Ways that men "check out " of family life

[Whatwouldscullydo]

Inspired by another thread where its apparently unreasonable to expect someone to stay and help on Xmas day and wanting them to do so is controlling, it got me thinking of all the ways in which partners , very often male partners, check out of family life

We see many threads on this also

We have- hobbies. The ones that seemingly involve alot of time and/or expense. Often involve smoking or drinking or getting dirty and smelly so inevitably upon return showers etc are needed before they can hug or pick.up.a child.

Luxury poos. Never is it ok to wait for u. You must wait for them by any means necessary. Strange how even bodily functions can be used to assert dominance or unavailability.

The " I've been at work all day" excuse. We all know the house cleans itself. The dinner miraculously appears in the slow cooker and the kids can walk several miles to school by themselves even in reception.

The " we can't afford the time.off work " excuse. Usually followed by a day off fir them to do their hobby.

The " you have the car" clause. Because buses don't exist.. nor do trains . I mean how did i manage before I got the car?

The falling asleep on the sofa method. This is a particularly frustrating one because fir some they honestly believe their presence in the house is enough to be considered to be contributing.

And last but not least the " I don't know where anything goes/how to get there/ I don't know anyone / the kids prefer u to do it" method used to excuse no one putting washing away or getting home work.done while you are working.

Feel free to add any more

@FissionMailed I couldn’t agree more with you.

As the mother of two daughters it really worries me that they might end up in a situation like the ones described on here. They (and everyone) deserve so much better.

I actually do think the finance might have a lot to do with it. I’ve never depended on DH for income and I’ve never felt I owed him anything.

It’s another part of the puzzle at least and independent income gives you choices.

As the mother of two daughters it really worries me that they might end up in a situation like the ones described on here. They (and everyone) deserve so much better.

I don't want to derail too much or labour any points etc etc.
Bit one of the things I dread for my daughters future is her coming to me and telling me,
"He's a good man... but..."
Whatever that 'But' leads to invariably proves they're not good men at all. Now maybe I've been on MN too much or I've had bad experiences with men, but it's opened my eyes a LOT to stuff I wouldn't wish for anyone.

@ThisIsStartingToBoreMeh

This is why mn keeps me sane. I'm about to end things with dp and sleeping in the day is within the top 5 reasons why. Because next time he does it I will smash his face in so they can't happen.

Yep xp used to have 2 hr fucking nap every afternoon, even when the kids were babies and needed constant supervision. Even if I'd been up all fucking night then in work all day. He wasn't ill, he just gloated about how great a daily nap is. I could have throttled him.

Having spent too much time on here, I honestly think if anything happened to their dad is just stay single. It seems like about a 19 to 1 chance of a dud.

Doesn’t bode well for those following us.

The financial aspect is interesting. I'm a sahm and financially dependent on dh. This works ok...I'm happy in my relationship, I don't want to leave. I'm reasonably happy to do the lion's share of housework and childcare. My dc are school age so in all honesty, my life isn't particularly difficult. I think being financially independent is a good thing though but I am horrified when I see women who are working full time and taking on all household duties like a 1950s housewife.

I'll never forget growing up my mum had a friend who had four children...her husband was made redundant and she had to go back to work and still do absolutely everything at home. Her husband spent years sitting on the sofa doing fuck all financially or practically. My mum was horrified. She had relatively easy life with my dad, he was the breadwinner and she was a sahm but he pitched in with cooking and childcare and we always had a cleaning lady and an ironing lady.

I'm massively aware that if and when I get a job, I'll still probably end up doing the vast majority of house/child stuff.

As the mother of two daughters it really worries me that they might end up in a situation like the ones described on here. They (and everyone) deserve so much better.

This is another important reason for me to ltb

• walking over washing on the stairs or whatever needs to go up or down
• constant phone use in front of the children
• not bothering to teach children his first language and now it’s too late
• buying eg a bike but not doing any of the hard graft on teaching them to use it
• “kids tea” is a visit to pizza express
• not setting discipline or boundaries
• not doing their homework / spellings

Good luck @pastypirate

@SouthLondon1 you've reminded me about the stepping over things. I do this thing with the dc that I put things that need to go in the car etc right in front of the front door - blocking it so you have to move it to open the door. My kids who are boyh quite young twigged instantly told just put the fucking bag in the car!! I watched dp once pick up the bag and move it out of his way 3 times in a row. When I said why couldn't you put it in the car he replied 'but I don't know'
For fucking fucks sake.

I remember when dh cleaned out the car...he took all the crap out of it and dumped it in the hallway.

@RJnomore1

Good luck *@pastypirate*

Thank you x

It seems really inadequate but it’s genuinely meant x

@RJnomore1

Having spent too much time on here, I honestly think if anything happened to their dad is just stay single. It seems like about a 19 to 1 chance of a dud.

Doesn’t bode well for those following us.

I've been single several years now. It's just me and my daughter living our lives together. Every choice I make is shaped by her primarily and myself secondarily. If there were someone else in the mix, some one demanding attention etc, that'd change the dynamic and I'm not willing for that to happen.

Our life now is 8/10, we could do with a bit more money, but other than that it's fine. Someone would have to make my life 10/10 perfect for me to even think about making them my partner... And that's u likely given everyone has baggage and drama and such

@FissionMailed

If your partner cares so little about you that they won't clean up after themselves when you've asked them too, what's the point of them?

I think that’s the wrong question.

That your [male] partner won’t clean up after themselves (being so entitled they think it isn’t their job to clean up after themselves) so that they have added to your mental load the need to to ask them to clean up themselves, what’s the point of them?

It is rare - if non-existent- imo that a man in a relationship spends a significant amount of time reminding women to clean up after themselves, and to equally share the domestic burdens.

Just a thought

I agree with you @Twocrabs30
"Mental load" could be pictured as physical load on scales.

There's 50 rocks that needs sharing, every rock the man avoids gets added to the women's load... before you know it the man's side has the rocks of work and hobbies.. the woman's side has the rocks of child care, work, cleaning the bath, cleaning the kitchen, cleaning the oven, hoovering, making tea, changing beds, entertaining children, school run so on and so on...

@FissionMailed

And if you think relationship counselling will solve the problem of dh emptying his pockets out on to the dining table and leaving his shoes cables and papers and half empty coffee cups all over the house, then frankly I think you are the one that needs counselling!

Everytime he does something like this, imagine he's saying "Fuck you"
Cause that's what he's doing.

Dumps his pockets, CBA to tidy up.. 'fuck you, you do it.'
Leaving shit around the house, 'fuck you, you tidy them up'

Because that's what he's doing. He's saying his time is more important than yours and the things that he bears no mind to aren't worthy of his concerns, but your time and mind aren't as important as his.

Keep a little diary of how many times he's said fuck you in a week and then decide that if he was really saying it to your face, if you'd still think he was "good"

Bloody Brilliant Advice!

My DH is pretty good. I think this is because we have both been married before and know what we will and won’t put up with. We’ve also both been the breadwinner at different times in our life together.

He is currently the breadwinner and I do a lot more (but not all) of the housework.

As good as he is, he still managed to come up with an absolute changer yesterday.

We were walking around the shops and he said ‘Did we organise any presents for [his adult children]?’

The answer is ‘no, we didn’t’. But my response to him was ‘I don’t know, did we?’

Apparently, we are going to send them e-gift cards because we have finally agreed with me that sending things late by courier is a waste of money that could so easily be avoided by planning ahead.

I’m so glad we have finally agreed that. 🙄

‘Changer’ is ‘clanger’.

Bloody autocorrect!

@Comedycook

My husband has no idea what our son has for Christmas and I’ve wrapped them all too

Jus realised that dh has no idea what presents our DC have for Christmas. They are all wrapped (by me) and under the tree. He has no idea until they open them on Christmas day. Same for birthdays...he has no input into present buying.

Fgs - don't you discuss what you're going to buy your children? Mine is all grown-up now but this was a conversation we had every birthday and Christmas. I can't recall which one of us would then actually go out and buy it- we might have done it together- but that's not particularly relevant.

but then he would complain I wasn’t putting in enough effort to choose thoughtful gifts for his family. He had totally just checked out of responsibility for Christmas

In over 30 years I have never bought a birthday or Christmas present for any member of my husband's family. Why would I? He managed to do it before we met. I've no idea if he sends them presents or cards- it's not my problem.

@FissionMailed - I love your rock analogy - very true.

Relationship counselling in my experience was simply a forum for ex to air his supposed ‘grievances’ and for me to be re-abused within the context of what ought to have been a safe space. Counselling won’t address the underlying entitlement and misogyny. These are deeply buried and few - if not, no - Counsellors in a couples session will ever call them out for what it is.

It's all well and good to say 'raise your standards' but in reality there are very very very few genuinely decent, kind, loving, true blue men to choose from. Should we all stay single then?

IMO men are inherently extremely selfish and entitled. They play the game but only for the pay off at the end, nothing really comes from the goodness of their heart.

Socialisation has worked in reverse in this case. His father cooked but that's it. His mother did no housework ever. Which is why dh is used to mess and can function perfectly happily in it!

This is so interesting. I am unusual in that I am much messier than DH by nature and can function in / ignore it until I have time to clear up. DH is like a disease he can't "Just leave it". Our solution ? A cleaner that we pay for but he organises. I will clear up a bit before she ( of course it's a she) comes.

KimikosNightmare yes we do discuss what gifts to buy our son but my husband doesn’t engage. I look online at the options because he insists he doesn’t have time. He will never suggest any choices, he leaves it to me. I’ll probably email him several links saying what do you think and he won’t reply, again because he’s too busy and important. Maybe one or two of the items I picked will go out of stock because he’s taken too long to reply. Then I’ll text him the links and he’ll ignore them again. I’ll have to ask him several times to look and possibly lose my temper because time is passing and I want this done. At some point I may thrust an iPad in front of his face and tell him to look right now. In the end he will respond “yeah looks good”. If I asked him to choose between options he’ll say “whichever you want”. Then I have to order it because he certainly won’t.

So basically I have picked the gifts, chased him for his opinion just for him to say “yeah whatever”, and then still had to buy it myself. It’s not worth the hassle. I might as well just have bought what I picked in the first place and not bothered to tell him. Which is mostly what I do now. It’s the 20 December and he has no idea if our son has any decent gifts to receive in a couple of days but he seems not bothered, he hasn’t asked.

My ex never sorted out anything for his side of the family. I was the one who bought wrote out and sent the cards vouchers etc he wouldn't even sign the damn cards.

It was a cause of many arguments where he'd tell.me hpw much he hated his family and he didn't want to send them anything but then he'd go round his mums and of course then I'd look like the bad guy cos he was making the effort and I wasn't.

and God yes with the " WE" stuff

We got dd into gymnastics
We git dd into X school

Erm.i think u will find its me that filled out the applications, learnt about the admissions process, checked his times and accessibility and took them there and back fir a grand total of 10 years between them. WE didnt do anything