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Higher education

Talk to other parents whose children are preparing for university on our Higher Education forum.

Students full return to campus

507 replies

DoNotBringLulu · 13/04/2021 17:43

This came up on my Facebook feed:

www.theguardian.com/education/2021/apr/13/university-campuses-in-england-will-not-reopen-until-mid-may

If this is true, Boris et al have some explaining to do.

OP posts:
TheMerrickBoy · 17/04/2021 17:34

@mumsneedwine

Did it occur to anyone that the reason they might not be doing the work was because a) they can't as IT is useless or (b) their mental health is rubbish. I really hope someone has checked on those young people. If because they are lazy then kick them out, but if because this year has been tough then maybe offer them the chance to meet others to talk it through. I find it hard to believe any student this year didn't want to meet people on their course in person. Yes they couldn't but now they can. One tutor at DDs Uni has booked outside at Spoons and has 100 students coming in 2 blocks to meet each other. The students are so excited. Humans !!!!
How does that work with rule of 6/two households, the two blocks of 50 students? I know couples getting married who can't do this!
mumsneedwine · 17/04/2021 17:50

Pub garden - it's massive apparently. In groups of 6 on the benches. And he has a PA system. Games on tables. Quiz. And getting to know you section. He is known to be slightly eccentric but students seem to adore him. One of my ex students is going and she is so excited as it's the first time she'll have seen anyone on her course in person.

mumsneedwine · 17/04/2021 17:52

Sorry but it was only mentioned that these students were just lazy and couldn't be bothered to do the work. Good to know they are checked on.

mumsneedwine · 17/04/2021 17:52

And you can kick people out for failing exams (tends to go with lazy and not doing the work).

DelBocaVista · 17/04/2021 17:55

@mumsneedwine

And you can kick people out for failing exams (tends to go with lazy and not doing the work).
Again, not so clear cut. At my university if you fail you get an opportunity to resubmit and if you fail outright you can resit the module.

We can't just kick people out.

ListeningQuietly · 17/04/2021 17:55

My child went back to campus today.
It appears that the course leaders have found ways to classify a lot of the term as "practicals"
so they will be having a good time for the next two months.

TheMerrickBoy · 17/04/2021 17:59

@mumsneedwine

Pub garden - it's massive apparently. In groups of 6 on the benches. And he has a PA system. Games on tables. Quiz. And getting to know you section. He is known to be slightly eccentric but students seem to adore him. One of my ex students is going and she is so excited as it's the first time she'll have seen anyone on her course in person.
Well that sounds lovely - I can't see our uni funding that, but great that it can happen!

Nobody said 'students are lazy' - they said this is a thing that's happening.

And no, you can't just kick people out for failing. Not until they fail time and time again or don't do the resit. Even then they can probably repeat the year if they want to.

Etulosba · 17/04/2021 18:28

Well that sounds lovely - I can't see our uni funding that, but great that it can happen!

I was thinking of trying to organise something similar for the start of next term. I reckon the school might actually fund it. Although I can foresee a pile of H&S crap to deal with first.

MeltsAway · 17/04/2021 18:40

Looking for silver linings!

As the pigs fly past ...

I am lucky to teach in a department & a discipline which is competitive and the kids tend to really want to be there. They're all (bar a couple each year) really keen to be there and do stuff. But each year, I'd say it's now up to 10% of students really do not have the coping skills for independent study. They may want to, but they just can't cope.

And an even greater percentage have little appreciation or gratitude for the expertise we have and the amazing mind-opening, horizon-broadening stuff we offer them.

A couple of years ago, I was organising a series of 'employability' sessions - I had extra money & brought in people that could probably give them jobs after graduation. One was quite a significant CEO (in my field) and they had offered to talk to students, ad advise on CVs and job-hunting techniques in the professional field of my discipline. We scheduled it for Wednesday afternoon, for an hour, but the visitor had longer if there was demand.

And how many students turned up? None. It was just embarrassing.

I worry about the next generation of employees, I really do.

TheMerrickBoy · 17/04/2021 18:43

@meltsaway I have colleagues who had to commute in on public transport during the November lockdown to deliver on campus teaching only to find not a single student turned up for the class.

Can't have been their IT on those occasions!

Etulosba · 17/04/2021 18:56

And how many students turned up? None. It was just embarrassing.

Did you offer free food? We have found the promise of pizza and beer guarantees attendance and is well worth the outlay to avoid cringes.

mumsneedwine · 17/04/2021 19:48

Wow. My DD signs up for loads of extra stuff and conferences and it's competitive to get on them. Maybe that's just medicine ? Youngest would turn up to the opening of an envelope at the moment if it meant meeting more people. Sports start next week and she can't wait.
Maybe students will appreciate things more now ?

CoffeeWithCheese · 17/04/2021 20:11

I think with the limited face to face sessions a factor in attendance was that if it was a one hour block of face to face in among a day of online stuff - there's the travel time factor for a lot of students. It's a pain in the arse when uni timetabling has done this for us a couple of times this year (and our staff have quietly mutined and just changed the timetable themselves) as their algorithm allows an hour for us to switch from home mode into campus mode - and we have a few of us with 2 hour commutes.

Thankfully at least my department tried to "block" face to face times so if you were timetabled on campus it was at least for a morning or a day (ish) to reduce the lunacy down a bit. Still limited as hell facilities to go to between sessions (during the lockdown period I had a campus session where I could buy a sandwich but there was nowhere I was able to eat it so I ended up in the car for my lunch - thank god I have a parking permit this year!)

That's probably the biggest thing I'd like clarified for next year - if we're going to be blended - are we going to follow that pattern again at least?

This year I think I last saw someone on my course physically in December and that's only because they teach my child in an extra curricular thing!

Badbadbunny · 17/04/2021 20:19

@CoffeeWithCheese

I think with the limited face to face sessions a factor in attendance was that if it was a one hour block of face to face in among a day of online stuff - there's the travel time factor for a lot of students. It's a pain in the arse when uni timetabling has done this for us a couple of times this year (and our staff have quietly mutined and just changed the timetable themselves) as their algorithm allows an hour for us to switch from home mode into campus mode - and we have a few of us with 2 hour commutes.

Thankfully at least my department tried to "block" face to face times so if you were timetabled on campus it was at least for a morning or a day (ish) to reduce the lunacy down a bit. Still limited as hell facilities to go to between sessions (during the lockdown period I had a campus session where I could buy a sandwich but there was nowhere I was able to eat it so I ended up in the car for my lunch - thank god I have a parking permit this year!)

That's probably the biggest thing I'd like clarified for next year - if we're going to be blended - are we going to follow that pattern again at least?

This year I think I last saw someone on my course physically in December and that's only because they teach my child in an extra curricular thing!

Why weren't you allowed into your usual office at Uni? Working in offices has been allowed throughout as long as social distancing was in place.
DelBocaVista · 17/04/2021 20:23

Why weren't you allowed into your usual office at Uni? Working in offices has been allowed throughout as long as social distancing was in place.

I've not been allowed to work in my office since November and I had to 'book' my time on campus. My building has been locked since then.

I'm still only allowed on campus if I have a specific reason

mumsneedwine · 17/04/2021 21:11

@DelBocaVista ah so Uni buildings were locked 😊

DelBocaVista · 17/04/2021 21:19

[quote mumsneedwine]@DelBocaVista ah so Uni buildings were locked 😊[/quote]
Not all of them and not all academic year 🙄

I said my building was locked. I was teaching on campus until the end of November.
My faculty doesn't run any of the courses that were allowed on campus so they shut the building.

The library never closed and some buildings have been open for weeks.

This constant bashing of academics and trying to catch us out is getting incredibly tiresome.

mumsneedwine · 17/04/2021 21:22

I was told I was a liar saying Unis had been locked. And then you told us your building had been. It was not the only one I know, but I was told I was talking crap 🤷‍♀️

DelBocaVista · 17/04/2021 21:36

@mumsneedwine

I was told I was a liar saying Unis had been locked. And then you told us your building had been. It was not the only one I know, but I was told I was talking crap 🤷‍♀️
You said Unis just shut the doors and locked everyone out in October, well before the government told them too.

Which is bullshit - that did not happen.

I said my building was locked from End of November ( actually it was from 9th December. My last day on campus was the end of November)
You have interpreted that as all universities and all buildings. I never said that.

At my institution the library remained open and those buildings where practical teaching and research takes place remained open.

How does that translate as all universities locking everyone out from October? I was teaching 2 days a week on campus in October!!!

mumsneedwine · 17/04/2021 21:53

SOME Unis shut locked doors in October. SOME Unis have given no f2f to anyone. Not all but some. Many. As can be seen from responses on here. And I was told no Unis had locked their doors and I was a liar for saying any had ???
My friends DD was locked in her halls for 4 days, they even cable tied the fire doors. So SOME Unis have behaved badly.

titchy · 17/04/2021 21:56

@mumsneedwine

SOME Unis shut locked doors in October. SOME Unis have given no f2f to anyone. Not all but some. Many. As can be seen from responses on here. And I was told no Unis had locked their doors and I was a liar for saying any had ??? My friends DD was locked in her halls for 4 days, they even cable tied the fire doors. So SOME Unis have behaved badly.
I agree with you there actually - the ones that physically locked students in their halls of residence behaved in the most abhorrent manner. Despicable.
DelBocaVista · 17/04/2021 22:11

@mumsneedwine

SOME Unis shut locked doors in October. SOME Unis have given no f2f to anyone. Not all but some. Many. As can be seen from responses on here. And I was told no Unis had locked their doors and I was a liar for saying any had ??? My friends DD was locked in her halls for 4 days, they even cable tied the fire doors. So SOME Unis have behaved badly.

my building was locked once we were told by the government to move online. At no point has my entire university been locked or closed.

I haven't denied that some universities haven't been great but you just seem determined to tar all universities with the same brush. Any example of good practice is pulled apart and you seem to be constantly looking for holes in what we're saying.

This last year has been the most difficult of my career and that includes the years when I was working full time and completing my PhD. I've worked 60 hour weeks while juggling homeschooling, lost weeks of annual leave and haven't had a proper break since feb 2020. I've gone above and beyond for all of my students at the expense of my physical and mental health.

I have read thread after thread slagging off academics and I've tried to offer advice and a university perspective where I can. It has been a crap year but there are lots of us who are trying to make it work the best we can.

It's time for me to bow out of this thread as it is not doing my mental health any good.

mumsneedwine · 18/04/2021 09:04

I am sorry that the academics have taken this personally as I have said time and again that the people on here have worked so hard and done their best. And I am sorry that all Unis are getting bad press when it seems like it is only just some.
And I keep saying that we know it's not the academic staffs fault, it's the VCs, UCU and the garbled information from the government.
From now on let's hope all Unis can follow the good examples staff have managed on here. And nothing is fully on line from September.

TheMerrickBoy · 18/04/2021 09:07

Lots of us were not allowed to use offices because they are down narrow one-way corridors, or because they are small and shared with other people, not very far apart. We had to book limited other spaces on campus to work there.

Like @DelBocaVista I am frustrated by this thread. This year, I've spent ££££ on office equipment and faster wifi, I've worked through most weekends, I've replied in supportive detail to the hundreds of student emails that come in, and about one in 100 will even bother to acknowledge my response. I've worked so hard to pivot online and on campus as a moments' notice, and back again. I've been stressed and I've missed my kids. I've offered endless extra support sessions, which they don't turn up to. I've taught to a black blank screen and tried to keep the energy levels up even though I can't see anyone and they won't speak.

While I was teaching on campus which was apparently central to students' wellbeing, numbers were appalling. When tiers came in, we were flooded with emails from students saying they were going home to their families for their mental health, and please could we go online to support them in that. When lockdown happened, even more just upped and left, again citing their mental health in most cases. We kept on offering on campus teaching. Even when it was the only thing we were leaving the house for.

And through all this, all we hear is how shit we are. Everything we say gets this AHA response, everything we do was wrong, every instance of students not engaging is because we failed to care enough - they apparently have 0 agency in anything. Unworkable and ill-informed suggestions of what we could do better are presented like gotchas and when we explain why they won't work that's further evidence of how little we care and how we apparently want to stay at home for the sake of it.

Newgirls · 18/04/2021 09:20

The frustration is because of the variety - some unis have been good and others not so. It has varied within unis from dept to dept. Let’s hope it’s better for all next year 🙏

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