Why women deserve less - how are these books allowed?

[123ROLO]

I got an add on YouTube for this book

www.amazon.com/Women-Deserve-Less-Myron-Gaines/dp/B0BVDSBZYK

Listed as a no1 best seller. I think its found its way into not being hatespeech by a loophole of having a disclaimer saying "we are not telling you to hate women". But then goes on to list reasons to hate women.

What sad sad fragile men. I take some comfort that these mens lives must be so deeply unfulfilled if they feel the need to fill their minds with such hatred.

Yeah, no. Nothing of substance there. You complain of a straw man but jump straight to ad hominem.

Ah yes women are to blame for the entitlement of men. Because that's what the ideology boils down to.

Your complete disregard for the impact of hateful rhetoric on the mental health of boys and young men is indicative of self-centeredness and lack of empathy. It isn't ad hominem to state an observable truth.

It's amusing to see you complain about my points lacking substance when you've done nothing so far but ask nonsensical questions and dismiss other people's perspectives.

Indeed, @Bippetyboppityboob, it's familiar and tedious.

I'd say it's pretty entitled of you to believe that only women's issues deserve attention and support, as well as dismiss the perspectives of millions of boys and men. But hey, if it weren't for women like you, then Myron probably wouldn't have been able to write an 86-page bestseller.

I don't believe that at all, but I'm sick of blaming women for the ideologies of tate and the like. Many boys are drawn into it as they don't get the attention they think they deserve from women they deem to be worthy of them- that's not the fault of women. The hateful rhetoric around men stems from the fact that violence against women by men is an epidemic and the fact we still live in an unequal society and the injustice of that. If men are choosing to be bitter towards women who rightly are angry about this rather than the men who commit these crimes and act this way to enforce these equalities then that's shit, no?

Of course boys and young men should be supported, but my point is the ire shouldn't be directed at women. Men have to help men overcome many of these problems, not just blame women as they won't have sex with them, or because they're rightly wary. Men are also the problem and the solution as well as women.

Societal issues are a human issue, not a gender issue. I care for men and boys struggling with mental health, and feeling 'lost' in the world as much as I care for women going through the same.

I just can't feel sympathy for men that feel depressed and low because women wanting respect and equality has made life tougher and less fun for them.

The main message of feminism is to encourage women to lead fulfilling lives with freedom to pursue a lifestyle they want, and have autonomy to do with their body and mind as they please and to have a voice and presence in society that is equally respected as men.

The messages of the 'manosphere' is to disregard all of the above, and to consider a women's freedom a direct attack on masculinity, as part of being a man is being the dominant and in charge person.

Women are put at risk from these views.

The likes of Myron and his 'best selling book' are not helping the men who are suffering, they are just helping men who are bitter and hate women and want their feelings validated and normalised.

I just can't feel sympathy for men that feel depressed and low because women wanting respect and equality has made life tougher and less fun for them.

Wonderfully summarised.

Most men aren't bitter at women who are angry about gendered violence and inequalities. They're sick of the people who blame and vilify them for social wrongs that they have nothing to do with. You also seem to fundamentally misunderstand why boys are drawn to Tate -- most aren't angry that their crush hasn't noticed them, but they are angry about being constantly told that they are potential rapists and abusers online and in the classroom. An Australian school even forced all boys to publicly apologize to all girls for the "crimes of their gender" during an assembly. Despite justified parental outrage, the administrators who organized such a farce were neither fired nor disciplined. How much more of such nonsense is happening in schools without the awareness of parents?

I would very much like to see a society where men and women have equal access to opportunities and a significantly reduced risk of violence at home or on the street. I hope in my lifetime to see a society where women and girls feel safe enough to walk in a city alone at night. We won't get there by alienating and dehumanizing boys and men.

You do realise that women who don’t have children and don’t want to have them are also impacted by the gender pat gap? Why not incentivise dads to stay at home more or take time off more for their children by lowering their pay? You say find feminism controversial but don’t explain why. Given your concerns I genuinely implore you to read the female eunuch by germaine Greer which begins with a discussion about how the move away from a traditional extended family setting to a nuclear one helped to trap women in the home.

Do you honestly believe teenage boys are angry ‘about being constantly told that they are potential rapists and abusers online and in the classroom.’? I sincerely doubt it’s crossed most of their minds. The Australian example you have given sounds very extreme, would love to see a link to any report of it if you can provide it. Otherwise I’m going to have to disregard it as a load of nonsense. Even if men are angry about being branded rapists, etc. why is their anger aimed at women? Surely it should be aimed at other men? Isn’t the fact that this isn’t the case yet another example of how deeply ingrained misogyny is?

I have every sympathy for women wanting respect and equality, and I daresay most men today do too. I understand your issues with Myron Gaines, though as I said previously, censorship is likely counterproductive.

The only disagreement I have would be regarding the 'manosphere,' which is not a monolith. On the extreme end, you have the likes of Tate and Gaines, but there are plenty of moderates who call attention to men's issues while respecting feminism and the continued importance of women's rights. You're welcome to look up Richard Reeves, Warren Farrell, and The Tin Men Blog if you're so inclined.

I think I've said my piece and inflamed plenty of tempers, so I'll call it a night. Thank you for engaging in the discussion with sincerity and courtesy.

Why do you think books should be allowed by anyone, or disallowed? Who are the people who you think should be able to decide? Fwiw I agree with you.

Because "free speech," OP. As long as a book isn't directly inciting violence, people can say what they want, even if it's stupid or offensive.

The trans fiasco should alert us to the dangers of censorship - where do you draw the line?

Here is the Australian case. There are also studies showing that teachers grade boys more harshly, perceive them as less capable, and punish them more severely. I am also speaking from the personal experience of a young man who has witnessed such bias firsthand in grade school, college, and medical school (a graduate degree in the US), which you have not.

Of course, men are angry at men who rape. Harsh punishments for rapists are a universally popular stance in all major political parties, and male hatred for rapists should be readily apparent in the brutal fate of any man imprisoned for sexual abuse at the hands of his fellow inmates. Men are also justifiably angry at people who accuse them of being potential rapists and treat them as such, whether they be men or women. Law-abiding men walk the streets facing heightened scrutiny from police officers and the general public as potential criminals, and fathers in public with their daughters have literally been pepper-sprayed or had the police called on them by strangers who assumed they were sexual predators.

You seem to have a deeply skewed and unrealistic view of what life is like for boys and men. It might be a shock for you to find that it's not a life of privilege and deferential treatment (at least for the billions of us who aren't billionaires). I'm going to hop off this thread, but hopefully, you can read the sources and expand your perspective.

@sabriellirael
I won't bother defending Andrew Tate. If the evidence is overwhelmingly incriminating and he is convicted, then I hope he rots in prison. That said, I think there is understandable skepticism about the fairness of the Romanian justice system, even among legal scholars.

But that's exactly why Tate chose to live in Romania. He said it was so corrupt he could do whatever he liked without consequence. Because he could bribe himself out of any trouble.

If corruption exists, which it does, let us all play [...] I like living in a society where my money, influence, and power means I'm not below or beholden to any of these bull sh*t laws."

Not only do they have a load of tapes of him saying he sleeps with women so he can break them down and get them into web-camming and prostitution, they also found a number of passports of different nationalities that he claimed he can use to flee any country.

If I'm wrong and England wants me in prison, I can fly with a Nigerian or American, or English, or Polish, or Estonian passport... I have bank accounts in 19 countries."

This is why he's imprisoned during the investigation. Because they have no way of being sure he won't flee the jurisdiction. When extensions have been required, the investigators go to court to get permission from the judge. Just as they do in this country for certain offences.

If he decided to live in the country specifically because he liked the idea of abusing the legal system there, he really can't complain how he gets treated now he's in caught up in it.

Christ, I can't believe some women actually think like this! Men can stay at home and parent just as well as women!

Or are you actually a man?

Oh look, reddit's leaking again 🙄

So very few years that women are regarded as even slightly equal. It's going to take a long time to filter down. A very long time,hopefully it does

The Australian school is very much an outlier, you know this or you would have already offered more examples to further your point. Looking at reactions online plenty of women along with men were outraged by this.

My question is where are boys viewing this stuff? Definitely not on mainstream sites. If its in the news then that's a man problem- the news shouldn't filter itself against what's going on in case boys are made to feel whatever way, imagine how girls and women feel reading all of these horrific things that are our reality? Men are to blame not women for that.

I suspect the answer is they go onto forums to seek validation for how they feel toward women and for reassurance that its not their fault no one fancies them its womens fault.

There are many women who are very much apologists for men, even on threads on here where someone outlines something horrific a man has done there will be plenty of women supporting and justifying their behaviour; same in real life. Its simply not true that all women tell boys and men x, y or z.

‘I am also speaking from the personal experience of a young man who has witnessed such bias firsthand in grade school, college, and medical school (a graduate degree in the US), which you have not.’ Translation - the women got better grades than me and now I hate them 😭😭😭
I knew you were American before you started with the hackneyed language of privilege. I have five brothers and many nephews dearest, some of them even live in the US, I have a fairly good idea of their experiences through life. None of them indulge in the whining self pity you do. Men aren’t hard done by my dear. Try dating and getting off the computer every once in a while. You’ll be a lot happier. It’s a really weird thing to have to got on this thread on a website for mothers based in the UK. Hope you manage to get a life soon.

Ach you poor wee lamb. Not to be too outing but one of my sisters in law previously worked for admissions for the Ivy League leading university she and my brother both attended for their undergraduate and post graduate degrees. Am glad you have a relationship with a woman you chose to identify as a nurse, couldn’t possibly have anyone on your arm who matches or, shudder to think, outshine you academically huh? Don’t worry about me baby, I’m highly educated having attended the number one university in my country and achieving every single one of my professional goals, still pretty hot too and never have any problem with the gentlemen. Probably because I’m not weirdly obsessed with trying to shut down discussions on websites half a world away where women get to discuss issues pertaining to them freely. Good luck with resolving your evident hatred of successful women!

Oh my, suddenly you attended the number one university in your country? And you're pretty hot too? And you have a sister-in-law who attended and worked at an "Ivy League leading university" (lol)? Forgive me if I don't believe a word you're saying -- it sounds like you're smoking a bit too much "copium."

It's pretty rude of you to assume that a nurse doesn't count as a "successful woman," or that she cannot match me academically. Nurses fulfill vital roles in patient care that physicians are not trained to replace. Your assumptions tell me more than I need to know about your character. There are plenty of physicians and medical students who choose not to date each other since they work so closely together on a daily basis; it has nothing to do with insecurity about who is more "successful." Their dating decisions, and my own, are none of your business.

Again, it's hilarious that you assume I hate successful women without a shred of evidence. I've had the privilege to be raised by a successful woman, taught by many successful women, and work alongside plenty of more successful women. That's why it's clear to me that you are anything but one.

What do you mean ‘suddenly’? I hadn’t mentioned anything about my academic or professional background until you started droning on. Why would I lie about anything to ‘own’ a no one on the internet posting on a site for mums? Projection much? I mentioned the points I did because they are relevant to points in your previous post when you tried to belittle me and claim I didn’t know what I was talking about. I do.
I didn’t say a nurse wasn’t successful, I just noted that you had chosen to identify her as such when you’ve made a lot out of the fact you are at med school. Your critical analysis skills are very lacking.
Darling I meet insecure men like you every day of life, you have a problem with women. Your tone says it all.