on the bathroom floor about 3ft x 4ft, you will probably understand how things are. Today I did a little better. In about 2 hours I cleared another space the same size, which meant I could open a cupboard. Two shelves were almost empty, so I was able to clean those and use them for storage. I will carry on next time with the other 2 shelves and continue clearing the bathroom floor.

It was very satisfying to get rid of a whole binbag of rubbish yesterday and a half bag today, plus a bag and a half of recycling, and a small bag of confidential waste to shred. There is a folding storage crate of things to keep so far, but I'll go through that again to see if I've missed anything that should be thrown out or recycled.

My friend has got into this situation after many years of serious illness and close bereavements, has no family left and few friends, certainly not really close ones. He has been at the stage for several years where he doesn't have visitors. He needs many repairs and much decorating doing, and is getting to the stage where carers visiting would be helpful. I am hoping to get him to the stage where that will be possible. He is such a nice guy, and it's a shame that life has gradually got smaller and smaller for him over the years. It must be terribly lonely.

I feel honoured that he has trusted me with the truth of how things are. I can't talk to anyone IRL as I know it's essential to protect his privacy, and I have changed my username in case anyone makes the connections. I could do with some mumsnet wisdom and support! I have never felt such a sense of achievement over a bit of floorspace 3ft x 4ft, but equally the enormity of the task hit me.

COPYRIGHT NOTICE
The author - writing under the pseudonym EatingTheElephantInChunks - claims and owns the copyright of all her posts dated on and after 14th August 2018 as her intellectual property and as a moral right and which are all her own individual and original work. Reproduction in whole or part or any other use is strictly prohibited without her prior written permission.

[Edited by MNHQ at posters request]

If he’s feeling very cold in his room, that secondary glazing film is actually quite good, particularly with thermal curtain liners.

Wow. I've just sat and read this thread from start to finish - absolutely engrossed - and I'm just so moved by your generosity of time and spirit. Well done, OP, for making such a big difference to your friend's life.

So glad its still going well and that he was able to enjoy a nice Christmas xx

I'm another name changer checking back in. What a beautiful update. Ellie you have really given your friend some quality of life in a way they didn't have it before. That's a wonderful thing.

Those TV shows are not real - they'll have a whole team of people and/or sometimes they don't even do the bits of the room that the camera can't see! It's like looking at house ads on Rightmove and feeling depressed when your own living room is covered in laundry and lego.

Hello everyone. Sorry for the radio silence since my last post. Not much progress to report, life having got in the way with family, illness, weather and so on.

Thank you so much to pps old and new for your kind interest, encouragement, tips and reassurances. I read every one and they always give me food for thought, spur me on or cause a smile or chuckle.

We have had a holiday with our friend, which despite the flooded, gale force challenges of the stormy weather, we all enjoyed. It certainly blew a few cobwebs away.

Being away from home for the week has had a big impact on our friend. Despite the weather, we all found it very hard to leave our little rural seaside idyll, closer to the elements, with the big skies and the sights, sounds and smells of the sea, the increased light, and the wild open views, and return to normal life, but our friend especially so. He seemed much happier and relaxed while we were there, and really enjoyed making the most of the space and facilities which most people can take for granted. Since coming home, he has been very down and has talked about 'hating' his home and the condition of it, and called it 'a lost cause'. I can't help feeling responsible for this, because in taking him away, it has given him a different perspective, which might be only temporary, but has made things harder for him just now. It was meant to be all positive - a break, respite, companionship and company, the recharging of batteries, some fun. Perhaps naively, maybe foolishly, even stupidly, I didn't realise how it would feel for him, coming back. He really wanted to have the holiday, and he still says how much he enjoyed it and is glad he went. Yet I feel responsible for, in trying to make things better and in one way achieving that, at the same time also making things worse. As you will know, I have always wanted and intended to do my best to carry on trying to help improve things. Now, however, the pressure has increased to do more and to prove to him that home is not a lost cause.

Any wise words - probably most useful from those who have read the full thread - very welcome.

Oh Ele, I really feel for you. The thing is that we all get post holiday blues. Where we stay is often nicer and tidier than home because we're only there for a short time. May be explaining that the way he feels is pretty normal even if your house isn't crowded with things, we all like our holiday worlds. Can you get him to reframe it, to think that the holiday has shown him what is achievable. That he can help himself get there with your help and that you have achieved so much already. Remind him where things were in Xmas 2018 and how far you've come. Perhaps says that you can't accept defeat now, that you've done too much to give up! Hopefully the negative feelings will lessen, but use his love of that free and clear space to remind him that letting go of things lightens your load both literally and mentally and that he can do it, yes there will be hard work to get there but it is possible. Maybe get him to write down what he led about the holiday house, how it made him feel and put that on a wall to spur himself on towards the goal of a comfortable uncrowded home. Taking him on holiday wasn't the wrong thing at all, you all needed that change of scenery, it may have made returning harder but we can't go through life not doing the happy stuff just because we have to come back to the tough stuff.

I don’t like the way you are blaming yourself for him feeling bad about coming home. Don’t berate yourself for doing something nice!

It sounds like the holiday helped him see the problem with fresh eyes. The progress you have made clearly shows what is possible! It’s a big project, not a quick one.
Maybe he can focus on the parts of the holiday he especially enjoyed that he wants in his own home.

It's good to hear from you.

I think with this the worst bit is the kitchen. I think maybe paying some clearance people at the very least to take the rotten appliances out for you will make a huge inroad into a lot of it

Hello Nellie! How lovely to hear that you all enjoyed a holiday.

Don't take on responsibility for negative emotions. Try to turn it back on itself - now he is willing to embrace change more, perhaps the time is now to tackle some of the harder things, to throw away more to get that minimal feeling of space and light.

Perhaps the time is now to get some extra hands in to help?

I second the advice about the kitchen and the skip! Could he come to stay at your house for a long weekend (or go to stay elsewhere, with another friend?) while you have a clear run at chucking and cleaning, with a few people to help out?

Honestly, I'd love to help! Bet an anonymous nobody-knows-him-so-wouldn't-judge MN posse could be mobilised. (Now, cleaning my own house is much less enticing, and lord knows there are enough tidying and organisational projects to do that I'm ignoring, but that's different!)

So far, you have conquered bathroom and stairs, made progress in the living room and have a usable bedroom - is that about right? If those areas are staying clean, then that's good. If not, then it is time for a cleaner because you can't do it all and he shouldn't depend on you to do so, even if it is from kindness that you're offering, you need to protect yourself too.

Trunk up! You just need a plan, and I bet you can make one with him, even if it means pushing the comfort zone a little bit more.

Hello Ele, lovely to see you again! I have been reading this thread and cheering you on.

I've been mulling over your last post and thinking over personal experience and that of close friends and relatives, and some of the reading I've done. These are a few observations from my experience - they may be helpful to you, they may not, but I'm sharing them in the hope that they might be

The process that a person with hoarding tendencies has to go through to effect long-term change in themselves, their surroundings or both, involves some or all of the following, not necessarily in this order:

• acknowledge the reality and magnitude of their situation - see that there is a lot of stuff! (see Marie Kondo: get all items of a category out together)
• take responsibility for the situation (yes, life happens - for people I know, traumatic events, bereavements, family history and upbringing, lack of time, other demands have all played their parts - ultimately, they have to acknowledge that this is their situation, they are responsible for their belongings, and they are responsible for bringing about change if that is what they want to do)
• decide on whether they actually want to change, and what this will actually look like (MK: forming a vision of what you want things to be after you have been through the process)
• take sustained action towards that change (this might start with asking for help, but they then have to be continuously involved in the process, even if it is in baby steps)
• learning or relearning how to start dealing with possessions (MK: specific step-by-step actions), how to edit belongings (MK: does it spark joy?), how to let things go (MK: thanking and releasing)

So much of hanging on to things is related to fear: either you are actively keeping items for this reason ("I am worried about running out of things to do, so I have plenty of lovely craft materials", "I have lost many people, and I fear forgetting them or what we used to do together, so I have all these mementoes"). Or sometimes you are aware that by starting to sort through your space, you will come across things which will bring up negative emotions - activities you meant to do but didn't, reminders of people or jobs or relationships you've lost, evidence that you are indeed prone to procrastination and sometimes you have sabotaged yourself, guilt about sending more to landfill - and this is very uncomfortable, so you put the whole thing off. And this fear then spreads to even throwing small things away, or sorting out a tiny little group of papers - what if I throw away something important?

One of the key stages in the process, therefore, is of learning that it is safe (and, indeed, a positive thing) to let things go: not just on an intellectual level, but a deep-down, emotional level. And this starts with the person with hoarding tendencies making a conscious decision to throw something out, reframing it as a step towards space and clarity, cheering themselves on and observing that nothing bad has, in fact, happened as a result. Again, this is the wisdom of Marie Kondo's approach: you start with big, bulky things which have less sentimental value (although for me, clothes are FAR more emotionally-loaded than sheets and other household komono...) and gradually work up to the most sentimental items - so you are retraining the brain as you go.

It might be that even this is too much: the key is for the person with hoarding tendencies to identify one tiny little thing which they can see has no value (a used tissue, food several years out of date, a broken biro) and the clear 'right place' (recycling/bin) for it to go. And as they put it there, to cheer themselves on, and to observe that it is all right to do so. In this process, they have scanned what they have, identified something which doesn't need to be there, decided how to get rid of it, thrown it away, congratulated themselves (getting positive chemicals from throwing something away rather than keeping it) - and shown themselves that they can bring about change in their environment. These are the skills they need to develop to tackle their belongings.

Once they have found that throwing obvious rubbish out is ok, and they are still safe, it is then easier to move on to the next step, e.g. newspapers (but there might be an interesting article!) or catalogues (valuable social history!), and so on.

Sorry, missing bit there:

Once they have found that throwing obvious rubbish out is ok (and have got into the habit of doing it), and they are still safe, it is then easier to move on to the next step, e.g. newspapers (but there might be an interesting article!) or catalogues (valuable social history!), and so on.

Then the next stage might be to tackle the items which have no emotional meaning, but which are tricky to get rid of, for whatever reason - this might be bulky goods, or things which are clearly useful to the right person (but who is that right person?), or things which could be recycled - but perhaps not locally.

(Some might say that this stuff should just go - i.e. to the tip - and that approach does have merits. But it is much easier for some people to let things go if they can see that they will be useful elsewhere, or they may be hanging on to things precisely because they don't want them to end up in landfill - and if we are working towards bringing about long-term change in thought processes, behaviours and environment, plus keeping that idea of emotional safety in mind, and there is capacity to get things to the right place, then it might be better to rehome rather than dump.)

Final chunk...

Going alongside this is the idea of maintenance and tidying; people have to learn how to tidy (MK again!) and also what they need to do to maintain spaces. If they find areas are cluttering up once clear, then it is a sign that things have not yet found their correct home, or that it is too difficult to put them away. The person whose possessions they are needs to work out the best way of storing them.

Supporting someone with hoarding tendencies can be incredibly difficult, for a whole host of reasons - it is frustrating, it is draining, it is emotionally hard work, it is slow, it's really hard when you are thinking "you've got way too much stuff, most of this is rubbish, you can't see what you've got anyway, why don't you just clear up/throw things away. it's getting destroyed, it's money down the drain, why are you taking three hours to get rid of two newspapers...". I think the hardest aspect of all might be the fact that no-one else can do that person's work for them: we can support, make tea, encourage, take things away, clean... but if the person is to change, they must change for themselves. We cannot do that part of the work for them.

Hello Ele, how are you doing? Hope you're able to support your friend at the moment, from the appropriate distance 🙂 and that you and your family have managed to stay well.

Do not feel bad or guilty because nothing was done earlier.

In 2010 I tried to help a friend, I offered to take 3 computer monitors to council tip. She refused saying they would come in handy for someone. They were huge like a 1960 television. Flat screens were coming in.
Those monitors are still in her spare bedroom!
They must be determined to see it through before it can change.

NoSquirrels I'll do your housework if you'll do mine?
I hope you are well Nellie, and your friend. I hope that the holiday has firmly planted the seed of what could be, so he can see a way forward and help to achieve it.

I think suggestions of a cleaner (for maintaining the areas you already tackled) and arranging removal of the old appliances is a good idea.

Many retailers offer removal of old appliances when purchasing new ones; could this be an option for your friend? Or could he access support with this through a social fund (I know these are few and far between now, but with his health needs I'd hope there might at least be help to get a working cooker?). Some charity shops sell safety-checked second hand appliances for very reasonable prices too.

Hi all (this is my first post!)

I sat and read this entire thread last night it's so beautifully written and strangely gripping! I would love to see an update. I'm guessing not much has happened recently due to covid 19?

A huge and long overdue hello to posters old, and a very warm welcome to posters new.

Well, it has been life, interrupted for us all, hasn't it? I 'certainly wasn't expecting that', as they say, when I last posted four months ago now. I will reply to pps some more when I can, but I just wanted to post a quick update for any stoic, kind souls amazingly still with me or even wanting to join me, approaching two years on.

Yes, I am still here, or rather, still there. As pps will have deduced, the work on my friend's house has been on hold because of the Covid-19 shielding and wider restrictions. My efforts have been focussed on supporting my friend emotionally, (still much needed), and practically in terms of making sure he has supplies, access to some of his interests and an improved garden so that he can sit out, as well as keeping my own home fires burning of course in these very difficult times.

But I do have a bit of an announcement to make. Because things have moved on a little, and I have managed to find a way of working to hopefully keep all parties safe and well, I have upped tools again, and....I HAVE FINALLY STARTED ON THE DREADED KITCHEN!!!

What took you so long, I hear you say...

Lovely to hear from you and congratulations on starting on the kitchen!
I just wanted to say, please be super careful with old appliances - if the fridge or freezer have been broken for a while, and contain old food, opening them could be very hazardous due to the bacterial or mould growth. You may need to get them safely disposed of without opening them.

Great to hear you're ok Ele. Wow you have breached the kitchen, good luck! (It auto-corrected to good lick first, hmm maybe not 🤣🤣)

Hi Ele, so good to hear your update. Well done on everything you are doing.

Best of luck in the kitchen!

Having watched and applauded at a distance from a start can I ask.... what have you decided for the kitchen appliances? Abandon or try to restore?

You are amazing keeping this up to help your friend. Hope the kitchen contains many contributions to the gin fund in the depths

Thank you so much, pps!

Three attempts so far.

The highlights: Pleased to report £2.40 excavated for The Gin Fund! Even more importantly, (?), I have tunnelled from the doorway in to the kitchen (adjoins the hall) to the back door, creating ten large sacks of recycling, two small bags of food waste and three and a half large sacks of rubbish. I haven't quite hit floor level from the doorway, past the freezer, cooker, fridge and end of the table, but nearly there. It's easily passable now for me to the back door, and I have actually hit floor level there for several square feet and revealing the lovely old tiles. I sprayed some disinfectant down and tonight I'm going to clear the cobwebs from the back door and actually open it to let in some fresh air. I seem to be back in 2014 there, so perhaps that hasn't been possible for about 6 years. I've got the ceiling light and a lamp working, and the cooker - small and large electric ovens, plus a 4 ring gas hob - seems to be working, except for the grill. The electric kettle works and half of the 4-slice toaster. Everything will need a deep clean, of course, and probably a new toaster and kettle eventually, but we're on the way now, I hope.

The 'lowlights' (?): Moths flying around my head and actually landing on me, and spotting - and squashing - their larvae. Spiders, spiders and more spiders, of a variety of sizes, many with huge bellies of eggs. The worst point was when one got into my glove, dropping 'something wet' on my wrist - yuck! At one point I realised with shock that I had forgotten to tuck my trousers into my socks. Well-mannered Barry from the staircase would not approve of that sort of behaviour from the glove interloper, oh no. I couldn't quite have opened the fridge and freezer yet, even if I'd wanted to, which of course I don't really! I'm pondering still, especially following the health warning from pp. Even to have a peak to see what, if anything, is inside, I would need to get the door into the rest of the house closed and the back door wide open for fresh air to be circulating. I am already wearing a good quality face mask at all times and gloves - I've got through about 6 pairs already.

So, with a slightly aching back, and my socks firmly pulled up like I'm wearing plus fours and off for a jolly game of golf in the dark, onwards and upwards...