A list of seemingly unbelievable not-rapes (according to the CPS and juries)

[AdamRyan]

Inspired by this news where someone who reported a rape and was told they might have sexsomnia

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-63116989

So these are other notable cases I can think of:

The man who tripped and penetrated someone
www.google.com/amp/s/www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/crime/millionaire-ehsan-abdulaziz-who-said-he-accidentally-tripped-and-penetrated-teen-is-cleared-of-rape-a6774946.html%3famp

The man who got the hotel room muddled up
www.google.com/amp/s/www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1360801/amp/Haydor-Khan-cleared-rape-climbing-wrong-bed.html

The man who thought a girl who was moments before having sex with his friend must also want it with him, even though he was so tired he had to go to bed while his friend was getting viagra
www.irishmirror.ie/news/world-news/black-student-cleared-night-time-7951757

The man who thinks asking a friend "can I have a go [on her]?" is enough consent www.google.com/amp/s/thesecretbarrister.com/2016/10/14/10-myths-busted-about-the-ched-evans-case/amp/

I'm so tired of it.

What changes do you want to see?

Ones that deliver justice.

Which would be?

@AdamRyan I am so sorry sweetheart. It makes me so bloody angry and sick with rage! Your story is so similiar to mine with soldiers and mine was years ago when I was a daft wee 15 year old girl. I'm 54 now and nothing has changed . I got no justice and neither did you . Absolutely shocking. Something has to be done about this decriminalisation of rape and sexual assaults of women and girls. So bloody angry. I am so sorry to all you younger women on here that it hasn't got better .

Rapists going to prison for a very long time. Effective punishment. Effective deterrent. Effective protection for society, not rapists.

Do you think justice is adequately served in rape cases @Hateam?

If you read the whole thread I put lots of suggestions a couple of years ago

No.

I agree with long sentences.
I'm not sure they would act as a deterence though. When men rape I doubt they're thinking about sentence length.
The main problem is secuing a conviction.

It's a zombie thread so I didn't read it all.

I'll find them then comment later.

So you agree that things need to change @Hateam?

Yes.
I don't know what that change is.

I'm very reluctant to move away from:
Trial by jury
Innocent until proven guilty
Guilt proved beyond reasonable doubt

I don't see how a new crime of reckless penetrative would help. I think it would actually introduce a gray area.

What would you change the reasonable belief clause to?
Surely the fundamental legal point of law, did she consent , would still be a matter of yes or no?

I don't see that new laws are needed just better ways to prosecute under the current ones. But I can't think of any.

Most rapes happen between two people who know each, in private and in the exact same situations that consensual sex happens. The problem, is consent is intangible, it is very difficult to conclusively prove days later with no witnesses.

I'm not that bothered about the rights of rapists. I am very concerned about the rights of women and children to live free from male VAWG.

No system is perfect, but there's got to be a better system than the one we have.

OK
Are you a man by any chance?

One significant change would be the men's reputation/future/career/family having no impact in their defence and more importantly in their sentencing.

I'm not bothered about the rights of rapists either.

What is the better system?

Yes.

I've have responded in good faith to other posts.
Please respond in good faith to mine.

I am. It's relevant though because I don't think most men truly appreciate the level of sexual assault and rape that happens to women. They think because they are a good guy, all men are like that. And they think because of the media and society that being "falsely accused" is 1) quite likely and 2) ruins lives. Neither of which are true.

At the moment 98.6 of reported rapes don't result in a conviction. That shows the system is overwhelmingly stacked in favour of rapists. Unfortunately when I hear people saying it can't be changed, it sounds to me like they are saying women being raped is acceptable.

There are other ways, it just requires men to be a bit more open minded and less worried about "false allegations"

OK
I agree with all you have said there.

I don't view myself as a good guy. I try to be, it's for others to judge me.

There are many who have been raped ( my sister, my wife) who have never received justice.

The system delivers a shockingly level of convictions.

I'm not convinced the changes you have suggested will work though.

People much cleverer than me are working that out.

Ok, how about murderers? People who defraud elderly people out of their life savings? People who abuse and starve their children? Are rapists worse, or do you want to see the public lose their right to trial by their peers and innocence until proven guilty?

If there’s a better system, I am all ears.

Who?

Are they let off as regularly as rapists?

The nature of the cases are completely different.

If somebody made a complaint of rape, that happened 5 years ago, in the context of a fairly messy relationship (lots of abusive messages flying back and forth between them), how would you go about proving it?

Whereas fraud etc is easier - you have bank statements there in black & white (for example)