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General election 2024

Voting for Reform

652 replies

Behappyandbehave · 04/06/2024 13:34

Would this be such a bad idea? I hate labour and tories. But I don't know enough about Reform.

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Opallfleur2026 · 04/06/2024 19:01

BluntFatball · 04/06/2024 18:32

This is where you will struggle to get people to believe this.

Anyone who has interacted with care homes or the NHS has watched it getting worse and worse. The economy is also worse.

Not everyone is sold that importing more and more people to cope with the increased demand of more and more people, which then causes more demand, so you import more and more people is a viable long term solution to the economy.

Like I said in other threads you are welcome to try to get my sister in law (who doesn't have gcses) and whose online work earns her less than minimum wage interested in care work.

She doesn't come out of her room most days to eat meals with her mum so good luck with that. Her mum spends one hour trying to get her to come down when we come over. Her mum says she isn't ready for a job.

If she has to care for your nan, I am afraid your nan would have to wait. Most economically inactive people are probably in a worse state mentally than my SIL. Plus my SIL doesn't need to work, her mum pays for all her bills and her food and she never needs to move out. Doesnt claim benefits either. Lots of economically inactive brits in same situation. You can go down on bended knee to ask them to work in care homes but they will just tell you to buzz off.

MuseKira · 04/06/2024 19:02

ichundich · 04/06/2024 18:47

No, because Rishi and Gordon Brown became PM after a leadership contest. They were elected as party leaders by the members of their party. Unlike Farage.

Nope, there was no contest for Brown - no one else wanted to stand against him.

Sunak lost the leadership election but then became leader because no one else wanted to stand against him once Truss resigned.

StripedPiggy · 04/06/2024 19:04

Username947531 · 04/06/2024 16:13

I'll be voting Reform. Immigration has had a huge and detrimental effect on where I live. It's very easy to be a pro immigration Liberal when you live in a middle class white enclave.

I won’t be voting for Reform, but I agree with this.

And I speak as a recovering liberal who lives in a rural village which is about as much of a middle class white enclave as they come.

BluntFatball · 04/06/2024 19:04

Opallfleur2026 · 04/06/2024 19:01

Like I said in other threads you are welcome to try to get my sister in law (who doesn't have gcses) and whose online work earns her less than minimum wage interested in care work.

She doesn't come out of her room most days to eat meals with her mum so good luck with that. Her mum spends one hour trying to get her to come down when we come over. Her mum says she isn't ready for a job.

If she has to care for your nan, I am afraid your nan would have to wait. Most economically inactive people are probably in a worse state mentally than my SIL. Plus my SIL doesn't need to work, her mum pays for all her bills and her food and she never needs to move out. Doesnt claim benefits either. Lots of economically inactive brits in same situation. You can go down on bended knee to ask them to work in care homes but they will just tell you to buzz off.

Edited

Ypu only appear to be looking at the problem from one direction. Surely it depends how many people are here as to whether that will be a problem?

A much lower population will not need as many care workers.

Rainydayinlondon · 04/06/2024 19:04

DistinguishedSocialCommentator · 04/06/2024 14:28

I would not vote for them even if someone paid by 17 million quid

Even if you knew they probably wouldn’t get in? !
that amount of money could help a lot of people

ThePoetsWife · 04/06/2024 19:07

@BluntFatball

A much lower population will not need as many care workers

But the British population is ageing - a lot and those moving here are much younger and more able to look after our ageing family members

Opallfleur2026 · 04/06/2024 19:08

caringcarer · 04/06/2024 18:03

Reform UK wants far less immigration but I believe they make an exception for care workers because they recognise we can't do without care worker immigrants. That's the whole point of managed immigration we let in those we need but not those we don't need.

Health and social care accoubt for 75% of work visas which are the majority of visas.

Nigel is talking shit, if he is going to admit care workers and nhs staff that is a big chunk. And unless he wants university insolvencies, the foreign students are coming plus universities are main engine of growth in the regions.

If you don't want so many foreign students you probably have to reform student finance. Graduate tax or means tested student loans. Probably the former.

Goldusty · 04/06/2024 19:12

HannibalHeyes · 04/06/2024 17:53

This pretty much sums them up.

What are you, 3 years old?!

Opallfleur2026 · 04/06/2024 19:12

ThePoetsWife · 04/06/2024 19:07

@BluntFatball

A much lower population will not need as many care workers

But the British population is ageing - a lot and those moving here are much younger and more able to look after our ageing family members

Plus healthy and willing..

Why would a gen z living with family work for a care home? Many parents nowadays let their kids stay well into their late 20s..if there is no rent to pay there is less pressure to earn an income and they can pursue what they are interested in (unless they were interested in care work)

Immigrants come here because what they earn here could possibly translate to real options for their family back home. There is no upside for a young brit to be working in a care home if they had a bit of family support

MrsSkylerWhite · 04/06/2024 19:13

For me, a big, fat NO with bells on.

You must vote for the party which has your values, though.

Goldusty · 04/06/2024 19:14

For me it’s a big fat YES with louder bells on!

TinklySnail · 04/06/2024 19:14

HannibalHeyes · 04/06/2024 19:00

So you're going to vote for the people who caused the immigration crisis, in order to deal with the immigration crisis.

Seems sensible...

In all fairness, Reform didn’t cause any migration crisis.

Opallfleur2026 · 04/06/2024 19:14

BluntFatball · 04/06/2024 19:04

Ypu only appear to be looking at the problem from one direction. Surely it depends how many people are here as to whether that will be a problem?

A much lower population will not need as many care workers.

The reason why they are called the baby boomers is cos they are quite a large cohort aka baby boom after the war. They live quite long..

Not really a fan of leaving them to fend for themselves so we need people to look after them.

Higglings · 04/06/2024 19:15

@KarenOH

You're the big haha

Higglings · 04/06/2024 19:16

I seriously fear for this country if we don't control immigration.

user1471453601 · 04/06/2024 19:17

@BluntFatball immigrants who come here to work do take some of the lower paid work (in care homes and similar) so it's unlikely that the few highly paid immigrants out weigh them. I'd say that, may be, why GDP has fallen? I'm taking your word for it that it has, I've not done any personal research into this.

on the whole, public debate is not helped by name calling (although I defend it being done in private, we all have to blow off steam occasionally). A reasoned discussion of what should be done to reduce this country's reliance on cheap foreign Labour needs to happen. Stopping immigration, without a plan, would be a disaster for our (already on their knees)care homes and NHS

I'd say, why not have a proper skill strategy that starts to plan for what skills we need for our future and then puts into action plans to realise that strategy (a Labour party promise) and also pay carers and the like £2:00 over the living wage (a Lib Dem promise)?

That way, we wouldn't be, as we are now, leaching workers, who may well be needed in their home countries, to come here to fill in the gaps out current population either cannot fill, because they don't have the required skills, or will not fill, because the salaries are too low.

HannibalHeyes · 04/06/2024 19:17

TinklySnail · 04/06/2024 19:14

In all fairness, Reform didn’t cause any migration crisis.

Erm, just who is in charge of Reform Ltd?

SuePreemly · 04/06/2024 19:18

I wouldn't vote for Farage. Ever. Personally I fell like he's a self interested, lying, two faced little man who could be potentially very, very dangerous in stirring up far right movements.

His rhetoric is not only racist and bigoted but it's usually wrong, and it uses the fear playbook.

Goldusty · 04/06/2024 19:20

Go Nige!

Opallfleur2026 · 04/06/2024 19:21

Higglings · 04/06/2024 19:16

I seriously fear for this country if we don't control immigration.

As we restricted care home workers from bringing their family members, applications for social care visas have fallen 75%

Foresee care home crisis. No spaces, more bed blocking, good luck to those who need a hospital bed. Will probably have to wait 72 hours in a corridor for a bed

Its not like Singapore or HK those countries are actually in Asia so its cheaper for them to fly home to visit family plus in Singapore if you are a domestic helper, you get room and board and food and medical bills all paid for so your salary can be for your family. In the uk you have to pay private rent and if you can't have your family with you (and flights are expensive), there is like zero point.

TinklySnail · 04/06/2024 19:21

HannibalHeyes · 04/06/2024 19:17

Erm, just who is in charge of Reform Ltd?

It is not their policies or laws that have contributed to migration. Only Labour and conservatives governments.

HannibalHeyes · 04/06/2024 19:23

TinklySnail · 04/06/2024 19:21

It is not their policies or laws that have contributed to migration. Only Labour and conservatives governments.

They campaigned for Brexit. Without them it would never have happened.

So, yes, they are entirely responsible...

ichundich · 04/06/2024 19:29

MuseKira · 04/06/2024 19:02

Nope, there was no contest for Brown - no one else wanted to stand against him.

Sunak lost the leadership election but then became leader because no one else wanted to stand against him once Truss resigned.

They had enough nominations. That's not the same as just appointing someone as leader.

TinklySnail · 04/06/2024 19:34

HannibalHeyes · 04/06/2024 19:23

They campaigned for Brexit. Without them it would never have happened.

So, yes, they are entirely responsible...

They were not responsible for the end result. They were not the party that oversaw the car crash

HannibalHeyes · 04/06/2024 19:39

TinklySnail · 04/06/2024 19:34

They were not responsible for the end result. They were not the party that oversaw the car crash

This was pretty much the only possible result once they'd won. For all his talk of "Norway" and Boris' ridiculous claims that we'd obviously still have all the same rights as before. It's just that people were too stupid to see didn't bother to look at the inevitable outcome. Don't forget, it was all "Project Fear"...