Why would you not vaccinate?

[lizzlebizzle33]

Has anybody decided against vaccinations for their children? If so what were your reasons?

Many thousands of parents have experienced their children regressing into autism after vaccination. They can't all be wrong. However, it's not the only cause. This debate is as old as vaccination itself. It's not just the Wakefield scandal that scared parents. During the 70's and 80's parents blamed the DPT for their children's retardation. One of the reasons they developed the acellular pertussis vaccine was to replace the whole cell vaccine found in DPT as it was highly reactogenic, but it's proved not to be as protective against whooping cough as the whole cell.
They simply don't know the answer yet. This article may further explain it's causes, environmental factors play a role to some extent, as well as genetics..
www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3068755/

they can’t all be wrong
Why not? Numbers of people believing something doesn’t make them right. We have believed many things over history that have been proven to be wrong.

Saying autism followed the vaccines therefore they caused it is the same as saying that having a second birthday party causes autism or buying new shoes causes autism. The vaccines came first that’s all.

academic.oup.com/cid/article/48/4/456/284219
I have a link too - must I be right?

I won't waste my time with anything written by ''Offit the Profit'' thanks. He thinks kids can take ..what was it?.. 10,000 vaccines at once? Like to see him go first...

I grew up surrounded by medical research scientists (my father and his colleagues). Everyone vaccinated their children, sometimes with vaccines they had themselves worked on developing. I think if anyone knew the facts, they did.

Right whereas your paper, about PRENATAL immune response, is completely valid in this discussion about baby vaccines

“Many thousands of parents have experienced their children regressing into autism after vaccination. They can't all be wrong.”

I am afraid they can. It’s the old causation/correlation distinction.

I am afraid they can. It’s the old causation/correlation distinction

Also Bias Recall

Oh, I like bias recall. Haven’t heard that before.

It makes me annoyed to see the vaccine/autism correlation discussed without any mention of the autism/acetaminophen correlations being discussed!

Looking at vactruth website their latest theory is chiari malformation. Apparently kids with autism often have chiari malformations, but in their round about thinking this must be caused by vaccines, therefore must be a vaccine injury, rather than child has a congenital defect which causes autism.

So parents from all corners of the world, who don't know each other, and didn't have access to the internet from 30 years ago, are all making it up? I guess it's that ''coincidence'' bug again huh? I think not..

No one said ‘making it up’. But the fact that they believe something untrue does not make it truer.

But I would be interested to read the ORIGINAL claims made by numerous separate families (which in medical terms needs to be over 100s really) all over the world BEFORE any ‘papers’ were published pretending there is a link. To be so convinced that these families drew their conclusions completely separately I presume you have access to these?

Here's one example. It's a docu from 1982. ..

Others are personal friends and other families I've made contact with over the years during my support efforts with children of many ages with vaccine damage. From children as young as 3 years to people who are now adults. Unless you really care about this subject your not going to look any deeper than the Daily Mail, skelpticalraptor and articles written by the like of Paul Offit who have millions of dollars invested in their products and business portfolio. The CDC is nothing but a revolving door of corruption along with many vaccine patents.. if you trust them then that's up to you. Keep shooting them up that's your choice.
These families with injured children were never anti-vaxxers.. they vaccinated their children on time.. every time.. they trusted their doctors.

Im not a DM hater, but they did more to spread the autism/mmr myth than any other paper at the time.

Does this go far back enough for you? www.informedparent.co.uk/archive-literaturebooks-2/

Archives from 1900-1949 maybe? www.informedparent.co.uk/archive-literaturebooks-2-2/

Oh come off nbroots , there were always antivaxxers back to the jenner days.

Parents of vaccine damaged children were not anti-vaxxers Bruffin. They vaccinated their kids!

Im not saying they were antivaxxers, but it is human nature to want to nlame something when our child are taken ill. Recall bias is very real and if you look at the historys of the children in the wakefield trial, they werent fine one day and regressed within days of the vaccine. The parents had gone to the doctors with concerns before the vaccines and sometimes had none of them regressed within days of mmr.

Ok you win.. for 200 years it's all down to recall bias and Andrew Wakefield

We were talking about the mmr causing autism. You’ve linked to a completely unrelated jab, not linked to autism, and to books from a time before autism was even defined.

Even if you are right (note I haven’t said you must be wrong, just that you have no evidence), surely you can see that making up nonsense like ‘thousands of unrelated parents said these things 30 years ago’ does not help your cause.

This thread has taken an amusing turn.

Vaccine damage is recallbiaa, we have all agreed allergies in children aren’t increasing, oh, and the reason there are more childhood cancers is because children are actually alive due to having vaccines.

Good stuff!

Now, go and look at some proper research behind the above and come back when you have re-discovered common sense.

Nobody said allergies arnt increasing, but that is more likely due to weaning practices changing.

And no nbroots its not just down to recall bias and wakefield. But its never as simple as fine one day. The were worried about dtp causing sids in Japan. They stopped using dtp for a few months then moved it to 2 years. Guess what,no more reports of vaccine related SIDs because they now couldnt blame dtp but children were still dying of SIDs. Some idiot then decided that because the were no more vaccine related reports that SIDs didnt exist in Japan anymore. We are still seeing that myth reported regularly.

Going back to Japan again fears grew about MMR so they stopped using MMR , but cases of autism still carried on rising.

They looked at dtp vaccine damage and found that majority of these children had a genetic mutation on SC1na. These children would have been affected by anything that causes fever. So the diseases will be just as harmful or more.
My family have that mutation in a mild form back long before vaccines ie at least 1912. There is a good chance that one of our descendents will have Dravets, so instead of wasting money having to disprove another dodgy vaccine theory, it should be spent on preventing this mutation affecting children.
How much money has been wasted on mmr/thermisal/ autism theories which could have been spent on research into autism or better and improved vaccines

Avtuallly, the exposure to microbes theory is the one receivingost research in terms of allergies but the story is incomplete. In the early years, something is causing the immune system to slightly malfunction.

Interestingly, diesel fumes haven’t been ruled out. Raw milk has been considered (as being helpful). All things that slightly tweak the early and novice immune reactions.

I am not sure how many vaccinations a baby receives in the first year of life but I would be amazed if this wasn’t a factor, too. It would be absurd to suggest there wasn’t an impact on the developing immune system. But there is no research here as it is impossible to find a control group of unvaccinated children.

Interestingly, the same subtle immune changes causing allergies also is probably behind the increase in autoimmune disorders.

It might be the trade off of our polluted, clean lives without risk off certain infectious diseases is malfunctioning immune systems and lifelong chronic ill health.